CSM 13 - High Sec Issues/Suggestions/Ideas


(Buoytender Bob) #344

Quite frankly, as an owner and user of all 4 faction Marauders which I have used to run through the epic arc mission chains repeatedly, a class above the existing class ship just doesn’t make sense. Ditto for an idea of a medal. However, the idea of rethinking Faction rewards/mechanics is a good one. With the sneak changes they made awhile ago, keeping and maintaining 5+ standing with all 4 takes far more work and the rewards for doing that just aren’t there. Some ideas:
Offering lower faction taxes based on your higher standings
Offering faction equipment at lower cost
Offering special faction equipment only available through high standings
Mechanics change that offer faster/stronger faction navy/police response when you are in the area
Ship skins that are not tradable and are lost if you drop below a certain faction standing
Epic arc competition stripes ( similar to kill stripes/marks)
Specialized small ship ( cruiser and lower) BPCs which are not transferable and could be used to push the envelope on higher level missions you easily complete in a Marauder

However, I still feel that ONE of the things they need to do in HS is to take the abysal random site generator and tweek it so that it can spawn both new mission and exploration sites, both of which could introduce new gameplay mechanics or doctrine. Course, CCP ( and the current CSM) is on record stating that both those aspects of HS are fine, thinking that FW and AS is what all the HS players were asking for over the years. Dotlan and population graphs tell a completely different story, of course.

(Mingja) #345

To be fair, special ships were pretty much the low hanging fruit. While I do believe that they could be made the best for Lv 4’s without breaking the game, it’s not necessarily a refined idea.

I know that I would like Marauders to have more Space for Ammo (an ammo/salvage bay) as an example as well as the option to remote accept/decline missions. I would also like them to have more warpspeed in general (the reason the mach is considered a champion is because of agility and warpspeed).

I didn’t really want to propose something that’s op DPS/Tankwise, but there is room for more convenient ships that do get better the higher your standing is. The goal was to put a carrot on a stick (if you will) for Highsec PvE’ers they could aim for.

I have thought about some of your ideas myself, but ultimately scratched them because they would mess with other stuff. Lower taxes => grinding becomes mandatory for traders.

Faction equipment at a lower cost => will affect FactionWar

Special faction equipment => well, that could work, but is similar to “special ships” and might also devalue other faction items (or do you think there is a niche for faction items that hasn’t been filled yet?)

Skins however => good one.

I do think that any change should not affect too much other stuff. I am fine with “unique” rewards (like the Epic Arcs provide), but it should not devalue other stuff.

(Brisc Rubal) #346

This one is definitely going on my list. I’ve been running highsec missions lately as a way to get some experience on highsec issues for folks, and this is my biggest pet peeve.

(Buoytender Bob) #347

In regards to special faction items, a BS/Marauder specific warp speed enhancer based on a paint job and ship/pilot locked could be created. Works only in that specic faction’s space (reflects preference by traffic control operators) and doesn’t gut a ships capabilities by having to sacrifice either a defensive or offensive enhancer. Allows faster back and forth from mission sites,especially those several jumps away. Downside, of course, is…Machs already exist. However, it would allow other factions to join the blitzing mission community. I can’t see any other use for it except maybe having some type of transport battleship to go to Jita…just “spitiballing” ideas like you.

(Buoytender Bob) #348

Wait u til you save that damn Damsel in distress for the 400th time…she just never seems to learn to associate with a better class of people.

Seriously though, thanks for at least trying out a style of play so that you have a better grasp of their concerns. Reflects very well on you!

(Brisc Rubal) #349

Four times so far. :slight_smile:

(commander aze) #350

can confirm less of a damsel more of a dumb***

(Geo Eclipse Oksaras) #351

I wish we’d get our old UI back for running missions. Now to go back and salvage, I have to right click and select the mission under that menu since after completing a mission it wants me to set destination, dock, then complete mission.

(Mingja) #352

Yeah, that’s why I forwarded a new class of ships initially. I didn’t want the improvements for every single ship and player that exists to create an achievable goal of some sort because else it would only buff the mach and the mach is easily achieved (does it take more than one injector to fly a reasonable fit?). Something that, in order to get, you have to be really really good with that empire just so you can’t just buy it (I mean, you could still buy it, but if you don’t have the required standing, you can’t fly it).

I’ve also tried to circumvent adding new mechanics so that it doesn’t get too complicated for the devs to work with and found that the “easiest” way would probably be a new line of ships with bonuses tied to the standing. Which I think could be kinda cool too.

Maybe I really should put some time into refining the ships.

My main gripe with missions is that I’ve grinded level 4’s back and forth and then back again and the only merit they had was ISK. Nothing that waits at the end of the line except for 3 BPC’s. BPC’s that aren’t even worth to collect. The time it takes to collect them is better spent on doing yet another mission or two…

Nice to hear that. One more thing on the list of reasons to re-elect Brisc.

(Yiole Gionglao) #353

Aaand, the summit notes are out, and CCP didn’t wanted to talk highsec or PvE so not much was said or done.

So, concerning PvE and highsec, this picture still applies (3 years later)

And our man Brisc Rubal did a whole truckload of…

(Not his fault, if CCP doesn’t wants to talk an issue, the CSM can’t do much about it).

(Brisc Rubal) #354

I’m not going to pretend like there’s a ton in there for highsec, but the war decs stuff was a big deal, and I did mention new missions. There’s other stuff in there if folks want to read it.

(Yiole Gionglao) #355

Yes, i saw that, also the developer saying that rebuilding mission system would take all the teams in CCP for a long while (how low they’ve fall, if they have so little manpower left…), but the point is that CCP is not that much concerned about what’s going on with highsec and PvE. They want to talk about what they’re doing, not about the signs pointing at all the wrong turns taken in the past, and let alone how to address them.

Wardecs are not killing highsec. Lack of PvE made according to PvErs is killing it. I’ve read you’re running missions. Are you challenging yourself to use new fits? To improve performance? To try new weapons systems? To skill different ships? And ENJOY it and keep doing it for two or three years until you run out of ideas on how to make the same missions in a different way?

I mean… you’re a PvP player running PvE stuff to figure why would a guy like you do them. Since you’re no PvEr, you don’t feel the motivations to run them as PvErs do. After all, if you were running missions for the reasons and the ways a mission runner runs them, you would be a mission runner already. When asking why a duck walks like a duck, maybe it’s better to just ask the ducks…

(Brisc Rubal) #356

The burners have been, but even then it’s just a factor of finding a guide on google, fitting the ship the way it says and then running it the way it says. I’ve been running level 4s quite a bit lately and I’m still getting to know all of them. Only rescued the damsel about 5 times so far.

I hoped that the abyssal stuff + removing the suspect timer would help with running those in high sec, but like it says we can’t be sure whether that had anything to do with the spike since it was the same time as the event.

(Yiole Gionglao) #357

Concerning the spike+event, I wouldn’t rule out that it was intentional so someone/s didn’t lose face with direct evidence that the flag thing was stupid. :woman_shrugging:

Where do you hide a leaf? In a pile of leaves…

(Ima Wreckyou) #358

I’m just sad no one mentioned the suggestions that where made in this thread and only went with the super terrible structure ideas. If they do that then it’s obvious what will happen isn’t it? There will be a few powerful corps who specialize on structure removal, simply because it’s the only thing left to do, and the “indi corps” who are as haples as ever will be denied their structures.

So now the discussion is closed again and the next time wardecs get mentioned is in the third decade? And what about that “the numbers would justify removing wardecs and bring a fix later” WTF? How about “later” means never in CCP language, so please don’t!!

(Brisc Rubal) #359

This was our #1 issue and we aren’t going to let it go.

(Ima Wreckyou) #360

Has anyone even considered that the wardecs itself may not be the issues but the tools and visibility around them? Because whatever other system you try to come up with you will never get “fair” and “balanced” fights. It’s like if you wanted to change nullsec in a way that you only get “fair” and “balanced” fights and give the little guy a place to settle in piece there without 200 supper dropping on his head. Probably not going to work without changing the core of the game and is that really something someone wants?

(Brisc Rubal) #361

Well, I said in there that the attacker to defender ratio is never going to be even - attackers will always have the upper hand because they can pick their targets - but that it needs to be more even than it is, because it’s ridiculously uneven right now.

But, frankly, given the impact they’re having on player retention, I’m fine with turning them all over until the whole system can be reworked.

(Buoytender Bob) #362

Thanks for bringing up the mission revamps along with Jin’taan. Also appreciated The Judge asking why we couldn’t utalyze AS programming to generate new content for mission/exploration site runners. NOT encouraged by CCP’s response of a shrug and "too tough; no need " .

Also, don’t nerf HS bounties too much based on the abuse of carriers/supers in NS. The problem is that all the large corps will tend to abuse any system, leaving smaller corps/solos to actually bear the hardest effect from any nerf. Need to rein back the style of gameplay AND ITS SPECIFIC ENVIRONMENT that causes the abuse causing issues in the game. I don’t see any indications in the monthly reports that lead me to believe any HS region is destabilizing EVE in regards to bounties.

(Brisc Rubal) #363

I don’t think highsec missions/bounties are the issue. It’s straight ratting income in supers that is the real issue. Everybody has seen the numbers - it’s flat out nuts.