Current Loot System (PvP)


(P3ps1 Max) #1

Yes those pesky ninja looters.

No not really, I was wondering if there has ever been any talk about the loot mechanic and maybe changes to the current system.

Something I’m surprised the game doesn’t utilize is the redeeming system instead of the current loot found in wrecks. Just like our popular tick mechanic in nullsec (bounties), we could have a loot tick which compiles your kills/death activity in pvp. The system isn’t based on isk but rather activity. Once the tick or time for payout has been reached items will be delivered to player’s redeeming system.

What this would accomplish - loot for all involved on the kill

PVE would remain the same with wrecks/loot.


(Ralph King-Griffin) #2

Some of the most memorable fights I’ve ever had were from palming damsels … that came out wrong.

Swiping… No that sounds worse.

Regardless, no , its not yours until you get it to a station, looting wreckage is a fantastic conflict driver.


(Vaacos) #3

Nope, just because you kill me doesn’t mean you’re entitled to my loot. Dumbest suggestion of 2018…


(Kynami Vaille) #4

If you can’t maintain grid presence long enough to scoop the loot… it didn’t belong to you in the first place.

And some pretty memorable shenanigans come from scooping the loot and running. Like that first set of Blood Raider shipyard kill blueprint drops being killed with the interceptors attempting the ninja loot.


(Salvos Rhoska) #5

This.
I wish this was true of more PvE rewards.
A substantial part of bounty could be split off into drops, rather than raw isk.
The tag system already exists as a basis for that.


(Rosov Aulmais) #6

Will the carrier ratters be happy?


(Salvos Rhoska) #7

Its a relatively trivial matter to loot the wrecks with MTUs or with a salvage/tractor ship alongside.

The tags would therafter have to be transported to a suitable/favorable market, depending on how the tags pay out, meaning there is more “value” moving on-board ships.

In any case, the tag system is currently pretty under-used, but exists as something that can be built upon/diversified.


(Yourmoney Mywallet) #8

Yes, really. Sooo…


(March rabbit) #9

For start ISK bounty and loot are mechanically different things. One is electronic information and other is physical objects. “Ticks” are perfectly logical to reduce network load while sending ISK rewards. But redeeming system for physical items makes no sense. That’s about game lore.

Keeping game lore away looting mechanics adds another layer of player interaction. Not only you kill stuff or die but you compete for loot. That’s why killing wrecks is red while stealing is only yellow.
Removing loot mechanics and replacing it with anything which remove competition for loot not only not needed but is bad for the game.

Another look at the same story: what do you mean with “for all involved on the kill”? It’s easy to see that each participant had different role and weight in the kill. For example: tackler/scanner is the most important while F1 monkey - is just another percent of damage. (The most difficult case - logi pilots, they might never appear on the killmail while sometimes taking all the heavy lifting in the fight). If you want to make fair system for sharing loot you would need to set it up properly to measure every pilot share in the kill. And this task is not solved by all killboards yet.


(Salvos Rhoska) #10

Whats your opinion on moving away from raw, automatic isk rewards to drops?


(Tipa Riot) #11

I’m very much in favor of this, move bounties to tags in the loot. This division between raw ISK and tags could be made based on rat value, so newbies have some room to breath. Missions against empire factions already work that way.


(Eternus8lux8lucis) #12

Its a WOW raid loot mechanic and no. In Eve the idea of stealing and looting wrecks is the principle of piracy that Eve is based upon. Removing that for guaranteed looting is a horrible idea.

You want more of a free for all. And tbh Id suggest all wrecks would appear “blue” in null and WHs making them fully lootable and tractorable for small gangs. Cant hold grid you can lose your bounty payouts, not just ship loot, but both WH “blue” loot as well as more tags or bounty tokens. It would only work coinciding with changes to bounties making them much more item/drop/tag/token based instead of straight isk payouts.


(Bl00dyAngel) #13

You can found an alliance on that idea.
It’s Eve’s sandbox that give you / and us the choice.

Maybe you can find an audiance for this idea.

You bring Fleet’s, kill stuff. Collec the loot, bring the loot to one place. let run you own dragon kill points allà eve over it. voiila.

But bring this as hard codet part of eve? Of course not! It’s against eve basic pillars.


(March rabbit) #14

Well… Some time ago i was ratting in a supercarrier. I would hate this.

Now i’m WHer (not for long as it seems) so i don’t see myself relevant enough to voice my opinion.

Either way:

  • if ISK bounty is replaced by something sellable to player market it will be farmed to death pretty fast and CCP will have really difficult time balancing it
  • if ISK bounty is replaced by tags sellable to NPC (similar to blue loot or ESS tags) then it would not change much as it seems. Instead of “ticks” people will move these tags and sell in batches. Yes, some will be intercepted but i’m sure players will adapt and reduce any risks to minimum.

(Nana Skalski) #15

Ok, with this exception that when you kill someone in High sec, CONCORD confiscates it and returns to owner of the ship. :smirk:


(Salvos Rhoska) #16

A) It could be sellable to players, NPCs, and/or exchangeable to NPCs similar to LP or for a commodity.
The market will regulate the rest.

B) Isk cannot be destroyed by players (except by biomassing). Tags can.


(March rabbit) #17

Whatever is sellable to players need to be used (and destroyed in the process). Take a look at meta modules: they are getting cheaper and cheaper. Years ago looting meta 4 item in mission was a fortune. Now you just don’t loot at all.

Take a look at faction/deadspace modules. With exceptions like invulns they are cheaper than ever. Overfarming.

Pirate battleships? They just got cardioversion. Were in dire need to battle overfarming.

Data sites is an other example. Totally worthless.

LP shops: with exceptions like Sisters of Eve with their Astero/Stratios/probes and launchers or Ore with their drones (?) most LP shops are farmed to ground.

Permanent skins? I don’t event try to sell most of them. Does not worth the effort.

TLDR: replacing ISK with stuff sellable to players need whole new mechanics of usage and destroy to sustain profitability of farmers. And this is another level of complexity.

Tags? Can work. Will not have much effect though.


(Salvos Rhoska) #18

Yes, its another level of complexity, but also a consolidation, leading to simplification.
There are many tags that are currently largely useless and without value.

Tags, being the part of the value of ratting/pvp content per this proposal, can be implemented as sold to NPC buyers, thus systemically fixing their price, as well as allowing the player market to participate interms of delivering them to the specific NPC buyers (as is the case with Overeers Effects currently).

The above, alone, already guarantees the same isk value.

The system can be, however, further diversified, such that tags are valuable, equitable, or exchangeable for some other value such as LP, standing, or direct exchange in sufficient amounts (or with added isk payment) for an advanced commodity.

Surely you can see that potential, or are you more interested in raw isk being paid to your account for nothing other than blowing an NPC up?


(Lady Ayeipsia) #19

I swear I just heard the cries of every Puddlefish screaming out in frustration and pain.

In all honesty, this is a horrible idea. The fight for the loot is half the fun. Take the other night… Sneaking over to a random wreck to steal loot in a crowded system, only to quickly scoop and scoot before they dropped on me. It was fun.

Or the number if times in RvB that we reformed to drop on the field to try to reclaim the loot, many glorious battles to be had there.

Loot is perfect the way it is. Learn to grab it quick!


(Agondray) #20

i think id be fine with that as I salvage anyways but I don’t think speed runner/blitz types would be.