Please stop insulting people for having different opinions about a subject. I flagged the respective posts.
I don’t see the necessity to have a linear progression system. Filaments are tradeable objects, you will be able to go to Jita and buy 20 T2 filaments of your favourite weather. The problem with the current tree model is that using filaments creates more filaments, so the market will be flooded with filaments noone needs. If you activate a filament to enter an abyssal pocket or just enter it out of thin air doesn’t make a huge difference in this case and there will not be any additional value for the data sites dropping them.
You don’t have to have each site drop exactly one filament for the next tier, but on average you shouldn’t get more than one filament per filament you invest. If the average droprate is one per invested filament, the data site loot would have to balance the abyssal deaths. Droprate under 33% would work too ofc.
I ran a lot of L2s on Sisi yesterday. Not many L3s as I’m still figuring out ships and fits to fly those.
The filament drops seem to have some randomness, not just filament drops, drops in general. 1 or 2 of the instances yielded almost no loot. 2 out of 3 pods were completely empty and the remaining pod had the survey thingy and one other thing in it. No mutaplasmids or filaments whatsoever.
The rest of them had pretty steady loot, but seems to me that the drops for L3 Trig filaments dropped in L2 pockets are on the rare side. I ran maybe 10ish L2s and got literally 1 L3 filament, 2 mutaplasmids, and the rest was the otehr stuff.
So the higher you go the harder the RNG. When everyone will be doing these up to lvl 5, I think the lvl 4 and 5 sites will be on the rare and expensive sides.
There is another thing too. I’m doing multiple ships and fits to see how far I can go without using faction modules or bling or mutated modules. Just T2 stuff. And 3 seems to be the cutoff point to me. Granted that I still have some ways to go to match my ships and fits to the weather etc. So I think for a lvl 4 maybe need to just use some faction / deadspace / mutated stuff here and there, while for the level 5s it will be a lot more.
And of course, lvl 4-5 trig sites make you suspect on exit, so now you are flying a more expensive ship and announcing yourself in local saying: Look everyone, I just finished a site and I’m in an expensive ship !
Even if you don’t get popped on your 1st 2-3 sites, since they will know what you are doing you’ll be tracked down and gotten on the subsequent ones.
This is why I think majority of the drops and everything will come from level 3s.
None of which refutes that Trig pocket filament drops should be linear, as 1 filament drop per pocket to the next level.
L1 are sourced from data can exploration.
Buy/source one, and then either run the Trig pocket “escalation” to its end, or sell off the filament you dont want to complete.
Its fking stupid that a Trig pocket would reward more filaments than you used to get into it.
In terms of DEDs, it would be like getting 3 DEDs for the effort/price of one.
Its ridiculous that a Trig pocket should reward more than one 1 filament to the next level, and would utterly wreck the potential of any filament market.
Sorry. You know, I agree with him on this point, that we should not produce more filaments than we consume by doing one abyss ?
Just saying, we don’t know what CCP has in mind, how it will eventually be implemented, what the loot table will look like.
My own point was just that we don’t have all the details to judge if it makes sense or not - though as I said I hope the present loot tables are buffed for test purpose. Maybe the data we got from loot were not enough to make a correct vision of the numbers.
Again, I agree with him. Just, calling this irrational when it’s not done yet, when we are just testing the mechanism, seems very arrogant to me.
Yes, that’s exactly how it currently works. You are relatively likely to find filaments of the same tier, but much less likely to find a higher tier filament in a lower tier site. Actually the same seems to be true for lower tier filaments in higher tier sites.
Good choice to go for a T2 fitting. There is another thread in which we mostly discuss fittings and exchange test results from running the sites. I’ve run many Tier4 and Tier5 in T2 fits on different ships, after losing a couple of blingy fits int he same. It can be done, but has some preconditions: you need good Skills for the Ship you’re flying/weapon system you’re using. The ship needs to fit the type of site. Bring a passive Gila into a Gamma site, good choice. Same Gila into Firestorm, could end badly. Last but not least Tier4 and Tier5 require to fly very vigilant and fight for every little advantage, unlike most other PVE.
The best way is to lose more T2 fit ships in Tier4 and Tier5, analyze, re-ship and do it again. Try something different, try a different ship and so on. I’d say that classic PVE concepts don’t really work in most of the higher tier sites.
Very likely so. Unless CCP decides to change the mechanics again.
Are we speaking droprate per container or per site?
I think the droprate should depend on tier. Data sites filaments are just a helpful construct to get them into the game in some way without magically popping them into our hangars. Good for data site runners, albeit for a short time.
Filament droprate should be
Tier 1 > Tier 2 > Tier 3 > Tier 4 > Tier 5.
We don’t really want people perma-farming Tier 5, so I’d say the droprate in Tier 5 should be lower than 1 per site on average. The same for Tier 4, but it could be a bit higher than for Tier 5. Tier 3 should be 1, Tier 2 and Tier 1 a bit higher.
We have to account for filaments not being for differnt tiers only, but also for different types. In Tier 1 and 2 that might be of little importance, as I’d not be to worried about running Tier 2 Firestorm (Armor Bonus, Thermal Penalty) in a Gila. Just don’t care, I’ll win it. Tier4 and 5 however, that’s not gonna happen.
People who want to perma-farm want specific types of a specific tier. Since 5 different types can drop, it is completely okay to have a droprate close or equal to 1 around the medium difficulty. If you want to run 10 Firestorm Tier 3, you can’t rely on starting with 1 and finding another Firestorm Tier3 in that site. On average you’ll find one filament per site, which will be 4/5 times a Tier 3, 10% Tier2, 10% Tier4. 4/5 times Tier3 means any of the Tier3. To find a Firestorm Tier3 would be a 4/25 chance then.
After a while people will figure out types and tiers will be most desireable to them. This will create market opportunities and level the field. No need to limit medium or low tier sites to a droprate below 1.
Currently however the droprate seems to be a bit high in all tiers, that needs to be changed.
I’d never play another game. Games are stupid. EVE is not.
They really need to get a hold of the Mutaplasmid issue. Currently it is far too low, but let’s hope if they touch it again, they don’t make it the other extreme.
Also if your sample was the average, I think that BPCs should probably have a smaller droprate.
Since she hasn’t answered you on why the Linear model is clearly inferior to any model they could adopt, I will do it.
If I only get filaments to the next pocket level, how do I run one if I only have a few dozen of minutes and I don’t want to run content that is harder than what I mind doing?
I have to buy one? Go to Jita and waste precious minutes and probably ending my game night just doing that before chores/cooking/etc… I have to do a L4 just because you don’t like the idea that I would prefer to hang out, relax and do a L2 instead?
Again, the goal of that content is to provide content for people with short game sessions in an active way, and something to master
Without being able to repeat a certain level for training, there won’t be mastery and it will make the content less enjoyable and practical for the very people it is targeted toward.
This is why your linear idea is terrible. It kills the features as a way to provide accessible and quick content to people.
Plus it kills it as a career for those who are inclined to do so. Make it impossible for them to be self-sufficient enough. Again, just because you are afraid of null-sec doesn’t mean you have to kill the feature for everyone else.
You can run whatever pockets you have filaments for.
If you want to run L3 filaments, then either buy them or generate them yourself from L1/L2 filaments.
If you want to master a certain level/type of DED or escalation, you have to find and run them. They are repeatable, but not for “free”.
No it doesnt. Up to you how you source the L1s, how many pocket escalations you run, and what you do with L filaments you dont want to run.
For example, source a stack of L1s, run them through L2, and then sell the resulting L3 filaments. Some other guy will buy them, run them through L4, and sell the resulting L5 filaments.
Yeah, that’s exactly the problem with you. You read and respond to people, but you do NOT actually read or respond to them, you just plug your ears and repeat whatever mantra you have in mind as your “rational” and perfect solution.
Again, do I have to sacrifice my game night doing logistics just because you want to force me to do only next level pockets? You can say yes, but you have to explain why it would be good for the game to force everyone who want to run those to be close to a hub that sell them and for them to have to spend money and time to stock on them instead of just having more time to enjoy the content and being able to play the content by just playing the content.
False equivalency, the two are not the same kind of content and they fill different roles.
Trig pockets are made to be short-session, on-demand content, DEDs are not.
Nothing logical prevents them from being repeatable for free.
Also, daily reminder that they are not a faucet.
Again, again, again… Why do I have to waste time and ISKs doing logistics just because you don’t want someone who is comfortable at a certain level to be able to keep running that level? The content is made for people who are short on time to still engage them in EVE, what do you think forcing them to do logistics will do?
I’m sure there are good reasons, but you can’t just say that this is what should happen just because you think so.
But we have to as they are another of the valuable loot commodity of the sites themselves… you must have a replacement rate of at least 2 to make them continue on. Otherwise you will only ever have the choice of running the filament or selling it and no longer being able to get more to run them. Having a 1 for 1 system is completely pointless…
