EVE Online to go native on macOS!

Hi folks

We have just posted the exciting news that we have been working on a native Mac client over on our news page.

I have started this thread to discuss the news. I will try to answer questions where I can, but as development is ongoing, I will not be able to answer everything.

Here are the answers to a few common questions that I expect to come up:

Q: Why a native client?

A: The native macOS client will bring performance and reliability improvements to users. One of the big advantages a native client offers us is easier debugging of client issues when running on macOS. As it will use Metal directly and not DirectX via Wine, it also allows us to leverage better use of the system resources macOS offers.

Q: What versions of macOS will the native client support?

A: This is to be confirmed closer to release. However, we generally recommend that macOS users update to the latest available macOS version that is available to them.

Q: What are the minimum system requirements to run the native EVE client?

A: This is to be confirmed closer to the time of release.

Q: What graphics cards will the EVE Online client support?

A: We plan to support all internal GPUs. External GPU support is not planned at this time.

Q: What does this mean for the Wine client?

A: We will continue to support the Mac Wine client until the release of the native macOS client. When the native macOS client is released, we will be deprecating the Wine based client at or around the same time. We will give everyone a heads up before this happens.

Q: What about Apple Silicon (M1) ?

A: The current EVE Online Wine based client will not run on Apple Silicon devices. We have explored this, but have decided to put our full weight behind the native macOS client work to give players the best long-term experience possible.

Once released, the first native macOS client will work on Apple Silicon devices with Rosetta2.

In the future, we plan to release an EVE Online client that is native to Apple Silicon so the use of Rosetta2 is not needed. This will be in the form of a ‘Universal app’.

Q: Can I run EVE Online on Apple Silicon, using 3rd party software right now?

A: We are aware that there is third party software which may allow you to run the current Wine based client on Apple Silicon successfully. CCP does not forbid the use of such software, however it is entirely unsupported.

Q: I have read that DX9 support is mostly present for Mac users using Wine. Will this be deprecated?

A: The plan to deprecate DirectX 9, as mentioned in many previous articles is still the plan. Keeping and maintaining DirectX 9 takes significant resources. While we will not be deprecating it at the exact same time as the native macOS client release, expect it to happen a short while after.

Q: Can I help?

A: Yes! We plan to run a public test of the macOS client in Q1 2021. The focus of our first test will be identifying rendering issues, capturing any crashes the client experiences, and taking performance measurements. Look out for a future devblog that will include the dates and information on how you can join in!

Q: What is the release date for the client to work on Tranquillity?

A: There is no final release date yet. Rest assured that we are excited about this as you, and we want to bring the native macOS client to you as soon as we can.

Here are a few work in progress screenshots:

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Go back underneath your rock, troll.

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This is fantastic news, thank you - and I’m glad you made the choice to support Metal. Looking forward to the public beta!

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Have you seen the performance benchmarks of apple silicon macs? I am no fan of apple but they seem to be onto something with their silicon.

You realize hopefully that devs who work on the client aspects are likely not the same devs that work on the server code? Those are 2 very differrent types of programming.

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M1 on ARM doing ok but when it has to deal with x86 code he suffers

This is fantastic news! I can’t imagine this is a small undertaking, porting Eve to a new platform after almost 20 years, so thank you Caffeine & co for finally assembling a native Mac client. I’m really looking forward to it!

And thanks for the FAQ as well. I’m guessing by the fact that an Arm build is set to come later, that you still have some code that’s inline x86_64 assembly?

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There is some assembly kicking about, yep, but it’s not just that. There is a number of areas in not only the codebase, but the systems around it that will need to be adjusted. Getting the native Intel based client working is a huge step towards the Apple Silicon version though.

I hope to do a devblog with some more details in the future.

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Great news!

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Would this ‘Universal’ app make the full Eve client playable on iOS?

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It’s finally happened, I’ve been waiting for this day to come, some days I lost faith, but I’ve aimed to remain as devoted to this as any citizen of Amarr. I am so so excited to see a native MacOS client and roadmap for Apple Silicon support. Thank you CCP! Can’t wait to play this native on my XDR Monitor :crazy_face:

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Does the chat channels work on MAC ? cos i might consider changing over if they do as they dont seem to work on windows based machines?

@CCP_Caffeine I realise it’s still early days, but any indication on the performance you’re seeing so far in the Native client, over the Wine client?

This is long overdue and I appreciate CCP putting in the work, but I am confused as to why a new client is being developed for x86 and not a Universal binary out of the gate. x86 on the Mac will be obsolete in less than 2 years with Apple’s previous track record on processor arch switches (PPC to Intel). Seems like a waste of development resources to only target x86 at this time.

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Do people on MacOS really have to worry about backward compatibility between OS versions?

Apple will continue to sell x86 for years yet, and the upgrade cycles will add even more time where we see x86 support required. I don’t feel CCP is wasting their efforts focusing on x86 support and leveraging Rossetta 2 (which in some cases on Apple Silicon is out preforming x86 even with the translation layer), before turning their focus to Apple Silicon support.

Short answer - no
Longer answer - it depends

I have a 2012 Macbook Pro and have read that the most recent version of MacOS bricked some of these laptops for people. Other than that I have never had any issues with upgrading to a new version. As a user of Windows, Linux and Mac I can say that I really have never had any major issues when upgrading between OS versions. Occasionally older hardware is unable to run newer versions of an OS, but that is an inevitably. So, no as a Mac user I don’t worry about backward compatibility between OS versions. I just wait like I do with any new version of any OS for the inevitable bugs to be worked out before making the OS upgrade plunge

Comparing against Wine isn’t really something we’re doing right now, mainly because we would be comparing Metal against a DirectX 9 codepath.
We also don’t have a number of optimisations in place right now: both on the rendering side, and for the rest of the client code. That will come in time :grinning:

It’s fair to say that we are aiming for parity with the Windows DX11 client in the future.

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CCP needs to develop a Native Client for Linux !!!

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In short: Jumping to another OS is a big move for us. Jumping to another OS on a different architecture is even bigger.
We still need to tackle many of the same challenges for both, so it makes sense for us to bring it to as many users as possible.

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I don’t support this stance. Apple has crippled it’s OS over the last major updates. The removal of 32 bit support and many internal changes (drivers, networking, security) has forced a significant user base to avoid recent updates.

I can’t update to any macOS version which ceased to support 32 bit software without replacing my professional document scanner.

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