EVE will always be a nichè Game

By trying to make the game more accessable to the broader masses through skill injectors, extractors, SP sales, Expert Systems and babysitting such as a “safety green” button, CCP is actively sabotaging the core playerbase, the only playerbase EVE actualy has.

EVE is a niche Game for a certain set of Individiuals that looks for that sort of game.
I would argue that the majority of EVE Players initialy got drawn into the Game for its reputation of being unforgiving, the weak being filtered out even in the tutorial, a universe populated by potential psychopaths and sociopaths.

Slow but steadily this is being watered down, allowing the weak to flourish while the strong have their progress and repuation made meaningless by things such as skill injectors and FREE TO PLAY.

Where as “I can fly ship X perfectly” or “100M+ SP” were great achievements. This now can be bought with a push of button.

Thank you for your dollar, here is your SP

  • CCP

The decline of EVE started with free to play and was accelerated with SP Injectors.
That the Game was at its peak during the time when it was 100% subscription based and more exclusive seems to prove the point. That elitism and gatekeeping can be healthy to a Game.

There are games for the braindead masses and there are games for a nichè community.
EVE is the latter and by trying to bring in your average WOW Player that potentially only has interest for
the next 2 weeks while crying “EVE IS UNFAIR, WHY CAN CODE GANK” until CCP finally gives in, CCP is sacrificing its paying (subscribing), loyal, core community for a quick profit.

To make EVE a good game again CCP needs to :

  • Remove Free to Play, moving back to a 100% subscription based model
  • Remove Skill Injectors, Expert Systems
  • Remove the PLEX vault
  • Remove the Safety Button
  • Remove “would you like to jump to Low Sec” warning.
  • Remove fitting warnings and tips such as “you got armor modules on a shield ship, you sure”

The ability to have an instant pilot at 100mil existed the minute you could trade characters and buy plex.

So the above “solutions” are not solutions. People can still do that by buying plex and buying characters, there are more than enough on the character bazaar to nullify your “fix”.

I honestly do not care. It just means people loose more expensive ships.


thats a different Character, not your Character. Not the brand you identifiy with.
Which also hints at another huge problem : Mass Multiboxing and the “Alt-Game”. Different topic however.




But if it was not for skill injectors I would have never returned to EVE after I left and sold a couple of 100mil + chars.

EVE needs new blood and new blood today expect a way to gain what they need quickly. And I am ok with that. The only difference is… I know how to use my 130mil SP I injected, they do not. They will always be at a disadvantage and it has given me some hilarious kills.


Bad idea.

I agree, EVE is a niche game and, if it doesn’t move away from the core gameplay that makes it great, should always be so. But what you are suggesting is not good for the game.

As a relatively new player who started playing almost 4 years ago I

  • wouldn’t have tried the game without Alpha
  • wouldn’t have kept playing as I would’t have had the idea I could ever catch up without injectors
  • would have felt much less comfortable learning the game in my first weeks of playing in high sec, knowing that anything you can do could get you immediately killed by CONCORD, without those safety settings

You can have a niche game without those things, but it’s also good to have new players join the game and stick around, because otherwise you have a very common dead game.

Those warnings and safety settings are a good way to teach newer players some basics. There are lots of great sources of information outside the game, but one of the good changes in gaming is that these days most games are playable without relying on out-of-game information manuals, unlike when EVE was first created.

These days I don’t need to be told it’s strange when I’m fitting a shield to a Gallente ship, as I’ve learned about fitting. But for new players such hints are very valuable.


please don’t take this from me sir , i am still in high school and can’t pay for the game
i cannot afford a subscription and all i have is video games
i’m not that much of a social person


All these “back in the 1800s we all had Diphtheria, this newfangled thing called modern medicine is nonsense. Just be a man and die harder”, they’re hilarious and terrible.

Not saying that all old ideas are wrong and the game should change to allow for Gen Z zero attention span players but none of your ideas make for a better game, they just make for more easy and unprepared targets.


So from what I understand, you want less new players to come into the game and keep the community niche to a few individuals. I am not very experienced in the game but this seems kind of self destructive, as if you get rid of all the new and free-to-play players, there will be a lot less ore and things for your ships to be built out of. I don’t know about you but I rather not play a game that only 100 other people play. Your suggestions seem like a great idea on how to kill the game.


what is it that you would want from me Luwc ? i am a new player here but i said i cannot afford the subscription
what do you think it will be best for the game ? what can i do to make it better ?
if you want to be just with subscription i will have to uninstall and this will make me sad, but maybe one day i will come back when i can pay.

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I agree with you, minus a few points. Psychopaths and sociopaths are not ideal leaders nor functional members of any group, they could thrive, though in any healthy tribe - they are discovered and discarded - to make it short.

I have used skill injectors, however I am not adverse to playing in a New Eden where they do not exist. Although it means my progress would be delayed - I do feel it would enrich the overall meaning and experience of it all, and give me a practice in patience and frugality (for I spent most of my ISK on injectors).

Though that was all by choice and I recognize that every player can simply refuse to purchase Expert Systems or injectors, plex with RL money, etc. I ultimately play Eve because it is a rich, complex and unforgiving game that allows for a challenge and meaningful decisions and progress. I wish I started sooner, and I pray to God that the intended design of the game in its niche quality is only cultivated and not circumvented from here on after. I fear that this is not the case, however.


Why remove from the game instead of adding? More is not always better but those you mention are needed and liked by more players than you think.
The EVE is dying meme is old. Alpha accounts help the game.
Why take out PLEX?
And the safety? We need more navigational awareness, not less.

^^ That’s pretty much his post. Turn EVE into a shooting range.

@Luwc I’m fairly certain your points aren’t going to be acceptable for the next meeting.


Disagree I’m afraid
EVE needs to retain AND attract players
And like any successful ecosystem there needs to be balance
PVE and PVP, after all predators need their prey
Don’t worry about green buttons, prompts, hints and reminders, I’ve found people will do what they want irrespective (2 week players ratting in .4 systems for better bounties and loot)
I started PVE and found the draw and attraction of something different, I still PVE when the mood takes me
You be you!
EVE needs points of difference and immersion not samey content


Injectors didn’t sabotage the core playerbase; it’s the core playerbase who lap that shiz up and fuel the market for them. They are the best and worst thing to happen to the game.

It doesn’t matter what accessibility implementations they make, it won’t bring the masses to New Eden. You’re either the kind of person who wants to fly internet spaceships or you’re not.

EVE’s had its heyday. Just accept that it’s in its sunset phase and enjoy it for what it is.

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I forgot a point

  • Remove any and all Multiboxing
    Limiting peoples to one CHARACTER (not account, Character) will make the decisions more impactful.

Before any of this existed people joined eve and played it. In fact, we used to have much higher concurrent user counts then exist today.

Sure, maybe some people come to eve and fiddle with it because of alpha etc. . . - but IMO eve was much better where things were done in the old way. In the old days, if a player made it passed the tutorial and found a reasonable corp and started training slowly into ships, learning skills as they went there was a reasonable chance they would become an eve “lifer.” Now days, its “hurry up” - you cant have fun unless you spend $$ on injectors, plex and ships, to “catch up” with vets.

Ofc they dont tell you that once you spend $$ to catch up you still wont have any idea what you are doing - and there is nothing more frustrating then losing real $$ the first time you venture into LS or Null. I cant think of anything less conducive to hooking new players into the game - then setting them up to be expensive loss mails with real money on the line.

Ofc only CCP presumably knows the truth - in the old days everyone who logged in paid a subscription. When you have 30k or more logged in - it was all real money for CCP. Now, we lucky to get 30k on in a day and of those, presumably there are large numbers of alphas - paying nothing. What percentage of those who log in on any given day are alphas - I have no idea, but presumably it is significant. Are we really to believe that skin and injector purchases are making up the difference?


Not only Alphas but F2P enabled even greater “ALT-Spam” than before. Out of these 30k only, I would argue 50-75% were actual people. Rest was all Alts. This is even worse today where having 10+ Toons becomes the norm.

This was greatly evident during the blackout were people unsubbed their 20 man multiboxing mining fleet in masses (imho a good chemo therapy to the community).


The core player base is toxic and unsustainable. From the inception until a few years ago the bots were stronger than any player could ever be. So glad to see the last of the bittervets die off RN. Good riddance.


IMO blackout was well intentioned but way too abrupt - it was bound to cause the backlash that happened. It should have been implemented in a more piecemeal style. For instance, they could have made local a function of a player launched structure - which could be reinforced or destroyed and when reinforced or destroyed there would be limitations on local. Another thing they could have done was have a delayed local for ships that enter system by wh or covert op cyno. All of this would have made local “less” perfect as an intel tool but not the total destruction of local that blackout caused.