With honor and respect. I flatly disagree. I will let my gear rot in hell before throwing it away in low.
i have took hundreds of very new pilots to low sec , nulls sec whsā¦ and evey possible places ā¦ and they all had fun and thrillsā¦ before they develop that kind of flat prejudicesā¦ and biasesā¦
Not all of them choose to way of PvP ā¦ And i never pushed anyoneā¦ i teach also how to make isk and kept the palette as large as possible to help them find out what they enjoy most ā¦
some wanted to be indy trader other stufā¦ some stay as PvP most indy goin ones later on help me to produce ships to handout new players, they produce and i bougt from them directā¦ so they dont pay any tax or feeā¦ pure profitā¦ and they understood why i do ease new pilots about PvP ā¦ And they wanted to help the way they enjoy ā¦
because they first hand learn how to deal with ā¦ they do not fear do not despise not judge, it is part of the game and .pvp everwhere so knowledge how to counter it tooā¦
It is alot about framing and biasesā¦. And i help them to gain confidence with knwledge ā¦
There must be a reason you come to point to think like thatā¦ wish we met your first day in EvE ā¦
Do you mean me? Or are you using the term āyouā in this post to refer to others? Because this is not about me. I have been in all the areas you mentioned. This is about āFalling Active Player Numbersā and my thinking is that getting people out of high sec and into low sec will promote more EVE-centric activity and interest in the game.
Also, its shocking to me that with all your time spent at least talking about this game that you would think any significant number of players would want to zip around low sec in a shuttle just to āseeā it. Or that experience would be enough to make them think of going there regularly in an actual game playable ship.
As I said before, if words and suggestions could change the way high seccers view those places, they would have already. Thus I suggest a mechanics change that would allow baby steps into low sec.
Good example - that gate is not on your grid and therefore irrelevant in the proposed idea. But if it were closer than 800km rather than 13.4AU away itās certain death. Unless the system it leads to is less than security status 0.5, in which case it is irrelevant again.
And that assessment is something you now have to make any time you warp to a new grid in null and low sec. Fun, isnāt it?
The Concord on the low sec side of a high sec/low sec gate idea to somehow reduce gate camps and attract people to low sec is an idiotic idea.
First, most of low sec is desolate and relatively empty. Most gates arenāt camped. Easy to avoid camps by just not taking shortest route between somewhere popular and a trade hub. But if you need to take such a route there are plenty of ways to avoid being killed too. If someone takes a few minutes to learn then such camps are a joke.
But back to the dumb idea of Concord on the low sec side. This wonāt do anything for camps as the camps will just move one jump down the pipe to the next gate and kill the idiots anyway.
All this idea will do is make the game more annoying. I canāt stand high sec because of all the dumb ārulesā most of which donāt make any sense. I donāt want high sec infecting more of the game.
Look at war decs - to coddle the children, now a mining Corp canāt declare war on people mining their moon for example. You risk a structure, pay for fuel, and then people come strip the ore and you canāt do a damn thing. (I donāt mine personally but I know people that mine on peopleās moons and it is hilarious that the moon structure owner canāt do anything to stop it even if they want to lol)
And when we talk about confusing mechanics imagine this scenario that happened a while back:
In low sec I podded someone. I pod people all the time and donāt think twice. I rarely enter high sec at all so high sec mechanics are last on my mind. Well apparently podding someone gave me a timer. Then another person remote repaired me in low sec while I had that timer not knowing that I had it. They got a brand new timer. Later I jump into high sec with no issue because my timer had apparently run out. The person who repped me also jumped but because of his timer which had a later expiration than mine he got some warning he didnāt understand so he just clicked āyesā to it. He comes through and immediately explodes from Concord. Then we had to figure out how could that happen and what did he do to get concorded. Keep in mind it was now 20 + minutes after I podded someone so it was interesting to find that me podding someone in low sec lead to someone else being concorded!
In any case the game doesnāt need more bs mechanics to coddle the children. It needs to have honest marketing of what it is so people that like the game sign up and enjoy it. And there are plenty of hardcore survival games, etc that include lots of PvP loot loss, etc. So itās not like there arenāt players interested in harsher games. CCP trying to be everything to everyone, spending a huge amount of time constantly rebalancing (even to the point of removing gameplay) vs adding new content, and when they do add content itās not part of the sand box and has a bunch of arbitrary limitations on gameplay are the issues. Some of these quadrants have patch notes where the main feature is they rebalanced something or jacked with the ui for the 200th time. Boring. People flock to new things. Rebalancing and screwing with the ui should be the side notes after something new and awesome that was added is the main topic of the update.
4 Likes
Not sure who said it was to reduce gate camps. But it was my idea and the point was to MOVE gate camps deeper into low sec. (A separate but overlapping idea was to have hi sec systems convert to low sec once enough ganking has happened.)
So many on this forum have a āgiftā (cough) for mangling the posts of others and misinterpreting wildly.
But yes, attracting players to low sec was indeed a part of the idea.
Well, saying it is one thing. Convincing people is another. As per what I just said about people saying crazy things, I am sure most players would rather rely on a guaranteed game mechanic than the word of other players.
People say that but I have poured over maps and have usually found alternate routes to not exist, or when they do, you would have to be insane to take that route.
We have heard these ifs for many years. Yet, nothing changes. Obviously mere words are not working.
āJust moveā you say? Do you play EVE? If they could ājust moveā they would already for an extra element of surprise. Moving takes time. Moving can be complicated. Moving presents opportunities for AG.
And also, moving opens up the possiblity of the alternate routes you mentioned earlier.
Suicide gank? Bump? Again I have to wonder if you actually play EVE.
Got to go now. I will address the rest later if its worth addressing but frankly so far the retorts to my idea wereā¦
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I live in NPC null and travel in lowsec all the time. I left highsec within a week of starting EVE so I can say 100% for sure from a lot of actual experience that there are plenty of ways to navigate lowsec and blowing through ācampsā is a joke. There arenāt even bubbles to contend with. The main issues are psychology (fear of losing ANYTHING preventing someone in the first place) and laziness preventing someone from learning.
Why should they bother moving if targets come to them? We camp a lot and people say blah blah you should roam you lame campers. What is a roam most of the time? A moving gate camp. But if more targets come to us, then there is no reason to move. There is no need to have the āextra element of surpriseā when so many people come anyway. Hell, I have even warned people about our camps and they STILL came through them and died. I have even had times where I smartbombed the same person 3 or more times on the same gate on the same day. I was stationary and didnāt move at all. You would think after the first time they would take 10 seconds to warp to a planet first to go around me. They even have local and D-Scan to see me there. Nope - just pure laziness. They donāt need more dev time wasted on mechanics to coddle and increase their laziness further. They would die anyway.
The alternate routes (or ships that can easily just blow through) already exist. So moving the camp by adding Concord to lowsec will not ācreateā anything, except annoyance.
Yup, with the massive tank of certain mining ships and their low value, the moon owner can suicide gank sure but then they lose even more than the value of their target. Thus the people mining their moon win both ways. You suicide gank them, they win the isk war and laugh. You donāt then they get the ore and laugh. ;).
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I am a solo player and I have had fun playing the game. Mostly I do ratting and mining and trading in stations. I have frequently needed to use multiple warp core stabilizers as well as a full drone complement in order to escape campers, pirates and roam through low-sec space. Your changes essentially nullify my abilities to play the way I have been playing for the last several years (I originally began in 2012, but took a couple of years off).
Now to break through a certain area, I am limited to ONLY drones OR warp core stabilizers? I have tried doing this and have had to vacate the area before serious damage (usually total destruction) was done to my ship - leaving before completing the reason why I went to that location.
This is a very serious negative effect on my gameplay. You've made several other changes in the past which have negatively affected my gameplay, but after a while I sort of grew accustomed to being hamstrung in some manner. But over time, all these issues begin to cascade into a less satisfying gaming experience. Now this change may be the last straw. I really like Eve, but you could be losing me as a subscriber.
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The above quote is a lie. I never said that. And its way too early talking to you for you to be so dismissive, disrespectful and blatantly rude. If you donāt want to read or consider what I said, then DONāT. By way of example I didnāt read your last post at all. Go pound sand. I will waste no more time on your crap.
To counter quote you:
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I feel your pain. But EVE was never meant for solo (except multibox). I too used to rely on multiple stabs for one of my ALTs. I made several fits for it, now all useless. But, like I say, its not a solo game, so us solo players always get done over.
These are the only kind of changes that are made anymore since they put CCP_Rattati in charge and he said the players were going to be punished and never rewarded.
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Part of posting an idea is that other people will provide their feedback on the idea. If you donāt want your ideas scrutinized then itās probably not a good idea to post on a public forum on the internet.
It is important for the devs to know that bad ideas are just that - bad. We donāt need the game going in the direction you desire.
Come up with a good idea and it might get some positive feedback. Post terrible ideas backed by bad premises and they get the feedback they deserve.
The changes you desire amount to just another āWah the gankerzā whine post attempted to be disguised thinly as a āthink of the childrenā / ājust another nerfā lure into low sec. As such itās easy to dismiss.
It wasnāt about your āscrutinity.ā
It was about your over-the-top and totally necessary, unhelpful and counter-constructive rudeness. Something you donāt even have the grit to admit and apologize for and instead dodge and actually double down on.
So spare us your:
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Well no.
You can be on a gate grid for many other reasons without realising youāre on a gate grid. Examples: warped to a player structure, warped to a combat probed target, warped to an older bookmark, someone else (fc) fleet warped you.
There may be a big fight happening, you combat probe to see where it is, land on a grid with hundreds of ships and structures, you shoot a target and get CONCORDED without even realising it is a gate grid.
If having concord in lowsec is such a terrible idea, then why is everybody dignifying it with such lengthy analysis?
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Iāve unsubbed after 14 years.
I loved Jspace, but once you get to really know it, you start to understand how flawed it is, how easily it can be fixed, and how no one at CCP cares.
So if they donāt care, why should I? Iām out!
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You were supposed to move to Triglavia. J-space is legacy code.
Because saying ābad ideaā usually isnāt very constructive unless you also explain why something is a bad idea.
And I like giving the lengthy analysis of why something is a bad idea.
If that would be true, what seems not impossible, the PA/ccp should switch of J-Space.
Aniokis blockes about 30% of all systems for less than 5% of the active playerbase.
And pretty sure, some carebears like me and other J-Spacer will stay offline.
But that it is certainly bearable for PA and a huge gain for EvE.
Mumbles into her thought bubble : "EvE without J-Space ā¦ brrrr , need now some mind disinfection "
Not sure you can take a fall in numbers over a few months and say it is a major problemā¦ yet.
As a long time player I often take time out of the game, there is at least 2 months each year when I am not playing the game or paying my sub.
I know I am defiantly not the only person who dose this. Right now there are a few people I know from both sides of the recent null sec war that are taking time out after what was the longest war in the games history.
Lets hope these players did not get so burned out that they never want to return, I supposeā¦
So maybe lets give it 6 months see if the war weary return, if not WHO WILL FEED THE SERVER HAMSTERS!!!
Fly with Amarr Jesus,
Beanhead1