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At the moment the proposal is to have basic minerals removed and PI materials added.
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Your mining crystals and crystal BPOs will be converted to the new equivalents. Likewise, any skillbook costs will be reimbursed.
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CCP Swift please don’t do this to us!! Don’t pollute our moons with Planetary resources, please we beg of you!!
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CCP Swift please don’t do this to us!! Don’t pollute our moons with Planetary resources, please we beg of you!!
Ditto
It’s just STUPID to put PI stuff in moon goo, DAAAAAAA YA THINK
That would really hurt the Planetary Industry YA THINK DAAAAAAA
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Any truth to the rumors that there may be a ‘CCP Momsen’ coming so there can be an epic Taylor/Taylor showdown?
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@CCP_Psych I went to SISI and to see if the mining ship nerfs got added. Well they did and let me tell you this is HOT GARBAGE!
I had a Procurer active shield rep fit that killed null sec battleship rats and it did ok at mining. The nerfed Procurer is GARBAGE! No more shield tanking it because a genius at CCP decided a shield ship needed less mid slots! Sure you can hull tank it but ALL ORE SHIPS are supposed to be shield ships. That is why a procurer gets bonus to shield HP, well CCP you guys kill that.|
One of the great things about barges is that they could align and warp out fast. Trying to survive a gank by getting off grid but with hull tank that is screwed. There is little to no point in the procurer lay out with only two mids and no it does not have enough power grid to fit large shield extenders.
Why can’t CCP do anything right in the last 2.5 years?
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So sixteen individual crystal blueprints (fully maxed out in efficiencies) are going to be changed into tech one “A”, B", and / or “C” versions?
What a rip-off!
Edit: Let me keep them as trophies at this point and just make them inactive to use - similar to the old space mines. No point in having multiple copies of the same reductions.
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2)All blueprints are to be converted to A types. All relevant skill points accrued will be returned as unallocated skill points and skills (book) will be reimbursed at standard cost
That was not an issue to be quite honest. Prospects are the perfect ship for gas harvesting because the gas clouds are always moving and being able to covert bridge them around or travel cloaky is ideal for this profession. Another advantage of the cloak is that you can just sit on the clouds if danger arrives and can wait it out. The small sig also makes it harder to be tackled and damaged by NPC or players, which is perfect if you want to be a nuisance to sov owners or in low sec. Barges and exhumers don’t have any of that. What they will do, however, is they will depress the prices with the higher yield. That makes gas harvesting less appealing and more of a chore because of said regular gas cloud movement (even with the bigger clouds, thanks to waste).
There was no reason for progression whatsoever and the progression that you induced makes lots of things worse.
You are not welcome.
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This is how i think the mining ship roles is/should/have been.
Frigates.
Venture
Entry miner
Okay at mining ore.
Maby gas and or ice mining. Worst of alle mining ships.
Enduance.
low / 0.0 / WH security aurvival expert.
Fair at mining ore,ice.
Prospect.
low / 0.0 / WH security survival expert.
Fair at mining ore,gas.
Mining barges.
Procurer.
Tank. Best of the barges.
Ore hold. Between the Retiver and the Coverter.
Defensive combat expert, and defender of the fleet.
Good at mining ore. Worst of the barges.
Good at mining gass.
Retriever.
Tank. medium of the barges.
Ore hold. Largest of the barges.
Orehold expert.
Good at mining ore. Middle of the barges.
Good at mining ice.
Coverter.
Tank weekest of the barges.
Ore hold. Smallest of the barges.
Ore yield expert.
Mining drone expert.
Good at mining ore. Best of the barges.
Exhumers.
Just at better version of the barges.
Best mining ships
Or just try looking in Haladas mining guide, that we did use In the “old” days.
I think the main issue was that the progression from Venture → Prospect often wasn’t really progression at all as the Prospect didn’t increase yield and didn’t allow for a cloak either if it used a probe scanner + 2x gas huffer. So you were using a much more expensive hull without innate warp core strength to have a larger ore hold, not really worth it.
What we get now (barges gas huffing) means the gas huffing Prospect pilot now gets paid even less, which is the opposite of what should have happened.
I hope you did tell Rattatti that this progression (Venture → Prospect) had issues. And that you weren’t the one to suggest barges to huff gas, because whoever came up with that broke the existing gas huffing progression.
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What I told him that you had the Venture, and the Prospect, and that they were basically the same, and that after that… nothing. I explained to him that pre-Venture, you’d see gas-huffing battlecruisers, but that because there wasn’t anything that could fit more than 5 harvester IIs, there wasn’t any ship that’d get more yield/second than the 2 harvester IIs on the Venture do.
So in effect, there was (is) the Venture, and… nothing. He agreed that the lack of progression options was a problem, and they’d start looking into ways to give miners something beyond the Venture. That was… like, April. The first solutions I’ve seen are the ones you’ve seen. :shrug:
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All that was needed was to give the Prospect the bonuses over the Venture that it needed to be a proper progression.
But look at what we get now, gas huffing barges. What is a Expedition Frigate pilot going to mine now?
In my opinion it’s more important that every type of ship has a proper role in the game. ‘Progression’ is secondary. It’s not an issue that beyond a certain ship type players are told 'you’re at peak progression, maybe diversify now?’ However, it is an issue when there is no proper role for a ship type in the game.
What is the purpose of Expedition Frigates?
They could have been the ‘peak progression’ gas mining ships, like T2 exploration frigates are the end of the progression for relic and data explorers.
Th R4 moons are losing basic minerals and gaining PI. It’s weird. 
And keep the current minerals in R4 moons, at least in HS.
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Sure, if you want the progression to end with frigates. They don’t. They want people to be able to make a living mining gas in k-space, too. They want people to be able to choose to be specialized gas miners.
To go where bigger things can’t, and get the resources out of there. They came in with or nearly with the Frigate-only shattered wormhole systems, which have gas, ore, and ice in them and which can’t host structures. So nothing bigger (except HICs, because HICs) gets in.
That’s their purpose. Not to be ‘the best’ at an activity that can be done in hundreds of systems that larger ships can get into, but to be the ships that can get at resources where nothing else can.
Hi, let me introduce you to the Stratios, which doesn’t require any T2 piloting skill and gets the exact same Relic/Data Analyzer bonuses as the CovOps Frigates.
Remember: he says, conveys and portrays things in a way that is best for his alliance. To you, to CCP, on the forums. Some facts and logic but interwoven with personal gains and white lies.
That’s what politicians do, that’s how you end up high in a well run machine like Goons.
Don’t be angered by it, no point, because you’ll just lose at this forum PvP.
A) Not a politician. And for the record, how I ended up as a director in Goons was I got asked ‘can you do the job?’ Last I checked, the job of designing doctrines and fitting doesn’t involve politics. Enemy fleets don’t give a damn how smooth you talk.
B) If you’re going to accuse me of lying, please cite your evidence.
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Arrendis -
One question you might have the answer for since you mentioned you have directly talked to the developers:
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If CCP has stated they do not know their own game with many aspects being foreign to them (and)
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The players have posted negative feedback about their proposed changes (and)
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The players have suggested better ideas and solutions (and)
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CCP turns around and double down on even further changes that reinforce they do not know their own game
Why then have CCP not taken a step back, reevaluate all the whole proposed changes, create a new vision, offer it for comments and criticism, and then proceed? Their egos are too fragile and, “damn the consequences - full steam ahead!” mentality? They truly do not care older players throw in the towel and move on to other gaming pursuits?
Thanks for any replies.
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These proposals are not reality, yet
If Devs are staying true to original design docs then player input be damned.
If they are going to stray from the game design bible they better bloody well do all the work to explain themselves convincingly. That includes talking a good backstory.
I have begun to doubt their desire and capacity to do so. Hoping I am wrong.
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