when the current ore supply rate is 10% of what it was a year ago?
alriiiiiiiiight
If they can turn the code off for the existing compression in the Rorq, then they can compartmentalise it and transfer it to other ships. Then simply add the moon ore/gas to it as items types that it can compress (given it can do Ice and regular ores already).
The issue is that they tried to get fancy/complicated with it, and rather than re-using perfectly good code, they’re trying to write new code that has ridiculous complexity and makes what should be a simple process overly onerous, time-consuming and boring.
any ETA on when the new proposed changes will be available for testing on SISI ?
It’s hard to test and see if those new changes are decent if it’s still the old one which was really bad.
as of Today nov 22, the Porpoise & Orca still don’t get the Industrial Command Ship mining yield bonus and for the Porpoise the mining drones still doesn’t get the Role bonus. (can verify this from being in space and launching mining drone , on the show info mining amount, there’s no Porpoise/Industrial Command Ship bonus listed).
And Belts… oh my god are belts UGLY Double the size of the ores inside the asteroids but for the love of all that is good reduce their massive size , being 10km away from an asteroids (FROM POV) while sitting at 0km on an asteroids you just bump constantly into them trying to warpout or move around. You’re just bumping into invisible walls at this point. And for the Drone travel time that is really bad it’s another Nerf to mining drone on top of the already Nerfed mining drone…
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tedious…
really if they want to promote mining in groups over solo they should not change the compression mechanic - period.
and then they rework the crystals - wich is good
but they still add the stupid waste mechanic seperately to mining modules, causing a giant mess in the process.
waste 2.0 works literally oppisite from the first version so WAS there even a goal with this nonsense?
Now it’s just
- waste your time with low end
- or waste your rocks with high end
great for alpha venture bots but at least we can have WASTE now - YAYYYY
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it becomes the same , both are waste your time and for moon mining rare ores it’s an even greater waste your time cause you dont wanna waste them so its back to T1 lol.
You do have a fair comment. Looting directly from the Orca would be his own fault. As I interpret it auto-pilot drops like 18k? off gate to slow boat. At 75m/sec for the Orca it would take 3.5 min just to get to gate… BOTH are still the pilots fault
What I’m trying to get across that an Orca can die and it’s all the pilot choices. The new core has -100% speed on 150 second cooldown making you a ‘great target’. You can choose not to run one at all and that’s the nerf.
NERF or GREAT TARGET
CCP’s new button is what I have issues with
the proposed changes were added, info screens etc were not changed but the changes are live on SiSI
So congrats, I didn’t know you had retired and now have twice as much time to commit to Eve to make the same isk.
No they are still not live, the CiC in the new proposed change have a duration of 2 min 30 seconds , and on SISI it’s still at 5mins.
After a little review of the numbers, I thought it would be worth posting some raw values for reference…
| Type | Yield | Cycle | Yield: m3/Second | Average Tailings: m3/Second |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Strip Miner I | 675 | 180 | 3.75 | 0 |
| ORE Strip Miner | 700 | 180 | 3.89 | 0 |
| Strip Miner II (no crystal) | 450 | 180 | 2.5 | 0.85 |
| Strip Miner II (A1) | 675 | 180 | 3.75 | 1.275 |
| Strip Miner II (B1) | 675 | 162 | 4.17 | 2.25 |
| Strip Miner (C1) | 112.5 | 180 | 0.625 | 8.79 |
| Strip Miner II (A2) | 810 | 180 | 4.5 | 1.98 |
| Strip Miner II (B2) | 810 | 144 | 5.625 | 3.6 |
| Strip Miner II (C2) | 112.5 | 180 | 4.5 | 11.04 |
| Mining Drone I x 5 | 125 | 60 | 2.083 | 0 |
| Mining Drone II x 5 | 165 | 60 | 2.75 | 0.94 |
| Augmented Drone x 5 | 185 | 60 | 3.083 | 1.233 |
| Excavator Drone x 5 | 400 | 60 | 6.667 | 4 |
So we don’t have official numbers for ship bonuses yet, but the raw bonuses indicate:
- Given the yield:tailings proportion, you're better off using T1 strip miners instead of T2 strip miners with T1 crystals loaded, which seems rather curious
- In terms of yield, a Strip Miner II with a T2 B-Type Crystal is worth almost one and a half ORE Miners; With T2 A-Types loaded it's worth roughly one and a quarter.
- Tech 2 and Augmented Drones both seem to produce less average waste than a Strip Miner II with Tech 2 A-Type Crystal loaded
- We can't account for the future ship bonuses, but one set of 5 unbonused Excavators is, in the long run, roughly equal to one Strip Miner II with a T2 B-Type Crystal equipped - the excavators will have both higher yield and higher waste.
With that in mind, a second table for how each fares, unbonused, with 100,000 m3 of rock:
| Type | Average Yield | Average Hours | Average Tailings | Average m3 Cleared (Yield and Tailings) in 1 Hour |
|---|---|---|---|---|
| Strip Miner I | 100,000 | 7.41 | 0 | 13,500 |
| ORE Strip Miner | 100,000 | 7.14 | 0 | 14,000 |
| Strip Miner II (no crystal) | 74,610 | 8.29 | 25,390 | 12,060 |
| Strip Miner II (A1) | 74,655 | 5.53 | 25,345 | 18,090 |
| Strip Miner II (B1) | 64,800 | 4.32 | 35,200 | 23,100 |
| Strip Miner (C1) | 8,152 | 2.95 | 91,848 | 33,885 |
| Strip Miner II (A2) | 69,498 | 4.29 | 30,502 | 23,328 |
| Strip Miner II (B2) | 60,973 | 3.01 | 39,027 | 33,210 |
| Strip Miner II (C2) | 5,355 | 2.38 | 94,645 | 42,008 |
| Mining Drone I x 5 | 100,000 | 13.33 | 0 | 7,500 |
| Mining Drone II x 5 | 74,626 | 7.54 | 25,374 | 13,266 |
| Augmented Drone x 5 | 71,430 | 6.44 | 28,570 | 15,540 |
| Excavator Drone x 5 | 62,400 | 2.6 | 37,600 | 38,400 |
Formulae I used:
- 60*(Yield/Cycle) = Yield/Minute
- Average m3/Hour Cleared = Yield/Hour + (Yield/Hour * Tailings Prob * Tailings Mult)
- Average Hours = 100,000/Average m3/Hour Cleared
- Average Yield = Avg Yield/Hour * Avg Hours :smiley:
- Disclaimer: Some Rounding was done at the end of operations to achieve slightly prettier numbers
Someone double-checking all this would be very appreciated, of course!
Edit 1: Mislabeled Augs as Excavators, oops 
Edit 2: Disregard 
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I posted this on another section of the forums, figured this could be an interesting read for the devs.
I assume all focus is over here at the moment
https://forums.eveonline.com/t/a-small-thought-regarding-the-rorqual/337816/3
Even in PvE, there are ‘meaningful choice’ tradeoffs to be made. Are you mining in a Procurer, for disposable tankiness? A Mackinaw, for low-maintenance? A Hulk, for max throughput, even if it might blow up and cost more?
Choosing anything but the Hulk is already ‘gimping yourself’ on the monetary returns. Using anything but the Skiff is the same where those fancy belt rats are concerned. Player agency != Letting players have everything all at once.
Recognizing the optimal solution doesn’t mean saying it should be easily achieved.
This sounds a lot like the current PANIC module.
PANIC makes you invulnerable, the idea of this overshield burst would grant a tempoary over shield, but instead of extra shield, just increase the resistances, similar to how an assault damage control works.
can still break tanks but they’re much more meaty, perhaps a duration of 30 seconds, but the burst requires a manual click each time, or perhaps a 1 minute cool down & 1 minute reload, if this were a module on its own I could see this module requiring fuel to use. and as said in my post, the bonus would only be applicable to mining ships.
ships can still be alpha’d, webbed and scrammed just not as quickly, the difference of 30 seconds might be all it takes to get a response fleet in, or perhaps by a rorqual a little extra time before it gets it panic module turned on and such.
in my mind this ultimately gives the people who are going to respond to a rorqual tackled called will have a little more time to muster a response fleet, maybe only 30 seconds, but that 30 seconds could be critical.
–EDIT–
on the subject of panic, its a shame that it isn’t reworked to be an automatic module which kicks in at like 10% hull, this way you can have the snot kicked out of you in grid and then BOOM panic mode activates, during which time you go through insane repair cycle. (afaik panic only lasts for 5 minutes, i don’t know if it cycles or needs to cool down i’ve never used it, but i know CCP wants to make grid fights longer, this would be an awesome way of drawing out a fight on a rorqual, this could easily push a fleet fight till about 10 - 15 minutes when you factor in things like waiting for compression modules to finish before de-seiging, also depending on circumstances.)
just some thoughts.
Instead of multiple edits, I’mma just post a second thought… given the tables above, it seems like either T1 Strip Miners should be receiving a nerf to yield to make up for their lack of waste, or ORE miners should recieve a cycle time buff in order to put a little more distance between them and T1, given the inevitable price disparity.
But I have been told by the forum users that everyone who uses an Orca is ‘afk’.
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“Optimal” is the key word here.
For those mining in a nice safe sov region - Optimal may well be, do it slow to get the most.
Those in space that isn’t so safe [mainly anyone not in a major alliance] - Optimal vs Risk vs Reward is a very different equation.
Then you have Optimal vs Chosen Playstyle. I mined to fund my PVP, I only have X amount of hours p/d to play eve. If I have to dedicate twice as much time to make the same isk I am used to, I have less time to PVP - Which leads to not bothering to pay subs and login at all.
Maybe you should consider PLEX with RL money and supplement it with a bit of ingame trading, rather than mining.
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Yeah - NO.
I’d been able to plex 15 accounts for many years via a bit of mining and manufacturing.
I have no intention of paying with real money to play a game that has all but removed my play styles and choices repeatedly.
Adapt or Quit - CCP is making the latter so much easier.
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How do you figure having to mine twice as much? There may be waste now, but if you’re calculating your yield off of a set amount of time, the actual yield amounts will generally be going up, with the barges and exhumers getting extra bonuses. If you’re ratting in just a single Orca then yield will most likely drop, but with fifteen accounts that doesn’t seem to be your case. At worst, if you’re fielding 5 - 6 rorqs, you should be able to swap most of them for sxhumers and end up yielding similar amounts of ore.
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