From Extraction To Production: Update

Did i miss sth or wasn’t making mining more active one of the goals of this entire garbagefest?

because its a rather “safe” way as the amount of players required to gank you is so high that you can leave your mining operation before they have entered your mining location. unlike the smaller non proc/skiffs who will have to leave your roids just because a singel person entered your system.

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This is so funny. Some games tries really hard to avoid needless clicking cause they know their playerbase could develop " Repetitive strain injury (RSI) is a general term used to describe the pain felt in muscles, nerves and tendons caused by repetitive movement and overuse ." Meanwhile CCP with an average of 27yo’s gamers (probably higher tbh) thinks that increasing the clicks someone has to make for a simple task is the right call.

Making mining more active does not inherently mean making mining more clicky*(typo, sorry). There are ways to do it that don’t necessarily have to mean more clicks. Especially in a game like Eve where so much can be bound to keyboards and other input devices.

It’s just CCP lacks innovation and only views things through the ‘balance’ lenses it’s used for the last decade and a half.

Imagine an asteroid belt with a random percentage of roids containing minerals and others containing nothing. No survey scanners (meaning no analysis of content, only volume), drilling for a few cycles is the only way to find out (and Kenneth would understand why cycle time duration is perhaps the better option). That would be slightly more active. Whether that’d be good for this particular game, the bp’s being what they are, is a different matter :crazy_face:

This actually sounds like a great idea to give mining frigates an extra role, as they can move around much more quickly to scout a belt.

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That’s actually not a terrible idea. Would certainly promote inter-industrial class cooperation. Could even add a deployable of some sort to flag various asteroids as good/bad, or repurpose can’s for it. Spitballing on the idea, ofc.

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Well yeah, it could be made to work, but not on its own. In general the time for gathering of materials would increase, further impairing the final goal: building stuff. It would require revising all bpo’s to make it work - and that is more than likely out of the question.

Part of this is to reduce the amount of information market speculators get to analyse when weighing their trades.
Got to admit, I never saw waste coming. Hard to factor the superfluous, what is the point?
I also agree that not declaring broad intentions lends to the easy supposition that the ship is rudderless. It may not be but it sure looks like it.
@Arrendis post on establishing logical foundations was the most sense I could make of this entire thread.
As to my favourite thing about EVE; lore, I look forward to how seeing in a Soon™ to be published Newspost how known environmentally derogating mining practices got passed the Federal Law Courts and the (admittedly not so active) Environmental Activists.

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Interesting change, adding processed PI to moons.

What effect do you expect this change will have on PI? Will there still be any reason to gather those materials from planets when one can get those materials from from moons, quicker and in a form that can be compressed once moon compression arrives?

I’m not sure this is a good change. My initial feeling tells me this makes gathering Oxygen, Water, Bacteria and Proteins from planets useless, or at least much less valuable to the point that you would be silly to gather these materials from planets rather than other P1.

This change may add value to the activity of R4 moon mining, but that value will be stolen from the activity of planetary industry.

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PI in Moons…WTAF…??

Please tell me this is some kind of Thanksgiving April Fools kinda joke? Are you serious? You guys obviously don’t understand any aspects of this game in any way shape or form. I have unsubbed 5 out of the six accounts (that I pay for), keeping 1 open in the vague hope that you listen to your PAYING community, but in keeping with CCP’s tradition, yet again you serve us up with a totally unthought out mechanic. We pay your wages, listen to us for the love of Bob!!!

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That’s an easy one, humans are not infallible rational beings, and the Fed is just as much an Empire as the rest, just dressed up in a semi-democratic skin. Activism and protests happen all the time and because of the shear fuckoff size of the Federal aparatus, they can point to ‘this is why X isn’t getting done’ etc, until they absolutely have to do a thing. Like when the megastrip mining of planets in verge vendor happened as an example. You think FedGov wasn’t aware that was happening in their territory in-universe? :stuck_out_tongue: course they knew. And of course many in FedGov profitted… so there’s your lore reasoning as to why.

Plus, space megastrip mining isn’t the same as planetary megastrip mining… so calling it environmentally derogatory is… more difficult

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Hehe. Give them a B+ for recklessness.

Doesn’t affect me, since I own no refineries in 0.5 space, but I can sure understand how this weird dxm hand waving would make a lot of owners pissed.
They get their output changed to crap of much lower value, that also takes up a lot more cargo space to move. They won’t even have the moon ore compression to look forward to in the future (a rorqual exclusive).

It does make for a fun topic, but this will be costly. Now we have an unnecessary damned if they do, damned if they don’t, scenario.

If it would somehow work, it would damage existing PI enterprises with a flooded P1 market.
Since it won’t work without additional updates, the PI guys won’t suffer much more than they already do, but many minor industrialists halfway up the chain, will get wrecked.

Tying different activities together like this will only make it harder to unfuck the economy.

Literally just reduce the size of P1, that’s all they need to do.

Currently it is 0.38m3 so you can reduce that to 0.2m3 or even less and it’ll really change the way we can move materials.

The components also are large 1000m3 for Core-Temp (I think)

So the issue with cap production is bulk, and movement of that bulk.

Putting P1 into moons solves nothing and only makes everything a whole lot more confusing.

(PI compression also makes no sense as you can’t compress water using RL physics)

Reducing size of PI is done by processing the goods to a higher tier. P1 too bulky to move? Turn it into P2.

If industry requires volumes of PI that are too large to be practical, those blueprints should be changed to require less volume (less P1 or P2 instead of P1).

That aside, mining processed PI goods from moons is silly.

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@CCP_Psych

Can you give a break down as to why yall at ccp think adding p1 materials to r4 or is good?
I honestly think if we the player base had more of an understanding of what yall were thinking we would be able to better see your point of view and then in turn give better ideas while avoiding some of the ■■■■ storm that comes from people speculating.

I want to believe yall know what you’re doing but with this change I really just don’t get why or what you’re aiming for.

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can you pls tell me, why i still should produce anything? there is 0% prediction if i can sell my stuff. i cancel all production/invention project. this is crazy whats happen here.

can we pls get a roadmap what you’re doing?

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Actually PI is bottleneck for a lot of craft due to industry change.

So they randomly add to R4 moon PI to solve the problem. It will cause more problem and not solve all bottleneck issue.

But they prefer doing that than admit all industry change they have done have fail since blackout.

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It’s a bottleneck because of the size of P1. Not because their is a quantity issue.

You might want to look at the Exhumers again.
Hint, NONE of them got 5% to yield but all lost 20% duration. All three Exhumers get different bonuses, as both Barge and Exhumer skills apply and vary from one to another.
Skiff for example, lost 20% duration for the addition of 20% yield. NO change there.

For everyone saying the PI in R4 is terrible, I have to disagree. The biggest problem with T1 PI being part of the core temp regs and capital temp regs is the volume, and ability to move it around, so most of it needs to be produced locally. With compression becoming a thing for moon goo, and it appears the ratio’s are actually thought out, doing all the reactions and whatnot for those components would be much simpler and easier by compressing and moving R4 moon ore, rather than trying to import millions of units of water and goo. Just saying, it’s not the change we want, but it could turn out not terrible. Also, minerals in moon rock going away might actually make mining arkanor and bistot worthwhile to do again, which would be nice.
EDIT: would have to allow orca’s to compress R4 for all this to really make sense as well, otherwise just terrible for hisec moons.