With these multi layered overcomplicated tiered systems I believe there is a risk that game gets perma jammed if player count drops below a arbitrary number making them unviable. IMO it is better to develop systems that prolong the longevity of the game and improve the player experience. Make complexity linear to earlier development cycles not making each layer more complicated then the last. It also means you will be respecting the players time. Bad implementation from what I have been reading.
3 Likes
Something to try on SiSi, perhaps. I don’t know, so hopefully someone here can answer.
I know that the mass of belt-mining vessels played no part in their resistance to bumping. It wasn’t just that mining activity was disrupted, of course. There were the boosts, etc. I once bumped an Orca a couple hundred km off the belt with no difficulty. Can’t remember if his drones followed him.
It doesn’t matter if the pilot is ATK, either. They did try to escape me, but, bless them, too bloated with ore to run far!
Seriously, some of you should consider this possibility. I meant it when I said that bumping might very well make a comeback.
When code clapped my drones (my alts in covetors) the first time, they brought 10 dessies but i messed up their gank with 2 meta medium remote repairs to the point they only got 2 of the 5 covetors.
If your opposition is just some suicider gankers, don’t forget you can overheat your repairs for them to cycle faster. You can also use ancillary repairs which are more powerful.
No. Noone puts mining laser upgrades on a proc/skiff. If you want mining efficiency, you don’t use a proc anyways. The Quad-Multispectrum Hardener Mid Procurer seems to be a thing, too. Stacking Penalties anyone? Meh…
If an orca installs the 3 forebuff commands, it can still install the shield burst, unless it wants the third remote shield/capacitor transfer unit. With just barges on grid there’s no point in having the RCT though, and with a second whale/porp on grid that could return the capacitor, you’re no longer needed to put all commands on a single orca.
But then … with 3 mining bursts, shield burst, a RST and the “obligatory” tractor, there’s no space left for the salvager?! Need to drop the RST for it, right? Or is it the shield burst? Maybe drop both and take a salvager and a cloak. That’s what we shall do. Especially because we warp the orca from tether to 3 meters distance to a rock, where it can’t cloak, but the drones will reach the rock faster.
Stealthy orca lock speeds also make the game more exciting.
Nah. If you want to blow up HS miners, just blow up HS miners. Improves trade volumes for mining ships and modules to be fit on them, thereby supporting the highsec industrialists.
Really? My Orca, though I’m embarrased to confess it’s neither nanofibered nor polycarboned, moves so slow that my barges will frequently scoop anything in their unbuffed range before the orca can get them close to additional ore to mine.
If you don’t need a mining field enhancement script, you need more alts. And until you have those, should use a porp for it’s faster movement, too.
Come to null, man. Then it’ll be “you’re not allowed to own a rorqual unless you have a force recon alt”, “you’re not allowed to undock it unless you have a fax alt on standby”. Rorquals (and orcas) can also Spider-Tank, but noone will buy that from you, the multi-rorqual user who claims he reps his rorqs with his other rorqs is just finding an excuse to field more rorqs and will in the end just afk with all of them on the mining grid. All alliances know that.
An Orca sitting next to a big moon rock or next to an ice roid? AFK most of the time. Increasing the yield just rewards that kind of gameplay even more.
The only thing you could do is make the roids smaller, so you would have to switch drones over more often. This is bad, both for people not flying Porpoise/Orca/Rorqual and the server, since it means more objects in space if you want to keep the belt amount the same.
I personally would love to have some more fleet benefit from my Orca being locked in space and consuming heavy water. Like more bonus for the tank bursts (maybe limited to industrial ships, so they do not become the new command ships)
Been to Null. Spent most my Eve ‘career’ as either a “LEET PVP low sec dude” with Suddenly Spaceships. or out in Null with INIT.
I know all about those rules. But just because something is the way it is right now, doesn’t mean it’s not bad game design and can’t be fixed.
You mean two years ago.
They’re only precious now because they’ve been taken out of hi-sec. Before they were worthless. E.g. Nocx is 3x it’s old value. And iso doubled in valued and then doubled again recently as stockpiles ran out.
Not if you want to get good rewards. That’s the point.
Low risk, low reward.
The true AFK whale is just floating there, orbitted by it’s augmented ice mining drone, no rock next to it. The ice rock the drone was mining has depleted an hour ago but the drone wasn’t assigned to a new rock, because the orca’s operator’s asleep since 3 hours.
2 Likes
I’m a bit curious. Suppose I was in a nullblock and I had some guys on a roam into hostile territory to kill some ratters. And since I was already there, seven guys in Retrievers came along and filled up their ore holds with some glowing pollucite. Why they thought they’d be safe in hostile territory, who knows. Maybe they were trying to bait. Then after moving through some systems and killing some others, a response fleet is finally deployed. Everybody is happy and goes home.
The type C offensive crystal for economic warfare does sound interesting. However, a barge would need to be kept alive for the entire time. If the barge isn’t safe, it’s probably not worth even bringing since it will just add a shiny kilmail.
But if the barge can be kept safe, wouldn’t just using the regular crystals to take all that ore and haul it home be better? If a barge is safe for 30 minutes in constellation with many hostile citadels and an enemy TCU (possibly because your allies blew them up or maybe they’re all asleep at the moment). And even before the patch (when there was only one type of crystal for each ore), if my buddies can safely use their barges in such conditions, putting something like (Strip Miner I, Strip Miner II with relevent crystal, Enduring Multispectrum Shield Hardener, Damage Control, Reinfoced Bulkheads, Inertia, Stabilizer, Transverse Bulkhead, Transverse Bulkhead, Transverse Bulkhead) on a Retriever (not the best fitting, but just an example) and then having them get the ore would be the best thing to do. And if enemy capsuleers are expected to be on grid, then using a barge of any kind in hostile territory is just not worth it. And economic warfare with an exhumer is laughable unless they make those BPCs drop like candy to the point that you can get 30 of those BPCs for the price to get an entire barge.
Unsure about the crystal BPC’s, but pretty sure I have that many max research/max run BPC’s from my old copy mill before I fell into inactivity and then unsubbed. If I don’t, it’d still be a limited concern to make that many BPCs. Materials, at least for the short term, would be a different story.
Not even two years. It still exists though, I found some Hemorphite and Omber in a combat signature in Anmatar High while trying to do the skilling spree thingy
We have the Nocx in Crokite in null, it’s like 30% of the stuff we mine. Once Type C scripts are there to despawn the anomalities faster, the Nocx price might come down again.
Life in Jita 4-4 w/o undocking can be very rewarding in terms of isk that can be made.
If you’re up to actually playing the game, and you want to do so as a miner, it barely matters what security zone you’re in, cause the rocks all are mined the same, and the design of the mining belts is invariant, too. In high and low, some of relics have rocks inside, though, so you can have a slightly different mining anom by doing exploration but then just skipping the boxes and going to the ores instead. Relic Rocks are also way larger then the asteroid belt ones, and might be rocks you don’t otherwise have in that region, which enables you to do exciting stuff like grabbing a mining laser script you haven’t used for ages or so, and you’re not just wasting scripts on rocks that deplete in a single cycle anyways.
Null and WH-Space don’t have ore in relics. At least I haven’t seen any.
I basically meant that economic warfare with such an expensive ship was laughable, even if you had a 1/3000 chances of losing the ship it wouldn’t be worth bringing such an expensive non combat ship.
Fair. Just pointing out that BPCs for standard equipment have rarely been the backlog in Eve. 
Once you get the BP researched copying is child’s play.
Huh, I thought BPCs for Exhumers were a bit harder to get than ones for the barges
Exhumers, yes. Those are T2 and require invention. IIRC your example was the retriever though, a standard barge. No, those are standard. Just checked, I have 700 or so builds of retriever copies laying around.
The Exhumer for that hull is the Mackinaw.
Oh wait, let me clarifiy, I guess I jumped trains f thoughts. So I started my example with a barge on how it would be tricky to use for economic warfare, but it might be doable if you could keep the barge safe.
Then I mentioned that the type C crystals didn’t add much to it, since if you could have kept the barge safe, you could have done economic warfare without the patch and just fill up the Retriver’s giant ore hold while if you couldn’t keep the barge safe, there was no point. So the idea of economic warfare with barges sounds interesting, but I think if anyone could pull it off succesfully, they can do so without the new type C crystal.
So I was wondeirng why anyone would bother with the type C if they had the circumstansas to pull this off.
And while economic warfare with barges sounds interesting, if hard to execute and even then it’s just better to fill up your own ore hold.
And then economic warfare with an exhumer just sounds laughable.
1 Like
Why bother retriever-ing ore (retriever has poor yield) just to deny ores to other miners? Tell the pvp-ers in your corps you SRP their coercers/tornadoes/hecates if they clap some miners of the other corporation, will refuse content to the other corps much harder, generate some content for your corps’ gankers, and you can also grab all of the ore (in case you even want it for yourself, I for my part don’t want to run the data site my bomber is cloaked in, either)
I have to ask. Is it even possible on that scale? Even with a protected fleet of miners? Or worth it I guess?
Out of curiosity when was the last time you tried to fit 3 large remote reps to an Orca.
I’d be really interested to see an Orca fit that will work with your idea.
1 Like
Well yes, you would blow up the enemy combat ships and any miners foolish enough to stick around after killing any combat capable ships. Rather than denying their miners ore by mining, the next step after securing the grid would be to just blow up any reds. CCP thinks barges and exhumers could be used in economic warfare. I pointed out, for it to be remotely doable, you’d have to secure the gird for a long time. This isn’t very likely, but it can happen. During World War Bee Two, sometimes the response fleet of Fraternity didn’t really save their ratters… or in some cases actually let hostiles stick around for hours. But anyone who managed to clear the system and secured the grid and for some reason brought a barge… if you’ve come this far you might as well take the ore for yourself. And if you can’t secure the area and you bought a barge for some reason… any slow aligning ships (like a barge) is going to be toast. So if you can’t secure the area, CCP’s idea was just silly and if by some miricle all the stars aligned, you’d be better off filling the orehold. Basically CCP says “look we introduced economic warfare” but the only sitaution you can use their idea (instead of just losing a barge brough on a PVP trip) there is a better alternative that was avalible before the patch.
My orca has three reps, lasts long enough for a gank and has worked against actual ganks.