No group is going to ban newbros from mining. That is dumb and they will quickly realize that is what will lead to a decrease in their member numbers if it continues. Also, other groups would look poorly at them if they did that. The goal is to keep/encourage newbros to stay and advance. Not bar them from activities.
As I explained, even if t1s produced waste (which in the newest update they don’t) overall more ore will be kept by the players. So a newbro can mine and a vet can mine and while the newbro will produce some waste the increasred amount and speed of t2 will still yeild higher levels than previously seen. Sure might lose a small about cause of the newbro, but not enough that it will make or break anyones wallet or indy line.
So, dont use newbros as a reason to keep waste at 0. Its an awful arguement that really has no weight to it.
This is interesting to read when one of my moons in Anmatar Highsec is minable right now, and being drone-whaled by a neutral while my own mining toons are docked in the NPC station in Rens, too lazy to go over to mine or to shoo off the neutral. Another coalition operated refinery at a different moon in the same highsec popped on thursday and in the meantime despawned completely unmined, not even neutrals bothered collecting the R4. Null moons are mostly the same, with the exception of those moons that have R64 or R32, where the R64 and R32 is being cherry picked and the other ores left behind.
I fly to Osoggur, 2 jumps out of Rens, where I know there’s a lot of refineries. 3 of them have moon belts up right now, one of the moon belts has a Retriever mining, the others aren’t being mined. Neighboring lowsec has a belt with R16 up, noone mining it.
How comes the other end of new Eden has so much competition on the Moons that you would ban people from inefficiently mining? We’re happy here if they’re being mined at all.
Doesn’t even need that much. Right now, it is completely infeasible to build faction/pirate ships. And in the past when CCP changed mineral compositions of ships for the first time (Battleships after the first round of ore increases), it took prices for many BS and BC months or years to catch up with the new production cost. Back then I was really happy when I was able to buy my first BS BPO and got it researched – only to find out mere weeks later that it had become completely useless because the Armageddons would cost much more to build than what they were sold for on the market at the time. Back then I was not yet as frustrated with CCP and just decided to throw it into the ME10/TE20 research for a few months instead, but even after that time the cost had not fully caught up yet. Today …
Some already discourage it and nobody minds. They are doing the newbies a favor by sending them to other activities, like exploration, first.
The reason why most corps don’t, is that there’s usually an industrialist on top, running an ore buy-back program. For most lower value ores there is an abundance anyway. Just burn through newbies for a few more ores.
There is no faster way to burn out newbies, than to corral them into venture mining. If the players really insist on mining, they could level up to high barge levels, while doing something more worthwhile in the game in the meantime.
This is the big joke.
It is the foundation of everything.
Everyone needs those minerals and it sucks balls.
It is why CCP rocking that slumbering, multi-boxing miner boat is so comical.
Depends how invested you are. I could do that or I could just quit and play another game, the market is super competitive, tons of games out there with more enjoyable hooks.
I look at my mothballed Titan/Dread, Super, FAX and Rorq accounts and just see accounts that lack value for money. Over the last 2-3 years they’ve become more cumbersome to move around, have reduced EHP, apply less well to smaller stuff, can no longer be ratted with. Why on earth diminish them to such an extent, no wonder demand tanked as soon as build costs rose.
I disagree with your point about supers/titans not being a meaningful loss, at their cheapest you could get a super for around 10b, titan for 35b (50b fully fit), people are complaining about 9b dreads being unsustainable. A rorq pre Scarcity mined 100m/hour, 500 hours for 1 fit titan, but of course to fly a 50b ship you really want 100 ish in assets so you feel comfortable enough to lose it. All of a sudden you’re talking years of work for your average player to reach that point. Took me 5 years to get my first titan. The build cost now is 200b, that’s crazy they are the Palatine Keepstar of spaceships. It’s just not sustainable and if you haven’t endured the multi year grind to fly them then kindly button it!
You’re missing a key point, we’ve had fast and efficient for years so both of the above is a nerf and one a good number of players are not prepared to stick around for. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle you’re fighting playstyles that took years of sub payments to reach. It’s not fair to take that financial value away at this point.
Would have much preferred they tackle the issue by introducing more resource sinks, super titans, motherships, black hole generators that link null regions that allow you to wage war across New Eden that take x resources/day to keep open. Something creative and fun to grind towards which was actual new content.
Think how high the opportunity cost has been of this multi year failed experiment, imagine what we could have had instead of this ■■■■!
@CCP_Psych
Suggestions that would make sense for the Orca & Porpoise with the compressions.
Compact Industrial Core T1 T2:
Removing the fuel cost
Activation time / cycle 1 min.
CiC T1 Mining drone velocity increased by 75%
CiC T2 Mining drone velocity increased by 100%
ORCA Compact Compression( I forgot the actual name this is close enough) T1 / T2 Have to have the CiC running to operate.
Activation time: T1 3 mins, T2 2mins 30 sec
Consume Heavy Water per operation 100 units / 250 units
Compressing quantity T2 should compress more than T1.
Waste T2 should waste less than the T1.
Porpoise Compact Compression( I forgot the actual name this is close enough) T1 / T2
Activation time: T1 2 mins, T2 60 seconds
Consume Heavy Water per operation 50 units / 150 units
Compressing quantity T2 should compress more than T1.
Waste T2 should waste less than the T1. Cannot Compress Ice
^ This is very important as it cannot fit ice in it’s cargo hold anyway without cargo extenders. Unless you change that later with the Ice Hold, It also adds uniqueness to the Orca vs the Porpoise.
Wouldn’t it make alot more sense if the Orca had to be in Industrial mode to be able to compress ?
Granted it doesn’t make sense for the Porpoise then , but for the Orca it does.
I have a theory, I suspect newbros are more likely to be retained if they have shiny carrots to shoot for. When I first started playing, my day 1 objective was to own a titan having joined the game reading about early supercap battles. Took me 5 years to earn it. With titans being so nerfed and hugely expensive, that aspiration isn’t really there anymore. Same goes for Dreads, Supers, Rorqs etc.
You need something to strive for to keep you focused through early game PI / Mining / Missions being low isk/hour, much the same way that a level 1 in WoW cannot gather the best resources or craft the best gear, you don’t think about that whilst you’re spending x months levelling up. Eve has tried to throw the MMO model on its head, allow newbros to train into the best mining ships quickly and diminishing caps… Where on earth are the long term hooks in this game now?
The mechanics of Eve are profoundly boring, it’s those endgame dreams that kept me going for years along with the social side and meta stories.
Abyssal … newbros goes into abyssal now, and slowly work their way to a gila t5 abyss. It’s better than any other kind of content in high sec currently. That should be the equivalent of your "wouaw a titan i wanna fly that someday " 6b Gila
That’s definitely one long term hook and one I greatly enjoy. CCP better not go all Scarcity on Abyssals too!
We’re not talking about “better” btw, you see my point right? Abyssals may appeal to you and I, but not the next player. You need that combination of long term aspirations to keep people on the treadmill and I think the fact we’ve lost a bunch of them recently is why the PCU is dropping.
I see it of course , all aspect of gameplays should have an Equivalent goal to reach , fun to obtain and reward to get. Abyssal and Triglavian hunting are the top dogs currently in High Sec nothing even comes close to that not even incursion which used to be the top dog. If you pay close attention those 3 are not Industrial and are Not mission running and are Not mining…
Yes obviously, you need long term aspirations for all the pursuits.
Just to be clear, as I wonder if you misunderstood my post, I suggested early game PI, Mining and Mission running are low isk/hour. I was not suggesting these are the only pursuits in High Sec.
Scarcity and the Indy changes impact mining and PI most, not so much Abyssals, hence why I focused on these.
Feels a hair squishy to me. If it works it works, ofc, but that’s where I’d run into a hang up, wanting to put at least a DCU and bulkheads on. Granted, I’d also just compensate by downgrading to a medium RR or two and bringing a posprey along.
That depends on what you are looking for If you’re just looking for some fun (space) game then sure but, to me at least, EVE isn’t just some “fun space game”. It’s a very interactive cut throat PVP sandbox where a few braincells and preparation make the difference, where pretty much anything goes and consequences to your choices have meaning and value. Where there’s room for the shittiest of the shittiest which thus also means that if people do positive things it’s actually meant and because they wanted to, not because the main stream carebear game forced them to.
I hate instancing (to me it destroys the immersion)
I’m not good with fast reaction FPS games (EVE is effectively an RTS, ideal for slow/old folks like me)
I like the idea of being able to take advantage of low effort, low IQ, lazy and unprepared idiots: the folks who normally fck up your online coop games like 43% winrate players in World of Tanks who after 40k games still say their stats are bad because they have bad luck with teams, do stupid ■■■■ all the time while whining about how his team sucks and there’s NOTHING you can do about it when you have those clowns on your team. They’re literally worse than Wargaming themselves.
I like consequences to choices and (in)actions, both good as bad
From my perspective I don’t think there’s any real competition to EVE and that’s why I’ve been playing it for 17 years (on and off). I ALSO think that this is why and how EVE still survives and why trying to make the game more mainstream and cuddling casuals is what’s going to be its downfall because to casuals there are indeed “tons of games” which it then has to compete with, which it can’t. By being, and remaining, niche it will always have a devout following (even if they keep fcking up).
Which is also why I don’t have a problem with change, even if it’s change that negatively affects my play style, as it means the low effort folks get weeded out. I didn’t always think like that, I raged HARD when Team 5 Clowns fcked up solo wardecs but these days I’m at a point where I’m more holistic going “change is good, lets see what happens and who comes out on top”.
I agree.
yet microbiology is life now known to be found on moons, why not on 'roids?
To answer my own question:
PI already pushed this boundary. I did not complain then as I do now because I have exploited the cheap labour for isk. I admit my IC shame.
" 6b Gila