I would imagine its more like the more receptive Caldari here have seen countless faceless Gallante trying to preach to them “a new way” rehashed and thus don’t bother. Reputations everything.
But what do I know, I’m Matari and someone who generally ignores the new faces preaching how we should get along with the Amarr. Give it time and make your intentions known. I can garrantee you you will be much better received when they’re alot more familiar with you. Theres always people who appear for a week and go away once no one pays them attention. Don’t be one of them any you may be successful.
When one considers that if the Empress tells Lai Dai to jump and their response is, “How high?” Or the continued leverage they possess over its largest corporation, Kaalakiota, then on matters of peace and rapprochement the issue remains better directed to the Amarr Empire than the Caldari State itself.
Your addressing capsuleers here. As I previously stated, Without any history to go with your words, don’t expect much. I don’t have to be Caldari (though I’m currently employed by them) to tell you the obvious. Spend some time talking to theae people you seek to sway and you’ll see results, either good or bad.
Unless your the type to stand at a street corner for hours listening to random people talk and hand you fliers this should be obvious that weight to your words comes from credibility.
I can only judge on experience, Miss Vess, and so far I have yet to meet a Caldari that has desired peace with the Federation. If you talk of history, then I do remember the days of the Foiritain Administration, when the desire for peace led to reductions in the defense budget and the mothballing of a large part of the Federal Fleet. What exactly did that get the Federation but to leave us open to attack by Caldari opportunists?
My experience thus far has led me to the conclusion that indeed, in relations with the Caldari, men such as President Roden and Director Blaque do have the right of it.
I thank you for the advice, discussion does appear a wasted endeavour and it is something that should not be pursued in future.
And that says a clown, who when placed against fact and Caldari point of view started showering me with insults, filled with hatred and anger, finally degrading himself to degree to scream a badly composed song?
Really?
I don’t know, if you used to live in a crystal box, expecting to listen only to your reflections. But the world doesn’t work like that. There are people with opinions different than yours. There are facts that contradict your narrow-minded world view. And if you aren’t ready to discuss them - just go back to your federal kennel where you popped from and stop writing trash in public media.
There are many gallente propagandists already who tried to speak nonsence and lies about me, just because I cornered them down with facts. You have lost it, and lost terribly, by keeping beating like a fish on a red hot pan you only dig your grave deeper.
Facts are on my side, and now all readers can see that.
Learn to discuss, and most important, learn to listen, learn to admit your mistakes, then it won’t be a wasted endeavor. Putting yourself on a pedestal and crying “Rafal is right because Rafal said so” will not bring you anywhere, especially when you contradict what everyone else see.
Quite frankly, from what I can see among the capsuleers that frequent here or on the summit channels, if it’s not a competition between people to see who can be the biggest edgelord, it’s just attempts to “win” arguments at any cost by being as trite, pedantic, and contrarian as possible while thinking they’re so clever no one else can see the attempts for what they are. Anyone can do that, I have done so in this thread myself – but it’s really just petty, boring and a waste of time.
If, as others have said, discussion comes at the price of building “credibility” then I will not do it here because New Eden seems a far more interesting place to be than forcing myself to speak with people who would rather be victorious by thinking every form of dialogue has to be adversarial, all the while never realizing why they’re talking in empty channels sitting atop their thrones of ■■■■ they’ve built for themselves.
People come here to share opinions, to learn, to talk, even to argue - there’s nothing wrong with it. But when you start insulting people for their opinions, when you speak about other authors, claiming that to be “opinion”, when you outright attack other speakers when they bring facts against your words - you indeed lose your credibility and soon will be doomed to speak with empty wall. I myself, and I bet majority of other readers, already aren’t interested in trying to discuss with you serious matters, taking into account your manner of participating in discussion.
Try someday to listen to other people instead of erecting said thrones for yourself, there is a whole world out there.
Realize this thing: in a proper discussion both parties should be interested in finding the truth, and not build thrones like you, screaming at every fact that shatters cardhouse you were trying to hold. I am myself excited to find opponent who can use facts against me, who can show mistakes in my ways, so I could refine them and improve my point of view.
But I am generally not interested in listening to scum, who instead of attacking my ideas starts crying and insulting me instead, trying to make up more and more lies about my person, or discuss me instead of my worldview. That’s just pathetic, you know.
Maybe you will use this information and someday we will be able to talk. Maybe not, but then… just go to hell.
Respectfully, sir, if you came to this conclusion so easily, you might have a little in common with them. And of course the suspicion will be that you always did.
I read your work with a lot of interest, particularly in your discussion of Gallentean history, which I don’t know an awful lot about. If you really want to avoid or even mitigate, as you say, “total war,” you should be slow to absorb some of the lessons you seem to want to take from all of this.
So much care, so much thought, and your conclusion is that we’re warmongering barbarians after all? Or puppets of the Amarr?
Speaking as someone who is actually maybe kind of a puppet of the Amarr, I’m not so sure the Caldari very much approve of this place of mine. Their pride is as resistant to the Empire as to the Federation. Just, the Empire seems to accept the balance of power and Caldari boundaries more willingly, and doesn’t have the same kind of history of violence-- or of “Deliverance.”
The Empire, as of yet, has no significant history of waging “cultural warfare” on the State.
It seems a little like this is anger and frustration talking, sir.
No, it is disappointment, at least with this platform and venue. I will derive hope that at least where governments and leaders are concerned, and as can be seen between the Federation and Ishukone corporation, there remain those who can hold to the principle that the art of negotiation requires compromise and accepting getting less than what you may want in the interests of peace.
I am not interested in wasting my time with what seems the majority capsuleer perspective of trying to win arguments at any cost by spouting off trite counter-factuals and trying to reach any justifications at all for their use of weapons.
What you’ve said as far as the nature of this place … it’s not untrue, exactly. This place is a battlefield of sorts. Few who write here are really writing to the person they write to; mostly they’re writing to an unseen audience of onlookers. That might be true even of me. It’s a natural site for grandstanding and propaganda, and it gets used for those a lot.
The natural assumption by a lot of people is that you’re just joining in and doing the same thing-- that your claims to objectivity and scholarship are a front for a political agent with an agenda to push. Old campaigners like Pieter will be on the lookout for signs that that’s the case, and call you on them.
Even if he’s wrong about your attitude and purpose, it’s not like it’s not a well-founded assumption he’s making. After all, what he’s accusing you of is just what most speakers here do.
Again, this place is a meeting and speaking house for people from across the full political spectrum, not of nations, but of the whole cluster. Almost everybody has an agenda, and even if you don’t it’ll be assumed that you do; that’s just bound to be how things tend to go. I got accused of being an Amarrian agent probably a dozen times before I really was one.
That’s not all it can be, though. I do believe that.
Initially, this was an intellectually engaging post. Now that Vausienne has demonstrated the belief that Caldari interest in sovereignty over the homeworld is simply a pretext for war, however, I think we’ve all been disabused of the notion that Vausienne is an unbiased observer.
On a more serious note while I am not a member of the State any more and I do think that humans as a whole are better off uniting and discarding these notions of bloodlines, part of me does see Home as…well…Home.
I would welcome peaceful resolutions to all conflicts if possible. But war profits evil men to too great an extent. ISK for suffering, in this modern world we all inhabit. Your leaders extend this because most of them simply do not care.