Increase the Danger for Everyone !

Not just a little, but a lot !

Make the Local-Chat of All Systems (High-Low-Null) run as in Wormhole Space !

To make matters worse - make the use of the D-Scanner and the Probe-Scanner a double-edged sword - revealing to the nearby ships the presence of someone scanning in the vicinity - because of the sound generated by the radio waves vibrating the ship’s hull.

(Not my first language.)


lol, when I first read the thread title, I thought it was about fitting Deadspace mods on ships and the risks associated with it.

Regarding Local chat, I think high sec, low sec and w-hole Local should all stay as they currently are, just have null sec Local be delayed.

Now about having your ship position revealed when using D-scan - No

As for ships probing for you, immersion wise I could accept that if those ships were uncloaked, probe scans returning to their ship could reveal it’s location only if your own ship was within D-scan range to get the coordinates.

Before you rabble about risk, you should first of participate in EVE at all. You have no killboard and judging by your corp’s history, the existing risk in EVE is more than you or your corp mates can cope with because it is filled with nothing but incompetent losses. The currently available risk is more than sufficient for people like you to be totally overwhelmed.

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+1 Nullsec shouldn’t have local.

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It seems to be a stealth nerf afk cloakies thread anyhow.

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WH’s do not have very large fleets able to jump in on you with a cyno, whereas nullsec and low sec do. If you cannot work out the balance implications of that in terms of most peoples gameplay then you should not put finger to keyboard.

The balance is perfectly fine as it is.

But if you insist then let us expose WH space to the full joy of hot drops while we are at it, you will soon run begging to have it as it was.

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Not your first language and not the first time you make no sense with your demands at all…

The game is way too dangerous for a game that has to compete in todays market,it has to have MORE security,MORE safe places and LESS unsanctioned (by both sides(like in duels)) pvp.

What you demand is the total OPPOSITE of what should be done in order to stop the players from bleeding out of this game.

Not MORE danger is the answer LESS is.

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EVE doesn’t need less risk - OP is right that it needs more.

But it needs the level of risk to vary depending on rational principles.

Right now, highSec is more dangerous than “owned” nullSec. Experienced players choose when they fight (if ever) and why. New players are easily griefed in highSec.

Both bittervets and CCP say “it’s a sandbox”.
Bittervets because they don’t want to change anything about the environment that’s put them were they are (minimal risks, minimal combat, huge income for minimal effort). It’s rational. You’d think they would be bored, but that’s what the sendbox “selects” for.

CCP is a mystery. They must have been seeing new-player retention problems for most of the life of EVE. They do things, but they don’t seem to believe in" The Law of Unintended Consequences", which is stupid in a game that “selects” the kind of player that sticks around in EVE.
CCP’s many game “improvements” seem always to benefit vets, and have no positive effect on newer players. But of course “sandbox design” suits lazy designers: they don’t have to consider the result - just the technical stuff.

An equivalent law is “Everybody games the system”. Combine that with a player base that enjoys driving away rookies, and unmanaged “sandbox-design” will certainly not help beginner retention.

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Keeping it as it is is suicide in a game market that does the opposite this game does.

You HAVE to adapt to what is done by the ovwewhelmimg majority of your competitors or things like what actually happens to this game occur,your players bleed away to your competitors…

There simply is no need for “difficulty” or “high demand”…call it “sign of the time” or whatever but face it and adapt to it.

Elitism talks about “tradition” or “eve is special” will not help,nor will conservatism…only adaption to the reality will…

And this means do what other games do and stop whining about “this is not my eve anymore”,just face the reality…

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This, having no local works in WH space, local however is the correct balance for nullsec when you have a game mechanic that can drop a large force on you in the blink of an eye. But that can not be applied in WH space.

That is a question of rational balance.



I agree the numbers don’t look good for EVE. But I don’t believe changing those numbers would be easy.

For example “Make EVE Safer” sounds like a nice easy objective. But it would make EVE into a completely different game. I can’t see a way to get from here to there that didn’t kill the current game (and CCP’s income from EVE) along the way.

Make EVE more welcoming for new players is possible. But not, I think, for CCP. It’s impossible to be sure, but I think they’ve left it too late. Changing EVE too quickly would also expose the game to the “you can’t get there from here” problem. Changing it too little or too slowly risks a fatal income squeeze along the way.

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TBH I’ve not found safety as such being the big barrier - sure you get some - what I found put off a lot of new players that I knew IRL or from other games I tried to help get into Eve was when they realised there was often no meaningful way to get back at the people who’d suicide ganked them, etc. a lot would have stayed if they could have realistically plotted some kind of revenge, etc.

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I don’t have the experience to make suggestions of this kind, but I have a comment anyway:

I’ve always found the various ways for gathering information in EVE to be random and absolutely terrible.

Information about the environment matters a lot. The means for obtaining it should have been designed and tuned to near-perfection long ago. Chat channels should not have been part of that design.

It could have been a very interesting part of EVE. Instead (IMO) we have an important capability that’s so over-complicated and irrational it feels as though it was designed to be an “anti-rookie” feature.


Interesting comment - it applies to me as well :slight_smile:

I don’t play games to be safe, but nor do I play to be a victim. And I have no interest in being a victim for a while, then “balancing things out” by ruthlessly oppressing helpless victims myself.

I sometimes wonder if CCP understand that new players are assessing the game provider as well as the game. The relationship between a gamer and a complex MMO involves a significant commitment of time. If you can’t see a good place to be in the medium/long term and a good way forward, and/or you don’t see evidence that the provider is committed to providing and improving those things, the rational decision is to leave forever.


Yeah same for me - I don’t play to play other people’s games, I don’t play to be a victim - if people put in the effort to beat me, etc. fair enough.

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Why do you think it is an anti-rookie feature, it is simple and easy.

I agree with this a lot, which is why CCP lost a lot of players.

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Lots of things are simple and easy when you understand them well, and have become fast and efficient in using them. Like walking :slight_smile: And almost anything in the technical side of the IT business.

As a “serial rookie”, I’ve tried to figure out how to behave in hostile places multiple times. Each time it’s been such a PITA I just left it on the (very long) list of things to look at again later.

But I stop playing immediately when I get bored with the game as a whole, and I’ve never got around to learning how to collect and use the information I’d need for situational awareness in dangerous places.

I have no idea if I’m representative of other players, but for me the amount of obscure and unintuitive information and techniques needed to have fun with EVE PvP is off the scale. Of course I could learn, but the process is boring, so it just never gets to the top of the stack.

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I understood local as soon as I started playing, D-scan took a bit longer to work out the tricks, but I did read up on it and practiced it. I am still not that good at combat probing, but anyway…

Situational awareness is only that you have to understand your vulnerability. For example I used to operate in a NPC nullsec system which had hostiles living there too. I had to set myself up to be difficult to catch and was the understanding of the environment and how they could catch me. I would have different warp in points bookmarked around the belts, so I could warp into them and they would never know which one. I would then warp down from that at range to a roid that enabled me to align to a top of the list safe and be in range of the rats to kite them in my drake. My period of vulnerability being if they guess right on the 10 safe spots I had around each belt…, and of course the time they had to get on me before I was aligned.

Eve is a game of outsmarting other players by knowing what they can do and using what you can to reduce your risk. I had a huge amount of fun frustrating the hell out of brainless people who thought it was their right to easily catch someone doing PvE. Hell I could tell you some really amusing stories doing this, and I have to say this is why you don’t really get Eve, I am not being insulting but explaining that to me that was fun and still is fun.


I think people missunderstand EVE.
If you want to be efficient at PVE, you need to know how works PVP. Because it’s a PVP focused game. That’s it.

And tbh, you don’t need to know so much things to fly safely, whatever where.

About OP’s risk demand: It looks like what you want is easier mechanics for pirates. Maybe you should try your hand at piracy first before asking for that.
Also, if you want more risk: Take a Dominix, no mwd, add 500 plex in your cargo (yea, cargo) and go fly in Delve or any populated NS area. Here you have, risk.


I get that avoiding danger is fun. I didn’t learn that in EVE, but it’s not the only “free-fire” PvP game.

For me it’s part of the “startup threshold” for EVE. It’s an issue with any complex game, but EVE is an extreme example. Basic things like what information is important and available; how do you gather that information; bookmarking; stupid things like bumping, how CONCORD react to different actions, etc; what happens at gates; are actually essential knowledge for rookies straight out of the rookie systems they spawn in.

Many will still be unclear about EVE “basics” when they leave it forever.

I chose access to “sensor information” because it matches the topic (and because the interfaces are either weird (local chat for key PvP data) or terrible (D-Scan, probes), but it’s just one example of many … and an obvious design oversight that could have been addressed at any time without upsetting anyone too much.