Hot Dropping Shenanigans?

Communications Center General Discussion
21

Because the shininess of modules doesnt equate to actual skill of using the ship.

Most players who fly capitals, and know how to, dont fund their ships using real world currency. They are knowledgable, rich enough and know avenues of making isk that they do not require this.

I almost only use real world money to actually sub my account. Sometimes i get a little extra with the “3 months omega time and get a free X”, but most of my isk comes from trading or PI or mining or ratting or incursions. Just look at Delve for example, the imperium is raking in so much isk through PVE that they can effectively replace the isk required for a titan in like 4 hours.

Infact, id rather see and laugh at someone who is a day old, flying around in a titan and trying to dock it in a regular station. Whenever ive fought with someone, ive never thought that the cost of my modules were to blame. I never said to myself “Damn, if only i had spent 10 bill on officer modules instead of getting these cheap Tech 2 variants. I wouldve won that fight”.

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22

If you have caps, why would you ever venture outside of your cap umbrella?

But the example player was killed by a carrier. Carriers have always been able to kill smaller ships, but have traditionally sucked at killing larger capitals. There is no change to carriers, they have always been effective at sub-caps. None of what you say applies to your example.

The thing about Anti-sub fits for dreads, is that they are meant for battleships and battlecruisers, cruisers. They suck at hitting frigs and destroyers. And even then, they require a lot of webs and painters to be effective, making them utterly ineffective against capitals. They are either a sub-cap cruiser+ hitting dread, or an anti-capital dread. Which means they are screwed if even a single dread comes on field.

And i think thats fine. Whats the problem with this? They are risking multi-billion isk ships.

Carriers would still be killing sub-cap ships.

Dont rat/mine/do stuff outside your own dread umbrella, unless youre actively looking for fights. In which case, youll find one.

I do roams with Spectre fleet sometimes. we mainly roam lowsec. Ive never been dropped on.

The only thing you can provide, is small examples of people getting hot dropped on from time to time. Its not like the person you linked, Faustien Whitman, is just constantly getting dropped on, with his killboard entirely red for days on end, and all his deaths stemming from capital ships.

Infact, the only other death to capital ships that hes had in the past 2 months was when he himself was flying a dread, against other dreads.

I dont think there is a problem here. I dont think this is a problem.

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23

There’s no problem. I’ve never been killed by a capship or cap drop. I’ve been out in null the last couple of weeks (I don’t belong to a null alliance either, i.e. everyone is an enemy). But I haven’t been killed by a capship, ever. But I’ve been killed by sabers bazillions of times, gate camps bazillions of times, frigates bazillions of times (when flying battleships no less), jackdaws, and tengus. So what about the menace of subcaps? Can we do something about that?

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24

@Solonius_Rex
You’re taking a small example of dropping caps as a literal argument for the entire OP. I get what carriers are for…

The only thing you can provide, is small examples of people getting hot dropped on from time to time. Its not like the person you linked, Faustien Whitman, is just constantly getting dropped on, with his killboard entirely red for days on end, and all his deaths stemming from capital ships.

1 example is the entire argument of the post. This one example spans into hundreds or thousands of players. Yes, you go to low sec, not get hot dropped. But go to a lowsec pocket from highsec, The ones that can’t be reached from null alliances. I bet your experiences will change.

Also, you’re looking at a single player. Expand your horizons. Look more into just one example.

But you don’t think there is a problem. Which is cool. Like I said, I was curious on others opinions.

@Beast_of_Revelations I feel null is safer, not as many people drop caps in null unless they know they have backup. In null you hardly see a cap hot drop on a frigate or and SINGLE sub-cap. But in lowsec, including these highsec pockets, that I’m assuming are there for highsec players to venture into occasionally, this is a very common thing.

25

If you want to see a higher level of autism, try Aridia. I don’t know why Amarr space is so cancerous.

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26

Im not the one who used that pilot as an example. You did.

Did you just open Zkillboard and pick a random guy killed by a cap? And then used it to say “Hey, look, i found someone who lost a subcap to a capital, therefore my argument is valid”?

So why would you go there.

I mean, lowsec leads into nullsec, so there are very very few parts of lowsec that cannot be reached from nullsec.

But if youre going to a section of lowsec where you just keep getting hotdropped on by capitals, and you hate it, i mean, are you mentally ill? Why would you keep going back if you keep having a bad experience? its like going to a restaurant, getting food poisoning every time, and yet you keep going back to the same restaurant over and over again. Its stupid. Only an idiot would do this.

Your example.

Again, it was your example.

It was a poor example, yes. But it was yours.

As i said above, only an idiot would keep going back to the same restaurant after getting food poisoning every time. Only an idiot would keep going back to the same pocket of lowsec after getting hotdropped on every time.

Someone who gets hotdropped on, once every year or so, even once every 6 months or so, isnt a problem. How could it be. One out of every 100 fights, one out of every 1000 fights where you get hotdropped on, isnt a problem.

Everything you say, is completely devoid of reason and logic.

If you think there is a problem, then provide the example, or explain why someone being hotdropped once every year is a problem.

So what is the example, of this mysterious person, who keeps getting hotdropped on in lowsec, every week? Cause the example you provided, sucks.

27

hate to break it to you, but plex, character trading etc has been in the game damn near since day 1 so “supporting yourself strictly through in game” has NEVER been the original intent, a perfectly valid option sure, but the beauty of a sandbox is that there are many ways to play in it. besides, so what if a 6 day old character can fly an officer fit gila, its still not an “I win button” player skill has always been far more important than in game skill, and officer mods can certainly give you an edge, but its only an edge if you are evenly matched to begin with.

how does it hurt you, or the game, if someone wants to give the people who run the game a whole bunch of money, and then give plex to a whole bunch of players in order to become a super shiny killmail for someone else.

28

Confirmed, cancer. :mask:

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29

lol, then go find other examples. They are easy to find.

The point of the OP was simply to ask if others thought the hot dropping was too common of an occurrence and if capitals should be changed, in your own opinion. Not to dissect someones point of view and destroy it with your own logic regardless of how flawed or perfect it is.

Obviously your answer is no, they shouldn’t. Noted. :slight_smile:

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30

Thats the point. I couldnt find any.

Remember, in your own words:

Well, no, it was a crappy example, as you yourself have admitted.

I cant find any example.

So, where is yours?

And the point of my own post is to dissect your post because it was poorly written.

Everything you write is fair play, because its relevant to this thread, because you wrote it in this thread.

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31

ok. o/

32

K, ISD can close this thread now. OP has conceded defeat.

33

No it isn’t.

I once lost a ratting VNI to a Pandemic Legion Nyx. Alt came into my site, pointed and webbed me and dropped it on me before I could kill the cyno ship. A Freaking NYX lol.

I laughed about it (eventually, I was a bit incredulous for a few minutes :slight_smile: ), it was overkill, but there is no such thing as overkill in EVE, especially in null sec. I didn’t run to the forums asking for Nyxes to be nerfed, I realized that I need to react better to freaking Prospects with Cynos (which is why my VNIs now have energy neutralizers on them, can’t point me with zero cap lol).

EVE is about dealing with adversity, overcoming it. I used the pain (small though it was) of losing that VNI to help me get better at the game. Now I purposefully use Bait VNIs and ishtars to get kills, like this one and this one.

Also, just some friendly advice; Invoking “the children…I mean new players” doesn’t work, in fact, it backfires. Since time began, people have been trying to use the idea that something they don’t like somehow hurts some weak group (children, the elderly, new players in MMOs) to convince other people that whatever it is they are bagging on at the time is so bad it needs to be dealt with.

The problem with that ‘tactic’ is that it’s desperate and it means you really are just hating on something just to hate on it. It means you know your arguments are too weak to stand on their own merits so you have to lean on a crutch (‘omg think of the new players’) for help.

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34

Makes sense baiting is viable, on caps it is really viable if you have the caps or fleet to stop them.

Umm, in terms of your opinion on invoking new players, I’m not desperate, it’s an opinion asking of others opinions. and I never actually said or implied to “think of the new players”. The question asking if you think it deters new players is a viable question when the population of eve is no 30k at max, considering 1/4 if not more of that are probably alts. Now if we say, think of the small players, such as smaller corps, then maybe.

To clarify, my disagreements with the way capitals work as of now is simply, in many “pocket” regions, there is hardly any risk in dropping caps on everything. Compared to null or eve low sec pipes. My thought process to handle something like so, is to make capitals fight capitals and structures. This would stop caps being used on sub caps and allow sub cap fleets to actually mean something more than just to be cannon fodder as soon as HAW caps drop in. Give Carriers better fighters to fight caps or what ever else makes caps do their thing.

Then 2nd, I’m saying to increase the jump range so people in caps, have more opportunities to fight others in caps such as hunting, or gaining more targets from afar thus giving more cap content.

These 2 things would make a lot of other groups, more cautious with caps. Leading to more sub cap fights that even possibly smaller corps can fight slightly larger corps and win depending on skill. Maybe I’m used to when people said caps were expensive and didn’t tell anyone they had caps. Meh who knows.

35

There were few people who could fly all titans when I started playing, There was nothing like a SP trading or rorqual mining, dreads were used to bash POS and titans were really a pain in the back to fly and not lose to hunters, they could wait for whole night untill logged off, located titan pilot comes online to catch it.

I think all this stuff that came recently made game too easy for cap pilots. But it is what CCP wants, make players train into it, PLEX is selling. Space whales online.

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36

I feel like you need more combat experience. Because just about everything you talk about with caps making subcaps useless isn’t actually how things play out in large scale.

Every large battle I have ever been a part of. Has had a mixture of anti-capital caps. Anti-sub caps. And a large fleet of subcapital support on both sides. It creates a rock paper scissors scenario.

Now granted in small gang warfare a cap vs several battleships is going to have the upper hand. But a battleship vs a few cruisers is the same thing. So should battleships be removed since they roll most cruisers? Or should we get rid of everything larger than frigates because that way only rookie ships will be outclassed.

37

@Bjorn_Tyrson
I’m not talking about Large scale PvP. Although the mechanics in large scale wouldn’t change as much with the changes, because in large scale, caps are always on standby.

And yes, this is mainly about small gang vs cap.

Maybe I do need more combat experience. I’ve only lived in null my whole life but am new to capitals really. But why would we get rid of anything bigger than frigates. I never once said to “get rid” of anything. I simply suggested changing something.

38

To the June 29, 2005 there were no capital ships in EVE. Null existed with conquerable stations tho. I didnt played then tho, but I imagine the level of entry of player entities to null and end game were rather flattened before that date.

39

To me it’s like asking if gate camping is too common and if it needs to be changed.

Don’t get me wrong. I find the practice you describe asinine. But I find a lot of player practices asinine. I find gate camps asinine. I find sitting there at a station sniping people who undock asinine. I find hunting noobs asinine (saw a weeks old player ganked in his destroyer just last night by some 15 year old player flying a blinged-out high-end ship). I could sit here for the next hour listing things I find asinine. I don’t know why capships should be singled out for change because of asinine tactics or practices that could be used with them.

40

Gate Camping: there are plenty of practices to avoid gate camping and still achieve your goal
Station Camping: Use instant undocks
Hunting “Noobs”: umm… ok

I mean the reason cap ships were brought up as opposed to everything in the game is because the post doesn’t say, “Everything you would change in eve…”. -.- because we all know that would be a massive post from everyone.

Also, if you find such things asinine, why not voice your opinion on it. You may be right or even wrong. But at the end of the day, it’s a game. plain and simple. Devs can change things and they may. But I do know that posting on their own forums won’t cause them to change anything. Gotta post on their reddit :stuck_out_tongue: