How does EVE lore explain miners?

Whether you see this as roleplaying or not, my point stands: Mining is neither waste of time or people, nor is it something the lore does not validate or encourage. Quite the contrary, with the above examples the lore heavily encourages mining because those miners are the people who provide not only the basis for a flourishing empire

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Instead of mining you can employ other numpties to do it for you by simply placing a buy order on the market :slight_smile: Capsuleers will do anything for a buck (and there’s your lore).

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Neither was anyone else here. I get it that you gave a cranky about how people do not always get that ganking is part of the game but this thread was not about that.

I agree with this completely! I wasn’t disagreeing on your point, I was just saying that on these lore forums part, there’s this Lore Discussion that is for players to talk about lore and the Intergalactic Part that is for roleplaying.

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I suppose not all people want to kill for a living… Mining, industry seem like acceptable ways to make and isk and improve the lifes of the people they would interact with. As for pride of one’s parents, I imagine our IG characters parents would be very disappointed in most of us for our past and future actions. Without these Miners there would be nothing, just one massive slow battle royale until the last ship was left…

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I’ve read it. I’m not sure if you’re trying to make a point with this.

The problem is that instead of doing any research you just incorrectly assumed something.

By the way, the New Player ‘Corvette’ starter ship comes equipped with both a Civilian Weapon and a Civilian Mining Laser.

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If CCP follow my suggestion and make it so that instead of barge mining it could be done with the PI interface so people choose PI materials or PI Ore mining.

Obviously people worry (BS, falsely, lying), that this will “crash” the market, moon mining didn’t really do much and since everyone is not out mining (lies), but PVPing (lies), especially since yields for ore can be controlled on amounts daily by CCP it can be as good or as meh as they want it to be.

Some people say BOTS (lies), if you can yield more with barge mining why would you PI ore mine, and if they already plex their accounts then they already found a winning plan so they will just keep BOT mining in space.

Anyway.

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I pour concrete sidewalks in real life and one of my coworkers was literally a rocket scientist for Boeing. He hated it and loved his college ditch digging job more. It made no sense at all to me but he was happier bring a pig in mud like the rest of us

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For a good lore reason, maybe they heard about the high mortality rate among miners with pirates and other scum, so they became capsuleers to be able to keep mining and supporting their families if they get attacked. Or they worked for various mining conglomerates who encouraged their employees to do it for the same reasons.

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I’m not sure how EVE Lore itself explains it, but this is the way I do:

Geology and Geophysics is a high level science dedicated to… you guessed it… mining. More the science behind it, but if you look at what skill you absolutely must have to fly a procurer, it happens to be Astrogeology, which is likely the next stage of Geology.

Both of these would require a full degree, and perhaps even a masters, and then a few other certifications besides that to become a proper Astrogeologist and Surveyor.

That’s how I explain why I ended up in “mining”. I am not the one doing the heavy labour (probably no one really does anymore, it’s all done by machines and drones) but I am the highly educated and qualified expert charged with finding the best sites and deciding what should be mined and when. I’m responsible for negotiating the best prices and making sure the raw ore is properly refined and smelted, and perhaps the resulting metals and other material is sent where it needs to be.

My job, as a “miner” in New Eden isn’t mining per se. It’s a lump term for someone that on Old Earth would be actually sitting in an office looking over data.

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Not sure if troll or not but hay…

before CCP updated the NPE in incarna, you would have to pick a Race, Bloodline and school.

race would dictate base hull skills.
bloodline would dictate customization options & secondary starting skills
School Would dictate starting Core skill set & starting NPC corp.

as was previously stated picking your character was a big thing in eve, not so much today.

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I think the challenges of being a miner in space is just that… being a miner in space. You need to fly the ship, run it’s modules and all that capsuleer jazz. Not to mention you’re supposed to be on point and avoid ganks ( I happen to know this isn’t the case for most miners haha ).

Nearly a month since this was posted, but what the hell. It’s a legitimate question that deserves an answer.

CCP quite rightly tries to link the lore and gameplay together as tightly as they can - and more power to them for that - but at the end of the day they run into the issue that it’s still a game. Players are not going to behave in ways that real people in a real universe would, even if those people can come back from the dead.

Let’s face it, there are a lot of player and NPC behaviors that simply don’t make sense when viewed strictly from a lore perspective. Ratting may be an endless source of in-game profit, but if the crew guidelines CCP gave us are accurate then the Equilibrium of Mankind would probably view capsuleers as the manifestation of God’s will; with the amount of ratting going on we’ve probably killed the entire population of New Eden a thousand times over!

Then there’s the loss of supercapital ships. Maybe you’ve heard this clip before, where Grath is raging and everyone else is laughing off the loss of multiple supercaps, including an extremely rare and valuable Revenant-class supercarrier. If this weren’t a game then Grath wouldn’t be the outlier in that clip, he’d be just one of many very, very angry capsuleers who’d be fixing to hunt down the traitor responsible for leading them into that trap and killing him permanently. Hell, that whole trap probably wouldn’t have happened at all because they would’ve actually used the intel network Grath was ranting about instead of jumping in blind.

Then there’s the players’ behavior regarding the ships we fly; specifically, their crews. Even with the presence of escape pods, the utterly cavalier disregard that players have for their ships would likely result in extreme crew shortages across the whole of New Eden, especially with the number of highly-trained specialists Titans are said to need to operate their systems. Training people to do that takes time, which would limit the number of people available to work as a member of a titan’s crew, and most of them would be snapped up by the empires before capsuleers could even make their pitch.

Then there’s people like CODE, who’re ultimately harmless IRL because it’s just a video game, but if it were real do you seriously think that the empires would have any sense of humor about some random capsuleer declaring that he makes the rules now and everyone’s going to follow them or die? CODE. limits their antics to players because it’s a game and everyone knows it, but I somehow doubt that they’d have the same restraint if they could extort “permits” out of the NPC miners we can find in hisec (or maybe they would, James was smart enough to make nice with Goonswarm instead of ticking them off and getting pounded for it).

How long do you think the empires would tolerate him and CODE, much less the annual Burn Jita (and the one Burn Amarr) events that Goonswarm hosts and CODE plays a significant part in? How many people would be willing to sign on to a CODE Catalyst once word got out that their M.O. includes heavy use of suicide ganking?

Speaking of Goonswarm, they’re particularly relevant to this discussion because one of the major complaints about them and other major alliances is that living in their space is too safe. EVE is a video game, so this is a valid complaint, but in real life no one would be complaining about it because - wonder of wonders - people enjoy feeling safe!

The same arguments can be made for gameplay updates. CCP isn’t changing the ships you can mount cynosural beacons on because it makes sense from a lore perspective; it’s been rather explicitly stated that this is one of the measures they believe will improve the long-term health of the game. CCP_Falcon has even told us some of the changes he’d make if he had the power to do so, and while I think they have merit from the perspective of game balance there are zero reasons for anyone in-universe to stop using HAWs or to limit capital ships in the ways he described in that post. The whole basis of RL warfare is to tip the scales in your favor as far as you possibly can, and the big power blocs that can field entire fleets of capital ships would be constantly looking for newer and better ways to cement their power, while smaller alliances would be desperately trying to get their hands on as many capital ships, crew, and qualified pilots as they possibly could.

I could go on, but I think I’ve said enough. If you disagree with anything I’ve said, please say so. I enjoy a friendly debate!:slightly_smiling_face:

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CODE. supports the NPC miners. They are lawful miners with mining permits. We never shoot at them. It’s the illegal capsuleer miners that the empires have requested that we deal with.

And do you have any Official Documentation to support your claim?

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Aiko, please drop the roleplaying. We’re not in-game at the moment, so it’s unnecessary and not very productive to the discussion at hand. As far as I can tell, James enjoys pissing other people off and doesn’t like bots because they’re bad for the game, so he started CODE. because that would let him fulfill his desires in what one could argue is a constructive manner. I have to admit that the amount of effort he puts into what he does is pretty impressive, no matter how pretentious he acts.

Also, if there is any concrete in-game evidence supporting what CODE. does then please link it here or stop lying to us. I realize that claiming you’re calling the shots in hisec is all part of the CODE. persona, but everyone knows that this is just one of the numerous lies you spout to justify your in-game actions and piss off whoever you’re jerking around at the moment. And no, acknowledgement from the devs that what you do is permitted by the game’s rules doesn’t count, I’m talking about in-universe acknowledgement by the empires that what you do has their official support.

Actually, come to think of it, I might be setting you up for failure there. CODE.‘s behavior and roleplaying is probably too meta for that. James’ New Order declaration only makes sense in the context of a video game what with his talk of bots and AFK mining.

In any case, I think that if this were a real universe, CODE. never would have started because the empires would have much more thorough and involved procedures that capsuleers would need to deal with in order to operate within Empire space. I’ll sleep on that thought, it might be a productive line of thinking to explore.

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Aiko, please don`t drop the roleplaying

Aiko, please put the roleplaying where it belongs and don’t troll with it in explicitly OOC venues.

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In lore terms as far as I’m concerned we’re only mining highly condensed or highly rare minerals in space. There’s only a few minerals we refine, a ship would be built from so much more, but mostly stuff so common it isn’t worth mentioning (much like planetary currency),

We’re effectively finding asteroids made of rare earth metals, tritium, gold etc that are required for high tech equipment.

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Mongol Empire?