Every one of your examples is played by people, and throughout this time, the number of people in mission hubs has gone down. Clone soldiers is an example of something that I have done as variation content when living in solitude - typically when the anomolies and signatures I was interested in ran out. Sleepers, I helped other people with when they spawned too much in the last event. epic arcs I can always tell in cas or ccg when someone is running showtime, and dagan is a habitual icebreaker for CAS chat introducing new players. (if you run the epics, you can also see other people are doing it because they show up at the agents, and in the systems you run your missions in).
I also have done level 4 missions recently, in a thalia, repping other frigates. However that content is content that new players grow out of, and the last thing we want them to become is resource amount obsessed automatons like you.
CCP has done nothing BUT new the last 9 years with PVE. They sure didn’t spend that time making new missions, DED complexes and anomalies.
The entire point of what I’m saying is that it’s going no where. This is because PVE players aren’t PVPrs:
PVE players try new content but go back to what is comfortable (missions, anomalies, complexes, exploration)
PVP players like dynamic/ever changing situations, but AI isn’;t a good substitute for it for they just PVP with real people.
And that’s the problem, CCP is making PVE that PVEr’s won’t like because it’s not static, and that PVPrs won’t like because it’s ‘imitation PVP’. It’s a waste of time when CCP could be adding the things that PVE players DEMONSTRATE they like (missions, anomalies, complexes, new exploration content, etc).
I simply hate the pie in the sky thinking that leads to these situations, both from CCP and from players who don’t understand their own wants and needs.
You can dislike the fact that PVErs like what we like, but it doesn’t change the fact that we like what we like, and we don’t like the fantasy BS people like you like. Some of us can be honest about our game playing preferences, and some can’t.
What do you want people to do? Abandon the way they like to play EVE and all of a sudden embrace the kind of content that CCP has been introducing for 9 years with little success?
This is why I laugh when people like you say 'better pve" Better for whom, because it’s not better is no one is doing it. You could make the argument that Incursions are ‘better pve’ than missions, but what gets done more, missions or incursions.
Like I said, I’m going to enjoy watching your disappointment. I’m going to enjoy linking you this thread if you are hear a year from now.
Wrong, CCP is making PvE that you don’t like. Adding new missions won’t solve boredom problems. Exploration content new huge revamp for sure and I wish they did it but they choose other path (part of the problem is pve players are not organised and can’t make meaningful pressure on CCP to make that changes, it’s something Jin spoke off). If they didn’t make pve content “God like” from the start we won’t have pve-pvp problems. They didn’t have the tools to make good AI at that time maybe it’ll change.
Far as I can tell this will only affect some systems at a time, and the “threat” can be neutralised in a concerted PvE action.
If you dont want to deal with the NPC dynamics, just go run missions etc elsewhere.
Whether content comes from NPCs or players is arbitrary.
CCP cant code player behavior, but they can code NPC behavior.
That part is up to CCP. The player content is up to us.
I’ve long been a proponent of a more reactive game environment rather than passive sand.
I dont see the problem with this.
here is the bitter truth, I’ve been a PVE player for 10 years, I can safely say that as content goes, a lot of what actually keeps you going is the myth of progress, not the quality of interaction.
Its a terrible strategy for CCP to believe that is going to keep working in the face of all the new types of content in the world today. Every new player that arrives, has the bar of expectation set a little higher by their other gaming experiences.
No, I’ve not asked for them to delete deds or L4s ever. I’m just asking for you to understand that those things are irretrievably stale, and a complete waste of an MMO architecture. Fleeting should be default, those are backup things you can do if you can’t fleet or if you want to be solo. This is the stupidest never going to happen strawman and you know it ever.
We went through a similar argument months ago. I’m still here, CCP is still working towards more group PVE. In fact its surprisingly bold of them to add it in highsec.
Another problem that Burger mentioned is NPC behaviour. Target prioritization, ewar, etc. If they solve that obstacle maybe they can use it in remodeled missions.
If you dont want to deal with the NPC dynamics, just go run missions etc elsewhere.
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That’s exactly what PvErs will do if the FOB becomes a nuisance. Now I can’t remember them, but I have mission ships in three different locations, just for the sake of diversity. If I was playing and a FOB became an issue, I would just move my pod until the issue was gone.
The horse will not drink. It’s just water. If it’s not worth the bother, no amount of leading horses to water will get them to drink. And if they grow thirsty and CCP doesn’t delivers the water they want, where they want, the horses quit. Just look at the PCU.
Have you seen the tears that come out of PVE carebears when changes are made to enemy AI to make them more effective?
I’m talking about the changes made years ago (around Inferno) to increase NPC targetting of drones. The number of people that call that AI change a bug is incredible.
All that said I’m really interested to see what this does. I can imagine really interesting effects if bottleneck systems like Uedama get NPCs gatecamping and causing trouble there. I can also see ways for players to deliberately leave these alive in certain systems in order to isolate some areas of highsec to keep economic rivals out.
That’s just another way of saying “omg Star Citizen is coming” lol.
More seriously, I believe that that is the major problem, the corporate “we need to stay ahead” mentality that leads to companies misreading what their customers want and what they do in pursuit of ‘new shiny’.
CCP’s PVE efforts for the last 9 years is like all these burger joints with new ‘zesty sriracha deluxe taco burgers’ and crap when all their customers just want a freaking regular cheese burger and some too-salty-for-your-own-good french fries.
I hate that CCP is wasting time with stuff that’s going to fail because it doesn’t take into account who we (as average Damsel Rescuing PVErs) are. There is a REASON why we are mostly doing PVE that pre-dates 2006 even though CCP has stuffed new PVE into EVE since 2009. I honestly don’t know why the concept is hard to understand, for them or for you.
I’m very interesed in the bigger picture of this change. What CCP Burger said, it’s time to unleash the pets and see what they are capable of. The drifters disease like incursions were promising but one shoot mechanism was weird at best. Now if the Guristas for example start to build their influence for real this time? Defend their Data sites? Build structures? Raid spaces? Roaming Angels fleets? Blood Raiders searching pilots for their rituals?
And when that year passes, the question I will have is this: How many times does one have to see the same history repeat itself before one gets a clue as to how the situation they are observing works?
We (pve players) have been here before year after year, failed pve feature after failed pve feature and it never seems to end.
Worth pointing out that the mission grinders already do this when a Sansha incursion shows up in their system.
TBH I think EVE would be much better if mission rewards were rebalanced a bit to be higher the first time you take a mission from a specific agent in a 24 hour period, then lower afterward.
Get players moving more, which increases chances for interaction.
As for the people that want to PVE in peace - there’s a test server where you can do just that. No other players can affect your gameplay, and you cannot affect theirs (by dumping LP on the market, selling salvage, etc).
