It should not be possible to avoid ship loss in combat by storing your ship in a bowhead

[CCP_Aurora]

This is an interesting thread and there’s definitely some good feedback in here. Thanks you guys.

[Archer_en_Tilavine]

I agree with most of what you said

@Knowledgeminer

Like many other things in EvE, this issue seems a big deal when you totally don’t expect it and are unprepared for it, but you may adapt and learn to deal with it when you understand how it works.

CCP has been very much willing to disrupt the status quo and ruffle A LOT of feathers in the past few years. They removed HAW Titans, after all. I don’t think they would object to altering something so blatantly undesirable and one-sided. This is not a matter of needing to adapt, it’s just simply a matter of not being fun. It’s on par with neutral logi, which they ultimately removed after years of protest. In fact, it IS a form of neutral logi that continues to persist. For once I am confident CCP would address this if enough people vocalize it, and I think there will be consensus - the question isn’t whether or not CCP will address, it, it’s when they’ll address it. Ideas the community pitched and agreed on years ago only got implemented recently. I cannot imagine such a change would be difficult to implement (it’s literally a matter of applying conditions to existing timers, copy and pasted from Upwell POS docking code).

@CCP_Aurora

This is an interesting thread and there’s definitely some good feedback in here. Thanks you guys.

I rest my case

[Cheseburg]

they tackled a fleet of expensively fit battleships. most got away without consequece because they warped in multiple neutral bowheads and stored the ships even though they were pointed. that’s messed up.

[Xeux]

If they had not aggressed you then they still had options. Learn the rules, scrub.

[Cheseburg]

they commited to a fight, got warp scrambled. and were able to escape most of their fleet without loss by using neutral alts. that’s the problem. glad you can see the problem.

[Archer_en_Tilavine]

@Cheseburg don’t reply to Xeux any further. If you feed the trolls, they’ll never leave. Take heart in the fact that this is a battle that you, on behalf of the EVE community, have won!

@CCP_Aurora

This is an interesting thread and there’s definitely some good feedback in here. Thanks you guys.

[Daichi_Yamato]

@Mark_O_Helm

Agreed. The bowhead should go suspect in that case.

Can’t do this way I’m afraid because it’s the swapping player that initiates the action.

I could troll mining corps by deliberately going suspect and then using a maintenance bay.

Unless it comes up with a warning 'a suspect/wartarget wants to use your maintenance bay. Do you acccept?’

Edit-
And just fyi i brought this up ages ago…

[Xeux]

@Cheseburg

they commited to a fight, got warp scrambled. and were able to escape most of their fleet

How committed were they, really? They hadn’t fired on you or used any offensive modules.

[Salt_Foambreaker]

@Archer_en_Tilavine

If I had to guess, I would imagine most people would disagree with “in combat in general”.

Why? People want to use this to save their ship in other circumstances but it is not ok when PIRAT does it.

Make it impossible to dock ships in bays of any kind while in combat.

Or move this thread to Cry & Pout

[Scoots_Choco]

This is hilarious.
I love that highsec gankers are so innovative and come up with new ways to run away when they feel threatened.

Hope CCP patches this out, lol.

[Xeux]

Running away is lame, but it is better than coming on the forums like this to demand game changes.

[Lord_Kalus]

I agree with this. Aggressed/scrambled/pointed ships should not be able to use a bowhead.

[Xeux]

Can aggressed miners still use their Orca to dock their expensive barges?

[Archer_en_Tilavine]

This would eliminate a lot of gameplay in relation to caps in LS/NS. I would think most people would be against HS-specific or Bowhead/Orca specific restrictions when a solution that is simpler, more uniform, more consistent-with-existing-behavior, more sensible in relation to expectations from combat exists.

[Algathas]

Just let em dock in the bowhead, but have the bowhead get suspect timer if the people docking were in combat.

[Honest_Investment_Banker]

@Cheseburg

see reddit. pirat got their ass handed to them and took the cowards way out by storing their ships in neutral bowheads to reduce their losses.

they were aggressed, and scrambled. it is broken that a player in combat can store their ship in a neutral bowhead to escape their loss.

you should not be able to escape any kind of combat by storing your ship in a neutral bowhead. using this to escape war losses is a joke. it is made worse by the fact that the players abusing can afford to take those losses they just are so massively risk averse that they use every trick in the game to avoid loss.

evasion of consequences is very lame indeed.

Honestly every current and past member of PIRAT should have their accounts permanently banned for this. No exceptions.

[Xeux]

The thing you crybabies fail to realize is that there is nothing in the game mechanics that can save you. You can twist and change things however you want, but so long as you have this loser/victim mentality you will always lose. Groups like Pirat are the innovators that will figure out how to warp any change to their benefit. You guys will just call it cheating.

[Archer_en_Tilavine]

The kind of PVP experience I would like to see is that miners would have the ability to swap for combat ships (existing behavior), but not if they’re tackled (new behavior). If they’re tackled they’re going to have to ride it out - or eject - to grab a ship (new emergent behavior). And if they want to prevent this from happening, they’re either going to have to be extra vigilant and hug the mother ship for fast swaps, or they’re going to need an active defense fleet to confront enemy tackles in addition to miners swapping out for combat ships (promoting existing behavior further). It would also help if T2 Exhumers were immune from the can’t-deposit/swap-when-tackled restriction (70% kidding 30% serious).

[Lord_Kalus]

@Xeux

Groups like Pirat are the innovators that will figure out how to warp any change to their benefit.

Sounds good. Lets fix the exploitive issue and let them continue to innovate then.

[Archer_en_Tilavine]

Maybe they can exploit it as hard as they did when wardec immunity was introduced and neutral logi (save for depositing ships in Bowheads/Orcas) was introduced. They couldn’t exactly milk that their favor.