Jump Clone Installation Improvements

EVE Technology and Research Center Player Features & Ideas
1

I think when you install a jump clone it should be installed Permanently until you choose to destroy the clone, this way when you jump somewhere it automatically re-installs, this should be done regardless of clone state.

say you’re an omega and go alpha, but you need to use a jump clone, you currently will loose a clone and cannot re-install it. it would be good if it was automatically there, allowing you to still access the same areas you need to but at a further cooled down rate without reducing your overall number of clones. this way if you click destroy it removes it from that station/structure/ship all together.

when you were omega you paid to train those skills and took the time to carefully and skilfully set up your clones, but because you’re not paying for the game suddenly this gets chipped away. instead of creating a complex system of “once its trained you can keep it as alpha” just simply allow people who jump to automatically replenish the clone at that station.

once installed, always installed until destroyed.

this could be helpful in move ops for people in different time zones, you could install a clone onto someone’s ship via a clone vat and allow them to transport it to a structure.

I would imagine you could install it in space (as it is now)
the ship travels carrying empty clones and when arriving at the station, the pilot carrying the clones could perhaps have an option to transfer clones from the onboard clone VAT to Station (providing it has an active clone bay).

perhaps a miniature clone vat for smaller cargo ships. allowing people to transport clones around, but would make good content for logi pilots.

2

Clones are clones, not respawn points.

You seem to be asking for clones to become permanent respawn points.

But what happens when you jump from clone A to another clone B and because of your suggestion automatically install a new clone C? You now have 3 clones instead of 2!

Jump again and you have 4 clones. Jump again, 5. 6.

You pay (unnecessary) installation costs each time and worse, you quickly run into your very limited number of allowed clones, unless you manually destroy a clone as often as you are jumping.

Your suggestion may save people from accidentally forgetting to install a clone in their new location but is a QoL downgrade that forces players to manually destroy unnecessary clones all the time.

All that just to get around the clone limit of Alphas?

There’s a good reason Alphas have limited clone slots: you’re supposed to feel limited and be encouraged to upgrade to Omega.

3

there only needs to be one respawn point and that is your home station, all I’m saying if you jump to a clone it should automatically re-installed at that station, many times people have forgotten to do this, it would be an UPGRADE to have that, it remains in that location until you choose to manually destroy it.

I just thought the ship thing would be cool, making it so people can haul clones around without needing capitals would be kinda neat.

but back to the point you payed for the game, trained you skills and set up a network of jump clones, you jump to one, its removed from your network. in my mind this is a minor improvement because when you omega again, you now have to grunt and groan and go and re-set up your clones.

this way you only destroy clones at locations you don’t want to re-work your clone network.

4

Example current situation:

  1. You have two clones in Hek and Amarr, are in Jita yourself.
    Clone count: 3 (Jita [active], Amarr, Hek)
  2. You jump to Amarr, leaving behind your old body in Jita.
    Clone count: 3 (Jita, Amarr [active], Hek)
  3. You jump to Hek, leaving your old body in Amarr.
    Clone count: 3 (Jita, Amarr, Hek [active])
  4. You warp from Hek to Rens, and then jump back to Jita.
    Clone count: 3 (Jita [active], Amarr, Rens)

As you can see:
Clone jumping currently does not create or destroy clones, it merely transfers your consciousness from one clone to another.

If you wish to create or destroy clones that is a separate action.

Same example but with your suggestion however:

  1. You have two clones in Hek and Amarr, are in Jita yourself.
    Clone count: 3 (Jita [active], Amarr, Hek)
  2. You jump to Amarr, leaving behind your old body in Jita, automatically install an extra in Amarr
    Clone count: 4 (Jita, Amarr [active], Amarr, Hek)
  3. You jump to Hek, leaving your old body in Amarr, automatically install an extra in Hek
    Clone count: 5 (Jita, Amarr, Amarr, Hek [active], Hek)
  4. You warp from Hek to Rens, and then jump back to Jita, automatically install an extra in Jita
    Clone count: 6 (Jita, Jita [active], Amarr, Amarr, Hek, Rens)

With your suggestion the clone count goes up with every jump.
Why do we need automatic installation of extra clones when we already have our active clone at that location?

People don’t have access to an endless amount of clones. In fact, most of my characters aside from my main only have the skills for 3 or 4.

With your suggestion I would need to manually destroy clones all the time in order to be able to jump due to unnecesary installation of clones I don’t need or want.

In fact, I’m already often annoyed about the unnecessary installation of clones in the current situation: that jumping out of a clone doesn’t allow us to automatically destroy instead of install the old active body we leave behind, leading to unnecessary installation costs and manual clone destroy actions when we jump out of a station where we don’t wish to return or already have a clone.

Your suggestion takes the bad parts of clone jumping and adds even more of it. Automated clone installation is annoying, costs ISK and forces me to manually destroy those clones to keep clone slots free for when I need them. This is not an improvement.

5

You are part of the network. The clone is not removed, your current body is the clone.

Another example:
You have skills for a maximum of three clones: your current pod and two installed jump clones.

One clone has your +5 training implants, the other has a virtue set for faster exploration. You are currently in a pod with some mining implants.

Your virtue set is in Amarr, the training clone in Jita, and you in your current pod are in Hek.

You decide to jump to your virtue set clone in Amarr, leaving the mining pod behind in Hek.

The game wishes to immediately install a new clone in Amarr (your suggestion). You do not have enough skills for the fourth clone though, so it will replace one of your existing clones.

Please choose, which would you destroy to install the extra empty clone in Amarr:

  • Jita (training pod)
  • Hek (mining pod)

Congratulations, you just destroyed a valuable pod and a return option to either Hek or Jita in order to install a worthless second clone in Amarr. Second, because you already are in a clone in Amarr, in your virtue pod to be precise.

Worthless, because you could simply have left the virtue pod in Amarr when you wanted to jump back to Jita/Hek the next day, so there wasn’t even a need to install this second Amarr clone.

6

Wrong and incorrect. You didnt pay for the game, you pay for omega access every month. With that access comes all skillpoints available in game. When you stop paying for the sub you lose access thats simple. Before omega/alpha clones. There was subscription or not. Basically if you didnt sub, you didnt play.

1 Like
7

actually, I have to admit, this is a fair and valid point

as it this

hmmmm, you know, I’m not going to lie, I think there is merit to this idea, but clearly my execution is wrong, I’ll have a ponder and see if i can figure a more suitable method.

i think having clones in ships would be cool though, I’d like to see more of that in the game, clone transports, but it would have to be a viable option.

thank you for the input guys
goes back to the drawing board

8

I Guess you could have your clone installed at different facilities, however it doesn’t produce a clone until you jump to it, that facility will only produce you a maximum of 1 clone (allowing the clone system to work as it is) this way you could jump to a clone move it then jump back out using the medical facilities, the facility where your clone is installed is not replenished until the clone from that facility is destroyed. this way you jump to your other clones but you can’t jump back to that same facility until the clone is destroyed.

so just as example if you jump to jita to do a price check or use some kind of service you cannot use remotely, then death clone back to your home station, because it was your jita clone which was destroyed, your clone would be regrown at that station [insert jump clone cool down timer for this clone]

this way you cannot jump back to that station for X amount of time.

I think having the cool downs work like that being in relation to what facilities rather than your whole network would be an improvement too, this way I can jump clone, do a thing, death clone, then i can jump clone to another region, do a thing, death clone, these 2 facilities won’t produce a new clone for me to jump to until (current timer) is complete.

you could have a natural clone jump fatigue installed too this way you don’t just jump around, the more you jump perhaps some kind of effect like an increase clone timer at that station.

so if you have multiple clones at the same station you’d then have to move clones from these facilities to the desired structure/station, transferring consciousness between clones at the same station, has no effect (as it is now)

what would actually be a further improvement is an allocation of number of clones and being able to select how many clones in each structure / station you want to install with a minimum of 1, this way, Location A would have 1 clone in it say a jita clone, but location B has 5 clones installed.

what you’d need to do is the buy clone clone blanks and install them at these structures.

sort of like the attributes system of allocating points, just do the same thing with clones.

exception to this rule is your mediclone.

—edit—
even if you didn’t have a clone allocation at the station, i think it would be good to have some kind of permenant link to the clone bay, still limited to the number of clones and have everything as it works now, except that if i jump to that clone bay i simply don’t loose connection to it.

i think having the ability to install your clones into ships and have them transported would be cool, but i can see how this would cause problems for clone mechanics, or having some kind of system for using clone blanks can create more hastle.

fly to structure, link to clone bay (limited by skills)
you jump to station / structure -1 clone from your pool.

this way as an omega if you go and connect to the structure or station and you jump clone there, yes you use the clone, you don’t loose connection to the clone facility. this way you can expend the clone (if you choose too) and then jump clone back there after the cool down, i think this would be an improvement as it creates a minor modification where someone doesn’t loose the network they’ve created.

TLDR keep it as is but allow us to retain connections to facilities, this would also help people connect to ships such as rorquals, capitals and titans

in my mind this works better to the vision of how clones work within the universe.

theoretically you could have it so you can link to more clone facilities than you have clones, number of clones you have is = to your pool, which they just increased due to demand.

9

I get a bit of a headache trying to figure out all the changes and consequences of what you’re suggesting, but I get the feeling that it means each clone will have an ‘origin’ where it can regrow when the clone connected to that location is destroyed?

A bit complex and unnecessarily so. I have many clones that I jump between, move between structures and swap between, I’m not also going to want to track the origin of each of them in order to know which clone (with or without implants) to destroy to make clones respawn in certain parts of space…

I’d rather just make sure my clones are in the right place now than to also keep track of their history. And if I want to install a new clone, I just press the button to install a new clone.

This however is a nice idea.

I once had the idea to be able to ‘deinstall’ jump clones and turn them into movable and tradable named ‘cryopod’ objects, with implants and all, which wouldn’t count towards the jump clone limit since they’re not jump clones. (They need to be installed again by the character themselves in a clone bay before they can jump to them).

Purpose:

  • allows you to store many more implant sets for your character (without increasing the jump clone limit)
  • allows players to transport clones of other characters, for easier deployments and new transportation contract opportunities

I could for example have a Gerard Amatin’s cryopod with Virtue implant set and move it to another station together with clones of a few other alts of me and move all those clones with implant sets at once in a single hauler, rather than move each pod one by one with shuttles.

CCP however had a much simpler fix to increase the amount of implant sets players can store, and recently added a new skill that allows 5 more jump clones, which removed half the purpose of this suggestion.

10

yeah my last post is a bit lengthily as i revised the idea several times. basically I would say my final idea is this.

allow us to connect to clone facilities which creates a permeant link unless you choose to disconnect it.

because of this you can have more facilities than you do clones.
this way you can use you jump clones to go to ANY of these facilities.

yes you use clones, but you don’t loose the connection to the facility.

so if you’re omega and have 15 clones for example… then go alpha, you’d burn through that pool till it rebalances. (as it is now)
as an alpha I think you get 1 jump clone.
this doesn’t ultimately change the pool of jump clones works depending on clone states, allows links to ship which COULD be good for capitals and ops and also helps you retains the network you established of where you can jump to.

this way its much more like you step off the production line at each facility, I think this would make clones easier

I also think this would be good for war clones when they return too, it would allow them to not worry about number of clones they have / need but allow them to cover a wider area and with war clones, you can have clone facility links on planets too.

11

What would be the limit though?

What stops me from linking to every station and structure in the game, trivializing travel time as I can now teleport anywhere I want?

12

skills, you’d need a skill such as “clone facility synchronisation” or something
this skill lets you make the connection to clone facilities.

I think the total cap for jump clones is currently 15.

so if you had this one skill available to alpha clones with full levels 1 -5
start with a base of 0 facilities and grant +5 facilities per level for a total of 25 connections.

if the New Elite Clone skill was disabled and this skill put in its place, people would be put back down to a max of 10 clones, you could get a wider usage of your clones, which is what I’m going for

to make this work with ships, you take the currently existing clone vat I and re-write what it can work from, I would imagine Freighters, JFs, Orcas, Rorquals and then allow for a the T2 Version which allows for Capitals up to titans.

this next bit is specifically about warclones

if you want to be real fancy you give ships compatible with the clone vat the ability to anchor above planets, give warclones a skill to remote connect to clone facilities for ships, stations and structures from the surface of planets. this would allow them to connect, jump and keep on moving. this way as you play the game and omega your character and build the network, you don’t loose it when you go alpha and burn through your jump clones and say “what a con!” because you happen to be short for a few months.

13

additional thought, if the clone facility link became a thing, then you could also add in an extra feature for both pilots and warclones which if a ship you’re linked too is being attacked, it simply sends you a notification saying “this ship is under attack” it would then be down to you to find a clone facility and jump.

due to the nature of these clone vats and the jump clone mechanics this would be applicable almost as a once per day mechanic, however with the phoenix module and the nanohuristic clone mappers, for larger fights in supers or titans, (and whatever else you can think of) etc you’d then respawn at the Phoenix modules and as per the rules of engagement as they currently stand, you will respawn at the nearest one.

so two supers on grid both with PMs running and one pops the other, all the warclones will spawn on the enemy ship, causing havoc which sounds awesome as hell.

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