It’s not really needed for low-end pve (lvl4 grinder missions), but for that price tag (6b?) I’d definitely be expecting >1k ehp/s tank and proping around, both cap stable in combination rather then exclusively, in case something goes wrong.
You might want to take a look at the Blue Pill (+shield boost), Mindflood (+capacitor), X-Instinct (-signature) and Crash (-missile explotion radius) drugs. The synth variant of those comes at 2~3m isk for 60 minutes and has no negative side effect. While Blue Pill/Mindflood/X-Instinct can’t be combined, the most interesting one might be Crash, which can be combined with any single one of those 3, anyways. A Synth Crash Booster basically gives your Tengu +6.3% damage application on cruisers and smaller targets for 3M isk/hr.
Using drugs for k-space ratting isn’t common, but a 6B isk ratting t3c isn’t that common either, and compared to the price of the fit, 3M isk/hr is rather insignificant.
Fitting 9824298462789462134 gyro or magstabs is not the only way to increase damage for a ship. But, I will just let this sink in, so it doesn’t go over your head.
My example fit only requires 3x ballistic controls. With heat, it would be 1300dps for a minute or so.
No one runs heat in a mission unless you screw up, so for PvE it really shouldn’t be factored into DPS. The answer to OP’s question is none; anything gun-based will run circles around missile-based ships.
Yeah…it needs MGC, MCE or TP. Not completely up to speed on all changes but when I left eve years ago…
the Rigging SOP was 2 flare, 1 rigor rigs. Or at least 1 of each and an ROF. A decent all in one solution I’ve used.
Damage application has its place. I can actually have them as vital. Damage needs to hit…to apply lol.
They have web but that is short ranged. also doesn’t resolve missile damage calc issues with sig radius. that is a bigger limiter in the damage calcs to me.
Also I know hams’ were supposed to be the new rage before I left. I tried them but still went back HML. Why…even on a shiny prop mod tengu and loki (ergo a faster prop sub too) you can lose a fair bit of time chasing down ranges on rats.
The raw dps is there on paper. But HML can win out actually firing more often since its “sniping” out to 60 km+ Personal preference here though. Ham likers can like their hams.
There’s no such thing as “sniping” in a missile ship unless your running one of the Mordu’s Legion ships. For L4 missions it’s Marauders or nothing (none of the Pirate battleships even comes close).
You’re still further ahead with guns vs. missiles. And implants, rigs and boosters are the other ways to increase your damage (other than applying a mutaplasmid to a damage module).
Oh I know. Just helping out the people till they convert to the cult of guns lol. It really is the better way. I sense caldari focus. I was there on the main once. It was when I learned other races the light was shown to me. Lolrox, hybird tengu and even rokh clouded my vision. Gallente and minmatar x trains…showed me the way.
If damage application constraints are taken into consideration, a 1100dps-ish drake (implied by the “heats to 1300+ dps”) creates Golem grade on-grid damage on the lvl4 crabbing grid. Unless the Golem fits redundant damage applicators, such a Drake would in fact outperform a Golem through the full range of targets. In the game, however, that’s not what Drakes have a tendency to do, although, in the game, the Drakes also are far from having 1100dps.
Sorry, but “1300 DPS” with a Drake is bordering on fantasyland…
A Drake Navy Issue with T2 HAMs running 3x Faction BCUs, 1x T2 BCU and a T2 Bay Loading Accelerator rig along with +6 implants maxes out at 1073 DPS. This is $550m ISK for the ship and modules plus another $3b ISK in implants. Pretty sure you could also hit this with a Tengu but you’d be locked to kinetic.
This is before tank and damage application (range is a paltry 21km). And this is also unheated because you’re not going to run heated launchers in L4s (they’re all adjacent and will quickly burn out in no time flat).
Short of Abyssal/Offier modules (which would make this a very lovely ganking target), you’d be able to run this on all of 1-2 L4 missions (Damsel in Distress comes to mind).
A standard Golem with torpedo launchers, missile guidance computers and target painters can deliver something insane like 3k+ applied DPS (while arguable more expensive, with the additional range and 3x-fold damage there’s just no comparison). You can actually overheat on a Golem because there’s enough space to leave vacant slots between launchers (just FYI).
I didn’t get into drugs because even with high standings you can typically expect to see around $50-$65m ISK/hr running straight L4s (more with Burners, more with SoE). I’m not necessarily sure you’d see a good return on investment utilizing more than I’s (possibly II’s).
I’ve run all manner of L4s and most L5s (way back before the last few years of changes to battleship and battlecruisers), and they never held a candle to battleships. Don’t get me wrong - they’re certainly a lot better now than they were (once upon a time you’d be lucky to hit 800 DPS in a Drake Navy Issue) - but it’s quite easy to hit 4000+ DPS on short-range Marauder fits with full skills, implants and a handful of I or II boosters.
to me on paper dps doesn’t translate well into the game. Unless smacking structures. Huge sigs, 0 m/s travel speed…perfect hit everytime. I’ve gotten max theoretical drake damage.
It was a really slow night in one 0.0 home back in the day. The enemy truly did not want that POS.
FC said okay BC’s watch local but come on in with the dreads and lets see if we can shave some time off this. Drake gets nice damage on pos hits. Also we pointed the crap out of if. Phoenix if in the dread wing back in the day was not really good. It needed all the help it could get really. that would include drakes painting the pos lol.
To me it takes away from effiency. 3 well placed shots less paper damage is better than 6 max damage shots where more than 50% damage is mitigated by speed/sig/actual tank.
Also my experiences from ratting in low/null. I’ve had the shamefull rat point/scram deaths. Not even log off trap, the truly shameful part. I got stupid, I got greedy, and…that roam moved faster than I thought.
Full oh crap heat on, rats not dying fast enough and my new friend(s) got their easy km. Lesson I got from that was apply damage better.
Remove the pvp part…it goes back to efficiency. Some mission when they say all, it means all. Even crap cruiser or less rats. Faster dead, faster done.
I disagree in that I’ve found the Nightmare to be a very fun and fairly efficient for unstressed L4s.
However, I have to agree that Marauders are just better. When I fly my Paladin, which is much more effective, I miss my Nightmare. When I fly my Nightmare, I miss the Paladins sheer power.
But ultimately, most well fit Battleships will easily solo L4 content in a ‘reasonable’ time. Marauders, especially the gun Marauders, will ROFLstomp L4 content (but you’re flying a big gank magnet, so make sure it’s not sh!tfit with a paper tank!).
Fly what you like to fly. You’re never going to make serious Isk running L4s; major PVE isk making is the province of nullsec and wormholes. So fly what you enjoy in hisec (just keep an eye on local and use D-scan!)