New CCP plan to make T2 modules better than Factional !?!

After the streaming over the weekend I’ve been wondering what the HELL CCP!!!

There has talk about making T2 better than factional modules and making factional modules as an NPC loot drop is just ill thought out.

As it is CCP has already make the Trig Perin Mutadpture Remote Rep this way!
(though it is questionable that this might be a mistake made by CCP and no-one there has picked it up since the release of these RR’s, there has been some talk that it was planned as a test for a possible T2/Factional swap. But this hasn’t been confirmed by anyone in the know at CCP)

From what I can tell this is their test item by design from what @CCP_Darwin said in bug-with-perin-heavy-mutadaptive-remote-armour-repair-or-t2-version.

The question I have is if this is the plan, then why do the Factional modules/items require as part of their construction T2 versions as components?

If as CCP is saying it’s to make it harder for Alpha Players gain access to high powered items, why not just increase the skill requirements to the same as T2 or higher.

As it is to get the BPC’s for factional and officer items has a lot more involved than storyline or T2 BPC’s. You can’t improve them, like T1 BPO’s or make T2 from them.

So the question is has CCP actually thought through this whole concept or is it yet another knee-jerk reaction?

new edit: added:

So if CCP is planning to go ahead with this, will all T2 items gain the Factional spec and the Factional gain the current T2 specs?

As we all know the Factional has better current specs compared to the current T2 versions.

It’s an honest question, and will CCP convert all current T2 player items into the new factional items and all factional owned items into the new T2 items?

After all current factional items cost heaps more than the current T2 versions!

A question that should be asked and answered by CCP, specially if they intend to roll this across the live server sometime soon!


[citation needed]


Citation definitely required. I saw nothing to indicate this over the weekend and it makes absolutely no sense. If they can’t find time to complete module tiercide where are the dev resources to mess with faction going to come from and what is the benefit?


Please resist the urge to tag me in all your posts about this. I am a graphics software engineer and cannot answer your questions about the rationale behind design choices. I merely verified for you that these stats don’t appear to be a typographical error.


Don’t worry he will tag someone else. He will keep spamming the forum just because he made a bad deal in game and wants to vent his frustration over you : it’s not his fault, it’s yours.

If you actual look the other topic post one was a direct response to your post. The other was just to get some form of CCP response, so thanks for looking.

And the post here only used your name in reference to your post in the other topic.

In total I’ve only used your name two times. If you have issue with that I’m sorry.

It’s not the quantity that’s the issue.
It’s that you implied that CCP had a plan to change the relative strengths of Faction and T2 Modules by taking a comment of a CCP Dev out of context.

is it out of context?

it was said that it was done by design!

I did some research and it appears these differences are by design.

that’s direct quoted.

sure as Darwin notes, he’s only a graphic software engineer. though it’s a statement from an CCP employee (nothing personal Darwin), which make it have more substance then one of us making a speculation.

now I know that Darwin is not from the database department (which I didn’t know before), what he said has to be taken with a grain of salt.

ideally someone from CCP database or balancing teams would clear this up.

@Scoots_Choco as you know CCP were very unclear on the topic of making T2 better than Factional. And if you actual read the OP, it clearly asks about it, and then asks the question how do they intend to compensation players that have spent millions if not billions on Factional items, that from the limited CCP talk on the topic will become sub-T2 in stats and price.

so nothing was taken out of context, I it just asked the question what are they planning and how are they intending to do it? as at the moment it appears to be ill thought out to just change the stats around between the T2 and Factional, without taking into account the direct effects on Omega players that have factional items fitted.

yes we know it’ll have a direct effect of Alpha players as they have no access to T2 items due to skill limitations.

and we all know the only reason Omega players use factional and officer items over T2 is they are better in every-way, though harder to get than T2 items.

Here’s a direct quote for you, “I am a graphics software engineer and cannot answer your questions about the rationale behind design choices. I merely verified for you that these stats don’t appear to be a typographical error.” -CCP Darwin

Don’t take it out of context. He was just saying that the stats aren’t a typo. He didn’t say that this was part of CCP’s plan to make T2 modules better than Faction modules.

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from what some in my corp believe, it’s a means to limit alpha players access to better items than T2.

as Alphas can train to lvl5 in most things, they’ve been using the better Factional items and paying 10-1000x the price of T2 versions.

it was suggested why doesn’t CCP just increase the skill requirements of the Factional items and then they stay the same, but limited to Omega only. to be honest this would be the faster and more effective method to limit alphas access to these items.

someone even suggested that they believe CCP is trying to make the T2 great again, with only the Officer items being the only items better than T2, with Factional and Deadspace being below the T2.
now this would upset a lot of players in so many ways, just in isk alone spend of A-B type item can be well above a billion isk, only to log in to find and 5million isk T2 now is better than an Type-A Deepspace item. personally I hope they are wrong in this comment.

so as you can see there’s a lot of speculation floating around.

Did you just wake up this morning and think, “Self, today we’re going to find the least significant issue known to all of humanity… and come completely unglued over it,” or something?


not unglued, far from it, thanks for asking by the way! :wink:

it appears others don’t think about the long term effects of what CCP has suggested, and god help anyone that does raise the question!

have to say interesting how many seem to have the thought that others aren’t allowed to have free speak.

I know the forums here (like the RSI, maybe not as bad as that one) are toxic, it never seems to show lack personal morals and common manners that social media has went a poster doesn’t have to face the people that attack or slam. no-wonder the younger generation has less and less respect to the older generations. But that’s going off topic a bit.

as I see it from what I’ve heard and others have said, this may seem a

but when it happens it’ll have the biggest flame war ever, can you honest say you know of no-one that wouldn’t be effected? just in ISK that would be major for a start, the amount some have invested in fit for Faction Warfare, Abyssal running, Incursions, etc…, some of those fits are multi-bil worth.

for example incursion fit; (current est 5.4B isk)

[Vindicator, Vindicator]
Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Centum A-Type Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane
Shadow Serpentis Damage Control
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer
Federation Navy Magnetic Field Stabilizer

Core X-Type 500MN Microwarpdrive
True Sansha Stasis Webifier
True Sansha Stasis Webifier
Shadow Serpentis Tracking Computer
Shadow Serpentis Tracking Computer

Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II
Neutron Blaster Cannon II

Large Trimark Armor Pump I
Large Hybrid Burst Aerator II

‘Augmented’ Ogre x5

Optimal Range Script x2
Tracking Speed Script x2
Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge L x3000
Null L x10000
Void L x20000
Nanite Repair Paste x2000


Nothing that was said has anything to do with CCP’s “plan” to do anything. You’re still implying that’s what they’re planning and you’re still taking the words of a CCP dev out of context.


There’s been absolutely no suggestion that there’s going to be any change to the relative strength of faction modules with respect to T2. They haven’t even finished the first module tiericide, flat out said (more or less) that they just don’t view finishing it up as a worthwhile use of dev-time right now, and you reckon they’re queueing up tiericide 2.0? Seriously?

It’s a wild-ass, wholly speculative conclusion that you’ve leapt to based entirely on the stats of one specific module.

Hell, I even agree that the stats of that particular module are probably sub-ideal, but this is now your second hysterical, overwrought, pearl-clutching, hand-wringing post over the same non-issue which is simply ridiculous.

This flavor of entitled claptrap is always pretty tedious. Just how much special deference is deserved for the high accomplishment of managing to not-die your way all the way to… whatever age you are?

I feel like it is pretty close to none.

Furthermore, if you want to whinge about tone and the general level of discourse, start with yourself:

I’m guessing english isn’t a first language as it’s pretty clear there’s something incorrect with the item in question, do we have to dumb things down for CCP these days?

Second question is why is an GM answer an bug report support ticket, shouldn’t this be vetted through to the right department straight away?

It’s a 10 second job to confirm the data, just need to compare all version of the item clearly shows the data in no time.

You can clearly see I’m completely dumbfounded by the response from CCP support!

Maybe you’d get better treatment from the youth of the age if you started acting like an adult? Or is it okay to be condescending and insulting when you do it, but it’s “toxic” when someone’s being condescending to you?

In any event, if you want to preach about manners and respect, you better find some higher ground first.


Closed via polite request by OP.