Аppeal

Again, I would like to ask the developers to make changes to the mechanics of mining minerals and ice by heavy drilling ships such as Hulk, Skiff and Mackinaw as part of the fleet with an industrial ship such as Rorqual. I’m talking about the need to transfer minerals or ice extracted by a heavy drilling ship to the hangar of an industrial ship every minute. I consider it necessary to use in the game the ability to open access for direct extraction of resources by a heavy drilling ship directly to the hangar of an industrial ship without having to do it manually, provided that they are located in the fleet and at a distance of at least 2500 m from each other. I really hope that this message will reach the developers. I demand a reasoned answer about the possibility or impossibility of making these changes! Thanks!

Do you want this game to play itself? Maybe the ore should just automatically go to your station hanger?

Some mining ships have bigger holds than others on purpose. The Mackinaw for example has a very large hold and requires much less cargo management, while the Hulk gets a significantly higher yield but at the cost of more micromanagement of the incoming ore.

It sounds like you just don’t like mining very much.

I would say though, there is a miner that puts the ore directly into your hanger without requiring you to do anything: the mining drone. Just use that and you can then keep your focus on Netflix instead of the game you are supposedly playing.

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Automation of manual tasks in real life is progress. In EVE, those manual tasks are gameplay.

If we could (legally) automate everything automatable in EVE, there would be no gameplay left: just a good looking intertactive screensaver.

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I am a strong advocate for buffs to pvers, but automation of things in eve is not a good idea. They leave away to passive incomes, and those have enabled alliances and corps to be immortal and impossible to kill or stop. That hurts the concept of a sandbox, because they just end up dominating everything and preventing people from implementing new idea’s (by being ejected for example from null in the process of making that new idea).

It’s really just not a good thing

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Maybe it’s the way it is because mining shouldn’t be infinitely scalable.

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OP others have given you the answers

explos would like to ask CCP that cans get automatically hacked when we are close to them and loot come automatically into your ship hangar?
ratters would like to ask CCP that our weapons automatically target the npcs and kill them, and that armor repairer starts repairing automatically as soon as your armor hp get lower than 80%?

if you don’t like mining, there are plenty of other things to do

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There is definitely some truth in this comment. Virtually all the income generating activities in this game can (theoretically) be replaced by automated bots. In some aspects that even includes combat and market PVP. The continuous purge and complaints about bot usage is evidence of the fact.

Automating cargo transfers would make those programs easier to run (thereby making things worse for active players) . Increasing the value (and reducing botting) for mining would require making mining MORE complex and difficult, not easier. The proposed CCP plans to make resources more scarce is an exampleof increased complexity.

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So long as this change coincides with a separate change where I only get a yellow flashy or even no flashy for attacking botters that ruin my mining income, I will support this 210 percent.

Not real happy with those working a room full of multi-boxes either TBH. How I have resisted throwing a disposable ALT at them is a testament to my honesty and patience.

There’s more to mining or attacking miners than high sec space, you know? Lots of areas where you already don’t get any flashy.

No, I don’t know which is why I said I attack every botting miner I see in hi-sec (No, I didn’t)

You are talking about the places where there are no botting miners? I can imagine having a bit of trouble attacking bots that aren’t there. Maybe.

I read somewhere that the average income for rorqual mining is 50 million per hour. Plexing an account runs about 1.4 Billion ISK. You end up needing to dedicate mining with that character for 28 hours per month just to break even on the investment. My refusal to running a multiple-box (at the keyboard) mining fleet is a LACK of patience on my part.

Granted you can reduce the investment time for a PLEX account by selling skill Injectors, but that activity is independent of mining so its does not exclusively apply to an opportunity cost assessment. I did run 3 ships at one a few years ago just for the experience though. Running a multiboxed fleet at least looks cool visually.

Plexing an account is independent of mining too, so if you ignore selling skill injectors, why don’t you also ignore buying plex?

If I have a secondary omega account for other means (capital ship pilot), then the question whether a multiboxed Rorqual is worth it or not has nothing to do with having to make enough ISK for plex.

The question is whether the risk of flying the Rorqual is worth the rewards. Can it live long enough to survive paying back the investment of the Rorqual itself? And the invested skills? And is the payout minus lost Rorquals worth more than I would have made flying other mining (boosting) ships?

What kind of idiot rorqual makes 50 mil an hour? You can make that with a boosted procurer on a mid-value moon.

The relevance here is trying to identify the point where the monthly ISK revenue (exclusively from mining) exceeds the monthly expense required to maintain access to the ship builds generating that revenue (Omega status). Paying for that Status requires either PLEX or a credit card. Hence PLEX, is relevant. I ignore the credit card because that funding method is effectively unlimited…

There are passive income sources that can reduce the ISK --> PLEX need (such as datacore farms and Injectors) however those are independent of mining. you can include them if you want, it would drastically reduce the time investment.

The vulnerable state for the rorqual is when it is undocked. Every additional minute the ship remains undocked, the cumulative probability of destruction increases (would that be a hyper-geometric probability?, I’m a bit rusty on statistics)

If a player does not have a fixed monthly expense (ie PLEX or PVP hobbies), risk management strategies reward a player for using the small ships rather than the big ones (since you can recover from a loss faster).

I watched an older video by “delonewolf” On YouTube and didn’t bother to check his “test” data against current market values. Negligence on my part.

Are the following values more accurate?

90-120 million per hour
6 billion investment.

If that is semi-accurate, the investment return time is somewhere between 50 -67 hours

That sounds closer yes. I am not a rorq pilot but I know it’s more than 50m/h.

Plex, credit card or skill extractors.

You easily ignore skill extraction, while including plexing the account. Why not pay for the subscription with skill extraction and ignore both of them like I said? They’re both irrelevant to the question whether a Rorqual is worth the investment over multiboxing another mining ship.

Using a skill extractor does not give you omega status. You sell injectors to purchase plex. you are being redundant.

Your argument that eve account activation costs are irrelevant is like a transportation company claiming that car insurance is irrelevant. Recurring fixed expenses (required for business operation) should never be ignored.

Edit:
In addition, the market price of both skill injectors and PLEX are variable. You are making an assumption that the Skill Extractor --> Plex exchange will always remain profitable. The ROI value of skill point farming have been diminishing over time.

Let’s take a similar example.

Would you say that ‘no, exploration in an Imicus is not worth it because it takes 1.4 billion to plex each month’?

No, that would be ridiculous. So why take plexing into account for a Rorqual?

Also, I’m not making the assumption that using skill extractors to pay for plexing the account is profitable. Just that it can pay for a large amount of the cost of keeping the multiboxed account omega, if not all of it, depending on the plex: injector ratio.

This means your multiboxed Rorqual could pay (mostly) for itself by extraction alone, in case you insist in adding subscription cost to the equation. And that’s why it’s ridiculous to ignore extraction while including plexing. Include both or none.

Omega is a prerequisite for running a Rorqual - it is a cost of the operation. That is not the case for frigate explo ships.

The point being: Total cost to make back for running the rorqual mining operation includes the Omega sub; total cost for T1 frigate explo is just the ship/fittings/any skillbooks to boost scanning, because Omega isn’t a requirement. If you are comparing vs a cloaked explo specialist, then you need to count Omega sub for both.