Safeties to Green. Or else

Linked to this one: Thinking about the Krabs. Part Deux

If the feedback I see as I mooch around is that over-farming Krabs is a problem then here is a solution.

I know some won’t like it.

In 1.0 to 0.7 safeties are locked to Green. Just locked. The Player has no control, because High Sec rules are forced on all pilots. By the Faction Navy.

In 0.6’s & 0.5’s the influence of Empire is less. So safeties are not controlled.

Or maybe have safeties to yellow in 0.7.

Something like that.

If the best thing to do in Empire space is leave then you kinda need to take the hint on that one.

If I’m right. I might be wrong after all.

But if the ganking is forced out a bit then it’ll certainly liven up Low Sec & Null. And there will be space for newbs & people looking to chill to still do their thing in High Sec.

Krabs hogging the safer spots? That might be someone after a long week having a few brewskies & mining some weak-value ore. It might be a newb learning. It might be someone in a shiny having some fun. But it’s safe enough. And if it’s over-crowded then that will dial down any ISK-making potential further, as people compete for limited sites.

Seems better than just constantly flying T3C’s and Gila’s because everything else dies ( points made on another thread ).

The problem is the gank mechanic. You can’t shoot first. You have to just sit there. And it is over so quickly you are boned. And there doesn’t seem to be much of a defence, except to not be there.

Options on the table.

Why yes, I am a believer in increasing the security in High Sec. And no, no fecks will be given. Some of us want a break from PvP on occasion, and losing us to another game is kinda pointless :stuck_out_tongue:

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Or else

:face_with_raised_eyebrow:

I mean… if you wanna get really High Sec Care Bear about it all, just make the Safety auto flag you too.

  • If you toggle Yellow safety, then you immediately become Suspect.
  • If you toggle Red safety, then you immediately become Criminal.

As long as your Safety is still set that way, the timer just keeps refreshing. After you toggle back to Green, the 5 min cooldown starts running down.

My understanding of the issue is thus:

A corp organises a roam. Out in High Sec.

They risk 2-3m ISK a piece, and someone is guaranteed dead. Said gankers lost nothing ( near enough ), and their target just lost a week ( or even a month ) of work. The balance is so out it might as well be No-Sec instead of High-Sec. Which is common knowledge in Null.

EVE is vast. There are plenty of places to go to have a fight. Losing 1.0 to 0.8 in High Sec is hardly a cataclysm. Being only able to thieve in 0.7 won’t break any backs any time soon.

Gankers want EASY kills. Not challenges. It’s why so many of us just don’t care any more. A ‘gf’ it is not. The mechanic is so well known it’s just easy killmails for said Gankers. Too easy.

Which is why CCP having control of the safety sprung to mind.

And as for Police being powerless I couldn’t agree more.

As for the ‘player toggle go flashy’ option it won’t work. They just do it at the last minute and still get that easy killmail. They must not have control of their safeties in High Sec for this one to work.

.

No Trolls yet. Interesting.

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Another common option I’ve heard, is to prohibit Alpha accounts from going Red. Either in general, or at least in High Sec. Then the gankers will have to pay to play their space terrorist games.

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I would be supportive of making 1.0 and 0.9 security space 100% safe from any ganking, however, I think the rewards should be correspondingly small as well (lvl 1 missions only, small asteroids). It could offer a nice place for newbies to learn and vets to can have a super chill play style. So I THINK I would be somewhat supportive of your proposal.

The part where I take issue are the players who want good rewards with little to no risk. So if this is what you’re trying to get, you would lose me.

BTW, if anyone wants to make isk with 0% risk you should look into doing Project Discovery. You can make isk without even undocking your ship.

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I could agree with this sentiment.

Now I am no fan of ganking. But it is part of the game, and honestly pretty easily avoided. I also believe the game needs as much new player retention as possible. That being said, pushing something like this too far down the sec numbers simply delays new players from learning the harsher parts of EVE.

Also, this really should be in player ideas.

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Can you show us proof that this is actually the case first?

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I disagree with the further nerfing of highsec aggression mechanics. The point at which a new player graduates out of that status is probably somewhere around the point they learn that life is eternal and ships are ephemeral. The safer the initial space, the longer it takes to learn that lesson and the more expensive the loss is for the extra time put into it.

People decide to put themselves in a position to lose all their property for a little bit of extra efficiency. They’ve not taken due care to minimize the amount of their net worth they’re putting at risk when there are options available to do so.

Safety, like just about anything else in the game, is best abused by established players. Locking down a system’s aggression makes all the resources there effectively 0 effort, and no matter how close you get to 0 reward, something for nothing is always going to be in high demand. New players are going to be the least able to obtain this free lunch owing to their lack of experience and equipment that necessarily goes with being new.

Also, in my experience at least, people who genuinely go out and abuse new players are not popular in any sphere. Frequently an abuser would find themselves the subject of wardecs and ganking until they learn their lesson, and this is more like what Eve should be, I think. Less CCPlease and more of us doing for ourselves.

A procurer in .9 or 1.0 space is pretty darn close to immune to ganking. Inexpensive ships can run most sites. If you’re not worried about isk/hr and just want to talk and drink beers, you have the option of flying ships that you can afford to lose and reshipping as necessary.

I live in .5 and I am hardly ever attacked. Perhaps the number in the corner of the screen is less important than taking the time to consider what the situation in the immediate environment actually is.

Lastly, I’m going to mention what we can call ‘courtesy tank’. I find that if you remain calm and don’t mistreat someone for trying to PvP you, then they generally do not seem to make a point of shooting you. I’m not saying they won’t, of course, but I am saying that it’s not something they make a priority and thus it is relatively easier to stay out of their way. Antagonize your attacker only if you want their undivided attention while they try to make an example of you.

I’m of the mind that players can already casually mine or do missions if that’s what they want to do, but that what gets asked for it license to do so in ridiculously overpriced gear safely. Newbies don’t have that, so this change wouldn’t be for their benefit.

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Ganking is the #1 most challenging activity in high sec.

Blackout. Called off early due to mass-unsubscription out in Null. Rumour has it a quarter of CCP’s revenues went walkies, & not all have come back.

Plus a newbie retention rate of about 2-3% after 3 months ( as of June this year ).

There is also the CSM anti-Goku lobby. Because of how powerful small ships are compared to larger.

Plus chats on comms in various fleets and…

As I said, if I’m wrong I’m wrong.

But…

I’m an advocate of Economic Levers. I’d rather have a drop happen rarely and it be a good one than a drop happen commonly & be weak. That view is personal though.

If you eliminate risk, you also need to eliminate reward. They balance each other. A look at the MER will show that PVE rewards are minimal in empire space - most of the resource harvesting and ratting income is generated Nullsec or Wormhole space. Highsec is industry and trade. There needs to be an element of risk associated with these activities - piracy, ganking and wars provide that element of risk.

That said, you can mine and rat 100% risk free on Singularity!

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Buy catalyst, do what fc says re ‘keep at range’. Press f1.

P*ss-easy. And next to zero risk.

I have to disagree. Ganking is way too easy.

Theft allowed in a 0.8 ( yellow ) would make emerging conduits spicy. You may kill the baddies, but did someone just yoink your loot?

That kinda thinking.

The thing about those conduits is that the muta’s are not guaranteed wealth. They’re dice rolls. You have to salvage to get the extra 10m isk etc. But… Shinies can be easy to kill. And ganking is mega-easy in High-sec.

And shinies are fun to fly. Make it too toxic and you lose buyers of shinies.

Which is where Krabs can be over-farmed comes in.

This, or things like it to ultimately make things 100% safe have been brought up time and time again. Personally I think you should just become aware of how to minimise your risk and that goes for any type of space.

In saying that it is obvious that retention rates are not great (but then have they ever been?) so maybe something needs to be implemented, maybe make newbie systems locked green and make those newbie systems a constellation, but the rewards have to be reduced, as someone mentioned earlier, level 1 missions, smaller asteroids etc. If you want no risk then you have to have minimal rewards.

I think if anything though those systems are there so you can learn the game, the mechanics the things to look out for so when you venture out into the “dangerous” non set green only systems you have an awareness of your surroundings to avoid those ganks. Or of course there is always SISI, zero risk on there, and it ticks all the boxes of the people that want zero interaction and to be able to mine or rat without any risk whatsoever.

It confuses me greatly why all these no-PvP types don’t just play on Singularity. It has everything they want. All they would have to do is ask CCP to add an option to disable PVP vulnerability and disable the tranquility mirror… I think we could all support such an initiative.

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Don’t go there with copy and paste fits, the doctrine ships used, etc, etc.

Because you are only thinking of yourself, I’m not bashing you but only pointing out that (especially me), I’ve often post things (less often now), in the past without considering the other side which is why I love debating rather then poo slinging, it helps me see the flaws in my thinking (and I got a long way to go).

I do try to understand the other point of view - you guys seem earnest. I would be much worse if I wasn’t trying at all.

I feel like we are Methodists and Anglicans screaming at each other for reasons that only we can understand. We all love Eve, so there must be some common ground.

You’re just threw out a bunch of unrelated issues. I don’t see what any of this has to do with over farming krabs, especially since your idea is about locking weapon safeties in highsec.

Black out only impacted nullsec, so your idea does nothing.

New player retention rates have always been low, you don’t explain how locking safeties will change that.

Gokus are bombers that are, again, used primarily in low and nullsec, so one more time, your idea of locking safeties in highsec is not even relevant.

I don’t even know what you’re trying to say when you mention “plus chats on comms in various fleets and…” because that has absolutely nothing to do with forcing weapon safeties to green in highsec.

You don’t really have a real plan do you? You’re just salty about the thought of getting attacked by someone else and you just want to make your own personal gameplay safer. And to support it, you’re throwing out unrelated issues to try and seem like you have a good reason.

FTFY :smile::smile: