The purpose of the Cyno changes is to nerf super projection and protection. Locking the industrial cynos down to industrials is congruent with the super projection nerf. Allowing only a JF to jump to an industrial cyno seems overly specific. I am guessing CCP does not want to promote a Battle Rorqual META. Basically a Rorqual is a Tanky fractional FAX with some significant Drone Firepower when deployed. However they are more expensive and less capable than a carrier. So I have to ask, Why not allow Battle Rorquals? More destruction, bigger KMâs whatâs not to like?
Nop:
A Titan can lit a capital cyno for another Capital to jump to it, by capital cyno as Titan or by Jump Drive as Capital sub-Titan, or to use a capital jump portal for another Titan to let jump the fleet of capitals.
To lit a cyno to call Capitals without the use of a Titan and itâs capital cyno or capital jump portal, you use the Force Recon or Black Ops and itâs covert cyno to link with the capital cyno, capital jump portal and capital jump drives. the Black Opsâs covert jump portal itâs just to lead other Covert Ops and Black Ops.
Industrial ships and indy cyno will not be used at the battle as scouts, for that you have the Force Recon or any Covert Ops.
IMO the indy cynos should be used only by the Deep Space Transport and the Orca and Rorqual⌠why? T1 haulers doesnât deserve a cyno, Blockade Runners have the covert cyno, and the Porpoise should have another covert cyno⌠freighters and bowhead donât have high slots or Jump Drive.
What could be discussed is if Orca and Rorqual should have a cyno, or not allow them to prevent the call of reinforces, but let them to have itâs Jump Drives to jump to a lit cyno of any kind and that way to haul the mined, harvested or huffed âoreâ back to your base without the use of additional haulers, cos ORE command ships are haulers itself at same time.
If Rorqual could be banned in Highsec, you can give a Jump Drive to the Orca and ban the Jump Drive use in Highsec, limited to just the actual Jump Freighters.
If the Endurance or Exhumers should be allowed to use an indy cyno could also be discussed.
What leave us without cyno to lit or jump, or jump drive, or not allowed to jump a portal?:
Any sub-Capital, non-Black-Ops, non-Covert-Ops, non-Strategic-Cruiser, non-T2-Hauler, non-ORE-Command.
This prevents the easy move of fleets of Battleships non-Black-Ops, the Capitals can still land at the call of a Titan to the war, but Rorquals canât call reinforcements.
This is almost all you are claiming or areguing that CCP want: the easy Call-to-War without the use of a Titan to call only Capitals, and the easy call of reinforcements for the Rorquals.
Fleets of Covert Ops or Black Ops keeps as usual, and hauling lines are revamped a bit but without too much trouble.
Hi.
Fitting window feedback:
Had to move some hulls and some stuff from point A to B. Got a warning on the fitting window for the items my hauler couldnât use that were placed in the cargo.
This may be confusing for new players moving looted stuff around?
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That helps when you land BEHIND the gate or too close to the gate to take it safely, sure⌠and thatâs fine in HS missions. But what about at LS FW sites?
But sometimes you land inside the gate, between the teeth of the gate. Just getting out from them is hard, let alone warping to the next room.
There are missions where you get stuck on accel gates when you first warp in or when you warp from room to room in the 4, 5, 6 room missions like the Extravaganzas. There are also rooms where an accel gate puts you inside a bunch of NCOs (such as Recon 3). Donât even have to be a rookie to get stuck in some of these situations.
NOW I see what the above was in reference to (when I first read (now part) of this topic back on Tuesday, I saw this and was like⌠âum⌠oh dearâŚâ).
⌠Yeah, I have a feeling the OP was in a battleship with no unscripted/scan-res-scripted SeBo and no SigAmp or locking time rig.
HOWEVER⌠itâs still like 12 seconds for my Ikitursas to lock the wrecks and 18 secs for my unscripted-SeBo Noctis (16 secs for my scan-res-scripted SeBo Noctis).
Pretty brutal. It shouldnât take many times longer to lock the wrecks of those damaviks than it does to lock the damaviks themselves. Thereâs something amiss with the wreck stats (no HP showing when locked, also)⌠almost infinitesimal sig radius, Iâm guessing.
T2 Noctis and t2 salvage drones first, kthzplz!
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âNot everyoneâ is, or can âsafelyâ go ratting in capitals. Because moon mining is necessary for T2 production, as demand / prices increase someone will do it, if the isk/hr is attractive to them. Passive income methods are being changed into activities that put more ships in space.
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Iâd be cool with that, but keep in mind that would mean youâd need to train Covert Ops and/or Recon Ships to fly them, as theyâd be effectively faction/t2 hybrid ships, kinda like the Marshal/Enforcer/Pacifier then and not just need Amarr/Gal Frig/Cruiser skill.
Iâve always thought that Primae should be better than the Epithal, the Noctis and the Porpoise itâs T2, the Porpoise called Noctis due itâs black skin, and the 3 ships with equal m3 for cargo just with different bay uses.
Thatâs a perfect explanation about why Astero and Stratios should not have covert cynos⌠Astero and Stratios are not designed to be the best scan/hack ships, just easy to skill for than the T2 Covert OpsâŚ
What about limits on what can jump or bridge to a cyno based upon the mass of the ship lighting the beacon, or the hulls being bridged?
Cyno bonuses for the JF hulls would still let them jump to a corvette or frigate. Covert should be an option, too.
For combat cynos:
- Frigate can cyno beacon to bridge sub-caps up to Cruiser size, or jump a JF
- Cruiser can cyno beacon a bridge for sub-caps up to Battleship size
- Battleship can cyno beacon to jump Caps
- Capital can cyno beacon to jump Supers
The industrial cyno needs a lot more versatility. Rorquals should be able to jump or bridge industrial ships (miners, haulers, CS) to the beacon. The game code can always make sure that the SMB is not being used for combat hulls.
Comments regarding a Recon style Porpoise for WH diving, covert cynos for cloaky miners and a T2 Orca that is jump capable, all have merit and applications in game. It will also reward players for investing in the SP to fly these ships.
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I love it! 
thanx for the support 
Myself I donât have all the answers and combinations of posible options, CCP should do that.
But what I know is that if you are not mining or huffing at home, if you are doing nomadic expeditions, if your Orca or Porpoise canât lit a cyno to jump itselves, not to call a ship, you canât haul your daily cargo back to your temporary base or your public Lowsec Athanor reactor.
As nomadic wormholer you could just say me to find a WH route, but to Highsec, to manually fly the whole trip⌠but forget about move one of your Prospects till your storing base to call the Porpoise to unload.
And as I said in my previous posts, the ORE commands: Porpoise, Orca and Rorqual are Foreman and Hauler⌠if you need a Deep Space Transport or a Jump Freighter to unload your todayâs cargo, this demolish the whole purpose of the ORE commands.
And if Porpoise was designed to be a wormhole foreman and hauler, specially to boost the huffing cycles of the Prospects, and not as a cheap mini-Orca for Highsec, and you donât give it the proper Covert Ops tools that any wormholeâs ship have: covert cyno and covert cloak, like the Prospect, Buzzard and Tengu owns⌠you are erasing the whole purpose and speciallization that the Porpoise have.
With the actual rules, using the speciallized Porpoise seems as shabby as use a Gnosis for Foreman and a Miasmos for hauling the gas⌠what clearly is not appropiate for wormholes or to take a Nullsec/Lowsec Static to Jump to your non-Sov and NPC base, or to the Lowsec public reactor near a Trade Hub.
As for the cyno types⌠i suggest to speciallize it as capital cyno, covert cyno and indy cyno for non-Covert or non-Capital haulers.
If CCP donât want any kind of cyno to link with any kind of cyno, we could make a scale of âtiersâ like⌠Capital > Covert > Industrial
A capital cyno can call other capital, covert and indy cynos, cos is supposed that a Titan owns the most powerful engine so can call any ship.
A covert cyno canât link with a capital cyno, cos is not powerful enough to make a link of the size or mass limit for a capital ship? but can link with other covert and call indy cynos.
An indy cyno is not powerful enough to call coverts, so can only call other haulers⌠but is enough for the hauler to link with the covert or capital cynos, which is suppossed to be bigger and more stable links.
That way a hauler canât call back itâs recon scout, but the recon scout can call the hauler to unload, the scout do the trip back on foot and when on the destination place, call the hauler back to keep with the job.
This is taking form as we share suggestions⌠but we canât do it alone: CCP have to help us to fix our needs while nerfing what they pretend to nerf, but without side effects or collateral damages to the comunity.
Nerf the Nullsec, its Rorquals and Capital escallation, should not damage the Wormholes, Lowsec or Highsec. If you nerf the whole comunity, you are not reducing the inequality between Null and the rest of us.
BTW⌠if Lowsec is for roams and only live there the Factional Warfare people, how you pretend the people to leave Highsec if the options are the constant fight of Lowsec, the excessively hierarchized and ruled Nullsec?
The key are Wormholes⌠for nomadic life, autonomous or with your small group.
Remember that Wormholes are -1.0, so are like Null too⌠but it doesnât have near the same benefits, and the distance compared to Nullsec is huge.
An upgrade could be to give wormholes better moons according to its C0 type, with the C6 having the best moon goo for T2 indy, and a comparable way to improve your own wormhole like the Sov mechanics do.
Yup, unboosted RS. After a hard day at work, I was looking for some no brain activity to calm down and relax. Then I got TOO relaxed and almost lost a Gecko as the Triglavians pulled one of their âfade and focusâ attacks as I was gently lulled into a light trance. Seeing a Gecko down to 40% hull woke me up real quick. Anyway, 13-15 minute full clear and salvage allows for some quick PvE thatâs worth it if I have a short time to play.
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I really think that it is possible to run only ORE hulls through an industrial cyno and take care of operational issues. I think that as the biggest of the ORE hulls the Rorquals should be able to bridge other ORE hulls. A remote op can then be conducted in Nul or LoSec. Cloaky mining frigates can be the Covops equivalent.
JFâs should be able to continue jumping to disposable corvette alts. It does not make sense to change the hull unless you are trying to drive helpless cyno hauler killmails. There are usually a lot more profitable targets.
It certainly makes sense to have cynos remain typical to their use. A dedicated subcap and cap cyno is possible, but you need to drop something through the bridge when you want to escalate and call for the caps and supers. Just as EVE has PvE escalations, why not Pvp?
I think that CCP donât want the Capital scalation to happen that easy anymore, thatâs calling Titans to conquer the oposite side of the Gallaxy by just using a sub-capital recon.
Since Capitals canât use wormhole routes, if you need atleast a Titan there where you want to conquer to call your fleet, you have to move on foot, gate to gate, and conquer the systems of your nearest neightbour meter to meter.
For example, The Imperium and The Legacy have a demilitarized zone between them called Stain.
But on the other side is a bit easy for The Imperium to conquer The Dead & Co, system to system, gate to gate, using The Initiativeâs base at Cloud Ring.
But The Imperium will not be able to move a Titan to call the Capital Fleet till The Holy Reantal Empire, atleast not without the help or permit of the neightbours of The Holy Rental Empire.
This kind of conquest, box by box, as on a board, could be so interesting for diplomacy and Null Sov Frontiers could be more clearâŚ
Actually any Coalition can engage eachother, like if there were no borders: you have your friends and your enemies at 1 cyno away, and the South can jump to the North without bothering to have Highsec in betweenâŚ
This way, if the South wants to go to the North, have to go surrounding the East or the West, having friends there, or the permit to move their Titans through there, or conquer system to system the Northâs neightbours till get nearer the NorthâŚ
Could be so cool 
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Definitely not bothering to haul anything via jump freighter anymore. Not worth the isk to constantly lose cyno industrials or the effort to keep tons of them ready in all the low and null systems needed.
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I suspect that, if you and your colleagues do give up hauling, the selling price of the stuff you currently ship will go up to the point where it is worth shipping again despite the increased risk.
Eve âworking as intendedâ ?
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So youâre telling me that 78% of the gameâs population is divided between mostly empty lowsec, very empty wormholes, and highsec? I call â â â â â â â â . Citation needed.
Look it up. I am not your mum and this is not a dissertation.
If you call that lack of proof, enjoy your flat earth.
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Oh, Iâm sorry, Mr Tough Guy. Please donât punch me. But I also donât see how any of that has anything to do with being my mum.
I call a lack of proof a complete lack of any backing argument on your part. I donât see any such thing. So yes, thatâs what âlackâ means. Go look it up in a dictionary, dumbass.
Again, this is not a dissertation and Im not your mum.
Youâre, right. My mum wouldnât make a fool of herself like you have been doing all over this thread.
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