Wrong.
On the contrary, what they did was a final slap in the face, if you ask me. Midular was a proponent of peace, likes of which we rarely see in any of the cultures in New Eden. The Republic sends a dreadnought task-force to Gallente space to extradite the person who shot her, by threat of deadly force. Against. An. Ally. If that is not pissing on her grave, I don’t know what is.
Obviously true, but such implications can be quite slanderous without proof. Sometimes the proof is gone, and the truth is buried, but you can’t use that to assume or even imply that they took such a vile action, it’s hardly in good faith and reeks of partisanship.
It’s pissing on her legacy.
Also could you respond to this please?
“This is also true, but I doubt the convenience of… invading your much more powerful ally?.. to drum up nationalist fervor, would be enough to get the Brutors to stomach immortalizing her if they actually thought she was a traitor.”
Not all Brutors hated her, I’d assume. At least I don’t think sharing a Tribe requires following hate-creeds, or if it does, why wasn’t I told about that? You know how many Brutors there are? Over a trillion. Not all of them are going to hold the same grudges, no way.
“Not all” isn’t a very good argument.
There’d have to be a significant shift in power for that to be something we’d expect to see reflected in policy.
But even then, I’d accept that as possible. Nobody denies the Brutors ratcheted up a lot of antipathy towards Midular during her faction’s control. It’s what opposition does when they don’t have the floor. My point here was to counter this idea from Else that they only cared about her when she was dead, and that they even could’ve been the ones who killed her. While they could have, there’s no proof of that, and assumption of it without evidence is just political hackery.
Having listened to similar slanders about my Chief for pretty much whole of my adult life, I am inclined not to give a ■■■■ if I hurt some usurper’s poor feelings.
You can’t usurp Parliament if there is no Parliament.
Jussayin’.
Jason, I do not believe it is constructive to dismiss her point so readily.
Elsebeth: I am putting together a detailed response for you, regarding the original question. hence the delay.
Well that’s not really a matter of debate from where I’m standing, it’s a fact.
These vipers have been disingenuous throughout this entire conversation, alternating "No u"s with “You can’t talk about this because you’re not a real Minmatar” to insidious accusations that the Brutors assassinated Midular, to lying about what I was saying multiple times in Off Topic, to implying that the reformation of the Sanmatar was nothing more than an unjustified slaughtering of political opponents with no other context behind the events. They’ve been disrespectful, dismissive, and lazy for most of this.
I think I held my constitution longer than they did, at the bare minimum. And they can reap what they sow, if they want to act like asses, and think we should talk to each other like this instead of respectfully, then they’re just getting tit for tat if I do the same.
Then you didn’t read anything I said with any amount of consideration.
Jason. I have had YEARS to consider the ins and outs of this. Your words won’t sway me in a matter of hours any way or other.
Of course you can, when the reason there’s no parliament is that it is dissolved waiting for a re-election, and you then murder half of the potential candidates, and select yourself as prime minister in an election of one candidate.
That’s pretty much a text book example of usurping, gods and spirits.
I refer you to a history lesson I’ve put together before.
People form their opinions on dramatic events quickly, and rarely change them except after much time has passed.
To Elsebeth, I was meming. Yes, it was a usurpation, and I believe it to have been necessary given the circumstances.
If whoever ordered the Colelie shitshow had actually respected the structure of their own government, they would’ve left the matter of an attack on the Sebiestor Tribe with the Sebiestor Tribe until we requested Republic intervention, too.
We were told that day that the orders were directly “from the top” and hence there was no turning back or room for compromise.
Of course, no names were given outright.
Exactly. From the top. But who, at the time, would have had that authority? Would any of the other Tribal Chiefs have infringed on the Sebiestor’s sovereignty, knowing it would set the precedent to violate their own? I somehow doubt it.
Which leaves Yun and Shakor, neither of which should have had any executive authority.
They only cared about her as a convenient chess-piece. A patsy to point at and howl about ‘sympathizing’. An icon to elevate and howl for vengeance. At each turn, either charges she couldn’t defend against, or advocacy she wasn’t conscious to refute. And all of it served only to solidify control.
At the time, Jason, I was as swept up in it as anyone at PTS, I admit it. But one of the real disadvantages of climbing the ladder out here—however unintentionally—and being forced to bleed into the sausage-press a bit myself… is that a whole lot of maneuverings start looking a lot more transparent as power-grabs.
Especially when you find yourself wondering why the hell certain groups stayed hidden even from the Tribes for over a century before revealing themselves.
I have posted my detailed response to Elsebeth’s question above as the first post. A quick summary:
We are now 7 tribes, not just 4. We are whole.
Creation of the Tribal council consildates decision making allowing for quicker, more direct responses as needed and created a political system appropriate to our society.
The Republic is experiancing sustained economic growth under the Tribal council vs. stagnation while under the Parliament. We have a stronger economy.
And the trillions that remain enslaved? We are not whole.
I do not forget our Kin still trapped by the Great Enemy. We should strive to retrieve them as soon as possible. However it does them no good to return to a republic in shambles, unable to care for its sons and daughters due to corruption, poverty, and indecision.