I was on board with the first part… but not the second.
I’ve done plenty of PvE in null and high-sec. I’m pretty good at running away, so I don’t lose all that much. But I think in the hundreds (if not thousands) of missions I’ve run I’ve gotten warped in on in a mission maybe twice… and one of those was running a Gurrista mission in Venal… so it was null sec anyway. I get visitors to the anoms I’m running at least once a week in null.
I personally believe that the additional risk is worth it due to the much greater reward. But to say that there’s more risk in high-sec mission running than ratting anoms in null is just stupid.
No he’s right, Nul-sec can be much safer than hi-sec.
@ OP
Key difference between EvE and other MMO’s you may have played …
a ship, the modules fitted to it & the isk used to buy it all are all disposable tools used to perform a specific task, different tasks may require additional but different tools that are just as disposable.
Difficult to prove for someone who has no perspective of just how safe SOV null can be (I’m assuming of course that you have no experience in this area of the game based on your NPC Null- Venal ratting comment above, if this is in error apologies )
Take for example B-7DFU (located in Querious). As of this writing, this system had 47,079 NPC kills within the last 24 hours. The kill board for this system is here… B-7DFU | System | zKillboard
For 47k NPC kills, if we add up both today and yesterday (Condor + Mach) that equates to roughly 2B in losses or put another way - 42,500 isk lost/NPC kill
42k NPC kills and roughly 900 Mil isk in losses or - 21,429 isk lost/NPC kill
Now lets look at Highsec… maybe, the environs of Osmon (big SOE mission hub if memory serves). We need to evaluate the environs of Osmon though since I couldn’t find a single instance where a Highsec system could actually compete with either of the two systems listed above. (Maths below utilized data from Osmon, Korsiki, and Inaya, i.e. roughly 56,500 NPC kills combined)
56,500 NPC kills and roughly 3.2B Lost or - 56,637 isk lost/NPC kill
Mind there are loads of ways to use this data and other ways to view relative risk, but generically speaking, it is much safer to rat in SOV null than Highsec. Of course, there are also Wormholes, but I’ll leave that comparison to someone much more versed in that area of the game!
You’re talking about “players capable of legally engaging you” when you say dangerous. They mean a different kind of dangerous, they’re talking about standings.
In nul if there’s a single person in local without a blue square next to them, everybody knows it’s dangerous to be out and hides / moves / hunts the guy. It’s different in hisec because of the flow of mixed random traffic. If you judge danger by the number of people who potentially are here to kill you then hisec is more dangerous. If you judge dangerous by the amount of difficulty and organization required to actually be safe then nulsec for sure.
With all that said, if you can judge a situation most things can be done safely wherever you happen to be.
I’ve died one time in high-sec to another player. I was auto-piloting in a rookie ship while I was afk.
I’ve never died while at my seat in high-sec.
People are lazy in high sec because it IS safer. Just because they’re lazy and lose a ship doesn’t mean it’s less safe… it means the players are less attentive. It’s much more safe.
A lot of stuff here (some of which I can’t see at work because it’s blocked).
If I’m out ratting in Providence (my current home), and I see a neutral in system… I don’t warp off. If they fly into my site I’m out immediately.
If I’m in high-sec… I do the same thing.
I’ve only been warped in on twice while running a mission… once in high and once null. I get warped in on in Providence weekly.
People do lose ships in high-sec… not because it’s dangerous but because they feel safe and don’t exercise the same sort of caution they do in null. The attempts to gank mission runners work because the mission runners don’t feel like they’re in danger… until they die. Same goes for miners.
Attempts to destroy PVE players and miners are what show the danger of an area… not the success rate. That comes from complacency and lack of knowledge on the part of the players in the area. I’ve only been successfully killed while running a mission or anom once. And it was a mission in NPC null-sec. But many more attempts are made on my PvE ships come in SOV null.
Now granted, I do play in one of the busiest parts of null. Maybe there are rarely any attempts to kill PVE players in Delve or Querious. But I spent a year running missions out of Jita (back when Jita had agents)… and as I said… one person EVER warped in to my site. I had none running missions in other mission hubs (including several months more recently in Osmon).
I’m talking about players attempting to engage. Warping in to my mission site or anomaly. It was a huge rarity in high-sec. It’s a weekly occurrence in Null.
Can we just be honest here, given the power of local and color coordinated entries you should be seeing in it nul is without doubt the safest and most secure place you can possibly PvE in this game so let us look at a few important nul related things here.
If you have local set up properly AND you are watching it as you should be you will NEVER be surprised in a mission pocket or anom by anyone because you can easily see them the moment they enter the system due to the power of local. The extremely low number of characters in a nul system (often just you) helps make this ID process easier and quicker.
If they make it into your mission / anom with you there are only two possible options.
1, you are extremely lazy and not watching what is happening so you get caught with your proverbial pants down around your ankles.
2. you see them in local and you choose to ignore them, or choose to wait and see what they will do.
So let us look at high sec.
In many cases there are 50 to 75 characters or more in system at any given moment. Even the less populated system will have 3 to 5 times as many characters as one would typically expect to find in a nul sec system all by itself this raises the threat level significantly.
In high sec it is a practical impossibility due to game limits to properly color coordinated EVERYONE that might possibly enter into a system. This means that for all practical purposes you lose local as a intl tool to spot potential threats.
In nul if there are combat probes in space the smart player believes they are hunting him / her and takes appropriate actions. In high sec are those combat probes a player looking for lost drones? are they someone looking for a mission runner to ninja salvage? are they looking for anyone that might be a good target for a gank OR are they specifically looking for you?
I get multiple visitors to my high sec missions / anoms every month.
In more than six years my nul character has NEVER had anyone warp into a mission or anom. See the difference between us is that I see them in local and choose to warp out because I know my mission / anom fits do not stand a chance in a PvP engagement and I do not want to get trapped into a PvP battle while flying one of them. On the other hand you CHOOSE to stay in the pocket and take your chances on being able to get out before anything can happen. The key thing to note here is the capitalized word “CHOOSE”, the fact that you get a visitor every week has nothing to do with the safety of the system you are in it only serves as an indicator of the way you CHOOSE to handle the situation.
What you are describing are your actions to avoid someone trying to kill you.
What makes an area dangerous are the people who are actively trying to kill you… not your reaction to it.
If I’m huddled in a bunker in Syria and don’t get hurt… but someone else walks down a street in palm beach and gets mugged… that doesn’t make syria safer than palm beach. It means the person in palm beach is not taking the same protective measures the person in syria is. Syria is much more dangerous.
You are CHOOSING to run missions in a high-sec system with 50-75 players just as much as I choose not to dock whenever a non-blue enters the system. I have lvl 4 mission systems that average 2-3 players (regulars who I knew) bookmarked for each faction. You can easily choose to mission in those locations and dock up whenever someone you don’t know shows up… just like you would do in null. If you behaved the same way in null that you do in your missions, you’d get killed repeatedly. It’s only safer for you in null because you choose to PLAY safer in null.
EVE is not as hostile of a game as people make it out to be, though I won’t say ganking doesn’t happen. Look at killboards for high security space and you’ll find the grand majority of the time its ventures and haulers that have very little in the way of defenses, its literally floating fish bait.
As a new player your experience will involve losing a lot of ships and thats okay, that happens no matter what side of EVE you decide to take part in. As a PvP pilot you’ll be expected to lose many cheap ships while you sort out how to play this game. This is not a bad thing, and its a lot easier to learn how to PvP when the consequences of losing a ship aren’t a big deal. As a PvE pilot you’ll lose ships just learning how to tank, how to reduce damage and just not having the skills to effectively fly a ship yet. That’s okay too, that’s how every bittervet learned how to do anything.
The key is to find a group to fly with that supports you learning how to play, might be willing to throw some ships your way or replace them, and makes sure you learn how to play the game effectively with other people. There’s nothing to be scared of in EVE. Just combat situations you weren’t prepared for.
I’ve been playing EVE on and off since Beta. I’ve never gotten ganked in hi-sec. You really have to go out of the way to make yourself a target. Relax. Don’t be an idiot and you’ll be fine.
For OP, a novice, I think the biggest dangers are going in and out off stations, leaving warp gates, and sitting in one place like an asteroid belt without being aware of activity around you and having basic defenses. I say this, not because of the random ganking, which others have covered, but because you will join a corporation that is at war with someone, or join Faction Warfare, both of which will make you a legitimate target to opposing teams, even in hisec.
To stay safe when there are possible enemies around, place bookmarks outside frequently used stations and gates, at least 150km out, so you can warp directly to them, and from them into the station or gate. You have to align the bookmark with your exit vector. To do this, when you exit a station or gate, hit full throttle and click on the gate or station. Scroll back your view from your ship, and you will see a line from the station or gate to your ship. Click out into space as close to being in line with that vector line as you can. When more than 150 km out, make your bookmark. I usually go out past 300 km.
If you already know all this, then maybe someone else here will find this useful.
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