Can you please do something regarding the ganking issue in highsec. There are some systems like Uedama, Osmon, Apanake in particularly that are just kill zones. Some big alliances are using cartel like tactics and are ganking freighters with bulkheads that carry almost no cargo: https://zkillboard.com/kill/98705704/ . These is just an example (I can only put 2 links in the post). I know ganking is part of the game but i also think that things got out of hand and is a game breaker. Nobody plays a game to be bullied by cartel like tactics by big alliances. I suggest taking a look on those mechanics if you like new players to enjoy and subscribe to your game. Also because of ganking, some ships are practically unusable in highsec - the retriever / mackinaw, covetor / hulk, most of the T 1 transport ships, marauders. Also the same big alliances are also camping the mission hubs and are killing marauders (without gaining any profit) in bastion with damage controls and armor plates fitted https://zkillboard.com/kill/98702767/. I mean how more can you tank a ship in order to be safe. They will just n+1 and still kill you. At this point i fear that the only solution is to make Eve online like Eve echos in regard to highsec. I am also opened to suggestions. Thanks for taking the time to read my wall of text and i am looking forward to your feedback.
@Brisc_Rubal - you should open a full inquiry. I think your people may be involved in this outrage.
Yes hi welcome to EVE Online.
I had no idea new players were flying Obelisks.
No but they fly T1 haulers and barges that are being ganked.
Of course. This is EVE.
You’ve posted your opinion and in response, I’d like to post mine.
I disagree. I think war decs, ganking, scamming, are the only things that make highsec interesting.
I find EVE’s npcs boring. I find EVE’s players fascinating. Outwitting another player(s) is the only reason I play this game.
I just recently came back to play EVE, and found the ganking situation a little concerning, so I adopted same approach to highsec that I am used to in lowsec. Travel in buffer tanked sub 2 sec align frigs or luxary yacht, move bigger ships with travel fit buffer and nothing valuable, move goods in blockade runner. Don’t get caught on the station undock, use insta undock bookmarks on every station where you plan to undock with anything of value that can’t align in less than 2 seconds. Don’t fit blockade runner for cargo space, make sure it aligns quickly, know how to use MWD+cloak (you can turn on MWD after you cloaked). Keep mission ships in widely separated mission hubs to shift when ganking fleets are around. Strip all bling from mission ships, fit T2 only and always fit at least two tank buffer mods and damage control. That does not make you gank proof, but makes you less attractive target than the next guy. Always be aware where gank fleet is at, have eyes in staging systems, scout gates ahead of time. Also, be prepared to lose your ship, have a back up plan. Have sub 2 sec align frig in escape bay; and spare ship nearby, and you will never rage over losing a ship to gank.
You guys kind of missed some key words in my post like Alliances in highsec and cartel like tactics. Terrabear what did this guy do wrong can you enlighten me? https://zkillboard.com/kill/98674012/ he had a freighter with bulkheads and 17 mill in cargo on a ship that cost 3,5 bill. That does seem fair to you or balanced? He tanked the ship as much as he could without any bling on it. And he still got ganked in a choke point. There is no other way around that place. There is no other way from Jita to Amarr to move a freighter.
Uedama is THE place where freighters go to die. It is known. I mean there’s no other system in the whole EVE where more freighters were ganked. If you really have to take freighter through there, you MUST make sure the gate is clear, you can also do other smarts like have a support alt web you to jump faster or (for insurance, not a rule) bring an EWAR combat recon that can buy time for concord to make it there, better lose Rook than whole freighter. There are ways. What this guy did wrong is going in there solo just hoping he can get past Uedama on sheer luck in a slowest freaking brick you can find in the entire highsec that has a giant neon gank me sign on it.
Wait, so there is ganking going on in hi sec?
I thought it was elite pvp in the midst of an ongoing war in hisec.
From what i understand, evil miners have been invading and stealing the Princess’s property… she and her followers have been working feaverishly to vanquish the invaders…
She offers peace, business and passage through her lands at a small fee…
Yet the evil unpermitted miners continue to steal, then punish her verbally in her own channel after she negotiates terms for future peace…
The light T1 haulers such as the wreathe can easily be fit for the cloaky/warp trick. I call that the poor man’s Prowler. As long as you’ve set up your insta warp book marks on the stations you frequent, it is hard to gank you.
I don’t know what to say if you’re an Alpha. Maybe cheap tank the gankers.
What can you tell me about the retriever then? How can you fit it not to be ganked. I have a hole list of ganked retrievers, covetors and exhumers with damage controls.
Noted. I have a Fenrir and a bowhead. I guess I won’t be flying them anymore. But the last time they were really useful to me was when I was evacuating all my stuff from the soon to be Trig stolen systems. Now I keep my stuff in training systems, which they can’t allow to be stolen, Jita, or Amarr.
When you take away the legal means of blowing folks up in war, then folks are going to do what they can to blow folks up some other way.
The situation with mining is pretty jacked up for a solo player. Many areas of highsec have been chosen by certain corporations for EVE version of protection racket, where you are purposely being hunted if you do not pay for “mining permit”. Which of course will not stop some other-than-protection-racket corp ganker blasting you, but it is supposed to reduce the chances of that happening. So your choices are down to this:
- Pay for the “mining permit” and hope it works
- Identify the ganker corps and add them to your contacts with negative standing. This will make these pilots stand out in local, and you will see them coming. When you do, you GTFO
- Find remote place where noone will bother you
- Join corp in null that protects their space, and mine in peace
- Find another way to make ISK that enables you to fly ships with some way to deter ganking (FW, missions, exploring, etc)
All ships have limitations once you reach threshold, you consider implants and fleet boosts. once that is capped, you move to something more capable.
This game allows you to experiment****
If all attempts are extinguished
-Transition somewhere else
-Learn evasion tactics - plenty of youtubes on this
-make friends and fleet up
-Diplomacy with area factions
Terrabear thank you for the input. I just want to add some points to highlight the severity of the situation.
Pay for the “mining permit” and hope it works - even if they will let you mine they can always increase the tax and make you go bankrupt.
Identify the ganker corps and add them to your contacts with negative standing - they are never going to leave the choke points like Uedama, or the mission hubs for Sisters of eve like Osmon, and Apanake. Also the fact that the SOE ships are cheaper to buy from LP store then to build them from blueprints is not helping. They have ganking alts. That means 24/7 presence. They afford to lose catalyst because they make their money in null space. The new players do not afford to lose ships.
Find remote place where no one will bother you … and mine in peace - You still have to move the ore from the mining spot to the trade hub. If you use a freighter and have to pass through a choke point you are dead. You can not compress at the site and use blockade runners because you get wardeced by the alliances and they blocked the Orca compression changes. They also have their own stations for refining in Perimeter and they like getting their cut.
Join corp in null that protects their space - i guess you have to kiss the ring to be able to make a living in eve online. But it does not have to be like that. In eve echoes high sec is safe you can not agres anybody. And in my belief making this change in eve will not impact the economy because tritanium is mostly a high sec commodity in eve online.
Find another way to make ISK- there is no other viable way of making a living as a solo player. They can always gank you to make you go bankrupt.
I played EVE for quite a long time almost exclusively solo, and I have made quite a bit of ISK, enough to pay PLEX for multiple years. I have had to deal with ganking aspect. Look, there are games where you never run the risk of losing your stuff. I have played those games, and without risk you lose motivation to play eventually, it all loses it’s shine. In EVE there’s constant possibility of losing your stuff. Even in places where you are supposed to feel secure. This added risk is what makes this game different, and keeps players on their toes.
For 9 months I was able to play solo in NPC nullsec, mine nullsec ores, and haul them back to high sec. I never lost a BR/DST, nor a procurer. I didn’t have a second account to scout gates (which admittedly made things more dangerous than it should have been).
There’s more than one way to play. Ganking exists because the prey exists. If you go where there’s no other prey, there’s no other predators. Did it maximize ISK/hr? No, because maximizing that should involve more risky activity.
The assumptions I’ve seen that people tend to feel entitled to, in a “safe” manner, are things like:
- Insisting Jita (or Jita/Amarr) is/are the only trade hub(s)
- Insisting mining near trade hubs is the only way to mine
- Insisting compressing ore at structures that one owns
- Insisting max-yield fits are the only fits worth using
- Insisting on “the sandbox” (aka other players) catering to their playstyle
There are alternatives… so I hope it feels productive to go through your points and see what’s up:
Don’t pay, and go where there are no people demanding permits. Nothing says you have to mine in a system where there are people demanding permits. If you stay despite these people, then that says something about the values and risk/rewards you are trying to extract, and you should be accounting for these people as risks in that equation, not ignoring them and praying them to magically disappear.
That’s great, you have perfect intel then. You can count on them being there, so you can plan accordingly. If you still decide to carry 1B of loot in a T1 hauler through these systems, all the while knowing this, they’re not looking like the fool. You can plan:
- Break down large hauls into multiple smaller ones
- Skip-jump hauling setups
- Scouted hauling
- Pay ISK to someone else to figure it out
Knowing is half the battle. You’ve demonstrated you have the knowledge, what you do now reveals more about who you are and what kind of capsuleer you are in this game.
Golden rule of Eve: “Never fly what you cannot afford to lose”. If a new player is dumping all their money into a SOE ship like an astero then thats the elevated risk they are taking. They can do exploration in a dozen T1 frigates for the same amount of money. Nothing in this game demands you to “fly it min/max’d” except people’s own misplaced self-imposed beliefs.
If hauling is such a problem, why bother leaving a station at all? And why not hire a courier service? This is not a good point to make, it does not reflect well: everyone has to deal with the unpleasant experience of moving their own crap all the time, complaining about it is like having to complain about eating and defecating.
People with freighters aren’t new players and in a ship like that should know what they are doing and can afford to lose it, see the “perfect intel hauling” paragraph above; see the “golden rule paragraph above”.
Pick a site with a Freeport Athanor (open compression to the public), you get 0 wardecs and free compression. “But the freeports aren’t where I want them to be” – well, that’s just life, I guess? You could get a bunch of friends together and make your own Freeport Athanor in your favorite system and do the work to defend it – no one is stopping you from the attempt. If it sounds like a lot of work – then consider how the existing owners of Freeport Athanors must feel. Maybe there’s no Freeport Athanors in that system, because of those local politics in the land.
It is one thing to attempt to exert your player agency in-game to change those local player politics – that is playing with your agency within the sandbox – it is another to gripe on the forum and hope the devs can magic them away – that is denying other players their agency via outside the sandbox.
Compression is not the same as refining. Nothing says you have to refine in Perimeter itself. There’s more mineral markets than Jita (see original bullet point Insistence List).
Eve Online is not Eve Echoes, and it may just be my opinon, but I don’t want Eve Online to adopt the features nor the business model of a mobile game.
But you’re exactly right: “It doesn’t have to be this way”:
- Remove CONCORD from Hi Sec
- Remove structure requirement for War Decs
- Remove bubble restriction in Hi Sec
- Make ore and minerals contraband in Empire space
- Make catalyst material requirements solely 1 Trit
- Remove Insurance
- Reintroduce SP loss & pay-to-upgrade-clone-SP-protection mechanism
When proposing changes to the game, justifying “it doesn’t have to be this way” with “this is how it’s done on mobile” doesn’t really work especially when the very game itself has 2 decades of history of how much harder it was than today.