Struggling with Hyperion


(Ishmerai Killforge) #1

Just a question about the Hyperion. Is it hard to do lvl4’s in or is it just me? I’ve got tech 2 everything on it except for my guns. I don’t have a problem tanking anything, it just seems to take forever to kill anything. Granted, I only got into lvl4’s about 3 days ago so I know I’ve got a lot to learn.

Coming up through the pve missions, I used the catalyst, Thorax and Brutix. I didnt really want to fly a drone boat. So I feel like I have, or should have, a decent grasp on flying a gun boat. Once I chose the hyperion over the Megathron because I love the way it looks. Would the Megathron be a better choice?

Like I said, I have no trouble at all staying alive, just killing stuff. I can kill stuff, it just takes a long time. Will getting my guns to tech 2 make that big of a difference? I’ve tried blasters and rail guns, and of course each has it’s own playstyle. I prefer rails over blasters, but neither seemed to benefit over the other in my experience with my skills.

Anyways, just looking for advice or suggestions. I don’t mean to be complaining if it is coming across that way. Just wondering if I need to branch out into another ship or even a different faction if I feel like flying gun boats.

Thanks


(yellow parasol) #2

post your fitting, mate. :slight_smile:


(Do Little) #3

Use the copy to clipboard option in the fitting tool and paste your fit here. Odds are your problem is tracking - battleship guns have trouble hitting anything smaller than battleships.

A target painter and/or tracking computer will probably help a lot.


(Ishmerai Killforge) #4

Duh, sorry, should’ve posted this

[Hyperion, Ishmerai Killforge’s Hyperion]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Armor Thermal Hardener II
Large ‘Accommodation’ Vestment Reconstructer I
Damage Control II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II

500MN Microwarpdrive I
Tracking Computer II
Tracking Computer II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

[Empty High slot]
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun

Large Hybrid Discharge Elutriation I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Hobgoblin II x10
Ogre II x5

Tracking Speed Script x2
Uranium Charge L x3442
Antimatter Charge L x3794
Optimal Range Script x2


(JC Mieyli) #5

gun damage is very low even with all 5 skills
im guessing you dont have all 5 skills because youre using t1 fit
also depends on your playstyle
rails have bad tracking so if youre shooting stuff while running the mwd
then youre gonna struggle with tracking
might even struggle with tracking just slowboating depending on your skills and how you fly


(Ishmerai Killforge) #6

Yeah, my gunnery skills are low, only about 1.2mil which I do acknowledge. They’re all 4, except for Large Hybrid Turret and Trajectory Analysis which are at 3. If skills are the only thing holding me back, then thats fine. I can wait for skills to train. I just wanted to make sure that I wasn’t gimping myself by flying the Hyperion.

I hardly ever use the MWD, i usually just sit and shoot, or if there are lots of groups coming, then I’ll fly away and shoot whatever comes closest.

i might just be ultra sensitive to it also because a mate of mine flies a tengu and just speeds through lvl4’s like butter. He’s always saying that I should fly something else because I’m too slow. But then again, I dont’ know how much he actually knows if you know what I mean. Hope he doesn’t read the forums lol.


(Do Little) #7

For PVE I would recommend switching the MWD for an afterburner, replace the cap rechargers with a large cap battery and add a target painter.

The painter will make it a lot easier to kill smaller ships.

Everything below fits comfortably with my skills and you have 4 minutes of capacitor with everything running.

[Hyperion, Hyperion]
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Magnetic Field Stabilizer II
Damage Control II
Large ‘Accommodation’ Vestment Reconstructer I
Armor Thermal Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II

100MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script
Tracking Computer II, Tracking Speed Script
Parallel Enduring Target Painter
Large Cap Battery II

425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun, Antimatter Charge L
[empty high slot]

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Hybrid Discharge Elutriation I
Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I


(Ishmerai Killforge) #8

Nice thanks, I will definitely try that.


(JC Mieyli) #9

tracking shouldnt be too much of an issue then
when youre flying away from stuff and it follows in a straight line then your tracking is best
its probably more to do with the dps then
right now your fit is doing 529 dps with all 5s
which is less than some cruisers tbh but without the benefit of medium weapon application


(Ishmerai Killforge) #10

Yeah, that’s kind of what my mate keeps telling me, that my dmg was just low. Is this just something the Hyperion will struggle with you think? Should I try the Megathron? My only concern with that ship is I’m not sure my tank skills would be enough for it.


(JC Mieyli) #11

hyperion is a decent starter ship but its never gonna have great dps
ideally you want the t2 rails and t2 sentries to supplement the damage
megathron will have better damage but probably not a huge amount with your skills
and might not be worth it if your worried about tank
what kind of skills do you have and what can you fly


(Preacher Solette) #12

Try flying in the same direction as your targets and learn how tracking is more important than dps.


(Nerdz Rool) #13

Wouldnt a web do more than a TP for guns? Thought TP was meant for missiles.


(JC Mieyli) #14

not for rails would help for drones though


(Buoytender Bob) #15

I,too,advocate for a Web over aTP b.y training up your skills such that you can get a decent range Web, you can stop anything that get too close for your rails and let the guns and drones finish them off. Otherwise, the fits posted should work fine; you just need more time to developed your skills. Getting intoT2 guns and faction AM should give you a decent dps boost later.


(Ishmerai Killforge) #16

Awesome, thanks for the advice all. can’t wait to get home today and put it to use.


(Zhilia Mann) #17

This deserves a longer discussion.

First, a web won’t do anything at all for you if a target is moving either directly towards you or directly aware from you (that is, when angular velocity is 0 despite velocity being non-zero). But then neither will a target painter.

More importantly, if we simplify the tracking formula down to the relevant bits and just hold everything else constant we get something like:

image

Obviously as that exponent approaches 0 the chance to hit approaches 1. Ignoring k (which is constant for a given size gun anyway) and assuming the falloff term is 0 we’re left with just

image

So either we can minimize the numerator or maximize the denominator to exactly the same effect.

Let’s assume, then, that we have the option of applying a 60% web or a 37.5% target painter (max skilled T2 module bonuses). Assuming angular/sig starts at 1, the web takes it down to .4 (or to be more complete, if the chance to hit starts at 50%, the web brings that up to .5^.4, or 75.8% chance to hit).

Likewise, the painter starting at 1 goes to .72, or a chance to hit of .5^.72 = 60.7%. The web very clearly wins out.

Unless we bring in other factors.

The big issue is, of course, range. The web will vastly increase your chance to hit (which will also increase hit quality, but that’s another post) inside 10km. Or 18.2km with an overheated faction web; it really doesn’t matter. That’s closer than you want things to be in a rail boat other than maybe a bastioned Kronos with Javelin L loaded.

The painter may feature a relatively modest increase to hit chance, but it does so out to 54km – which is about a rail Hyperion’s antimatter optimal if I recall correctly. You’ll also get diminishing effects all the way out past lock range. Small(er) effect, sure, but it applies at relevant ranges.

The web is very much a TIFU module. Can’t shake that spider drone and didn’t fit a MJD? Web is your best bet. Painter won’t help enough (and honestly the web might not either). However, if you want to increase damage applied to the vast majority of targets you’re actually shooting you want a painter.


(Nerdz Rool) #18

You are actually right. I was thinking about blasters, my bad.

Good write-up!


(Panther X) #19

Honestly the Hyperion is an ok ship, but not a mission runner. The better ship for mission running for Gallente is the Dominix, if you must run a battleship. A Domi with T2 Sentries/Heavies and a decent fit will not set you back a lot of money, but will out last a rail fit Hype; especially on missions like Angel Extravaganza etc.
In my experience, the Gallente ships are better for missions, Pirate hulls like the Rattlesnake are even better, but require more training. Missiles and drones are my favoured way. Only a Marauder will outblast and outlast everything else in missions.


(Buoytender Bob) #20

Just a damn fine explanation that gives the reasoning and choices a player has to make. Hope you are one of the go to posters who can lay out both sides of an issue/explain game mechanics elsewhere in the forums. Take a like; it’is well earned.