Suggestion: War Declaration rework

@OP, your track record for ideas is miserable. You seem to loath the core mechanics, while simultaneously completely failing to understand them. Your understanding appears to be somewhere in the realm of fever hallucinations and chemical inspired fantasies: your assumptions have no connection to reality. You do more damage to the game with your terrible ideas and statements than you would do by just uninstalling.

Yes there are issues. There are issues with literally every single mechanic in the game. For progress to be made in any of these discussions, there has to be people who understand the nuance of what makes a thing succeed and fail. You have not demonstrated yourself to be one of those people. Not even a little.

In short: this idea has no basis in reality. It is a solution to nothing, and would gut the game.


Damage for the individuals who think scamming, cheating, abusing others is “good” for the game, or its people. If that is the cause, im ready to drop a universal powered nuke on it, and i’ll call it form posting to the point where the 63% Out cry for the changes to take place, in which case. GG and since ccp is leaning in this direction and planning on making changes in this direction, Get ready for change.

AKA “the EVE developers”. EVE was designed from day one to be a game where scamming, cheating, etc, are part of the game. This freedom to be the bad guy is why EVE is still around long after other games of its era have died. Stories of epic betrayals and scams and general dirty tricks have been responsible for recruiting countless players who want to play a game like that. If you don’t like it then GTFO and go play WoW or some other carebear game where the GMs will ensure that you never suffer any losses no matter how terrible you are.

You can already do that. It’s called the uninstall button. And since you seem to hate the game, maybe that’s the answer. There are a ton of other games that already serve the no-risk no-real-achievement genre you want to be playing.

You’ll notice I’m not bothering taking my conversations with you deeper than just calling your ideas bad. It’s because I sincerely believe you don’t even have the capacity to understand what makes a game worthwhile, that your perceptions are so broken it would be futile to even attempt to turn one of these threads productive.

I guess when we’re at it we should abolish poker too, you know in it people “scam” others by lying, trickery and mind games; they “cheat” others by pretending and manipulation; they “abuse” others by exploiting their weaknesses, luring them into traps and taking their money and may even brag about it later on… as you put it such things surely can not be good for the poker game nor poker players themselves… who would even play such a game and enjoy it?!

While there are people who do not understand what EVE (or poker) is about and may even try to get into it and never get it and just be disappointed, their misunderstanding of the game and why it is good is not a proof of the game being bad (or evil) nor that it should be changed, it just demonstrates that not everyone thinks alike and not every game is for everyone.

As for CCP, they do delusional things all the time, this is basically their track record so maybe they will do what you suggest, it may even work and not lead to EVE’s downfall who knows, but still here and now (and in the past) EVE is a PvP game where almost everything is allowed and this is the quintessence of EVE (now and in the past) and there is nothing wrong / bad / evil about it, just as nothing such about winning in chess or poker or whatever and despite trickery / deception, mind games, laying traps and whatnot are all part of most games to some extent if it is within the rules nobody should complain, it is all part of the experience and it is a good thing it is part of the experience.

Not every game is for everyone.

From the 8 Golden Rules of Eve:

"Everyone can scam - and so can you

Never grant corporation rights to stuff you can’t afford to lose either. No exceptions.
People offering free stuff? Probably traps. Be cautious.
Free stuff usually isn’t. Not even minerals you mine yourself.
If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Paranoia pays off here. Double-check everything.
Scamming and unethical behavior some would consider griefing is not only allowed, it is encouraged and rewarded by the game mechanics.
Harassment or real-life threats are not ok, and you can get a shiny ban for them. Learn the difference."

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This game is really not for you. It started going under when it made hi-sec wars harder to make. It’s a pvp game that keeps nerfing pvp. THATS why its going under.

Yes, a game with 63% of pvers that never pvp or fleet up is the reason why a pvp game is dying.
Do you even think before you post?

Thakn god our generation of “i need to 1 shot noobs, and i though get 12i9301232 power because i research into the complexity of the game” is GOING OUT OF THE INDUSTRY FOR GOOD. Thank the light for that.

Here’s some infor for you to consider

  1. less then 50% of a game pvps.
  2. 36 of the 36-37% (depending on game metrics) only pvp when they can choose to do so and have no hard loss
    this means around 8-9% of pvpers who do it religiously.

In the eyes of keeping the game (and many others alive) PvPers do jackk (btw its all i do in any game i play).

Eve relies on the cycle of construction and destruction. If you start limiting the amount of PVP that happens in the game, you start causing issues to the economy, which will make all those highsec-dwellers less happy due to them not getting the nice iskies anymore as there isn’t enough destruction happening to give value to the items they build or loot.

Those are the stats AFTER the nerfs. Thats why players are leaving because it’s harder to hunt and get fights.

When it was easier to wardec, scam, ninja and all the other things you hate, the playerbase grew every year and more players pvp’d.

Thats what I’m trying to get through to you.

The vast majority of players that quit don’t even get shot at. They quit because they are bored. New players that get shot at actually stick around longer.

TIP for all in this thread:

Google for ‘HEARTS, CLUBS, DIAMONDS, SPADES: PLAYERS WHO SUIT MUDS’, an old article on mud player types which surprisingly still works in Eve-online as well. So yes I know all kinds of players including killers need to be present in the right amount for a perfect balance, it’s what Eve keeps alive.

My 2 cents on serial wardecs:

As a mining/production corp I’m at the receiving side of serial wardecs, facing very well equipped players with very deep pockets just sitting on top of a empire trade hub shooting all red stuff (the kind of alliance that runs 50-250 wars simultaneously). Our player base does not allow us to mount a counter offensive.

My observation is also that a lotta ‘stupid/badly informed’ players (sorry if you are in this category) still go to that camped system with freighters/orca’s loaded with their garage sale or are moving base and get shot/podded. Put some systems on the avoid list (if possible) works quite well. Checking zkillboard for player times/locations also does wonders.

What I would like is to see a way to break these endless chains of wardecs every now and then, giving the wardeccers some bones to chew from time to time. I’m not against HS wardecs , but the single sidedness is quite annoying. Hiding and not giving content only works partially (because of locator agents). Highsec gankers at least have a fair chance of getting shot by Concord.

Suggestions would be:

  • Be able to hire Concord as ally (there is even already a skill for talking to concord).
  • Limit the number of wardecs / months in a certain area forcing them to spread out or move.
  • Clip the number of simultaneous wars a corp/alliance can have.
  • Not lift Concord assistance completely but extend their response time a bit (double it).
  • If a locater agent is used, you get concord assistance.

You already have one. Perhaps you should try hiring mercenaries, if you can not produce a PvP fleet capable of doing something about the problem?

That’s often another bottomless pit to throw money into (imho).

I examine a lotta war reports when wardecced and did see not so much influence / kills by mercenaries sofar. We even got offers of 1 person corps having no kills in at least a year and they still thought of themselves as mercenaries. Often it seems like a side-corp of the wardecced, to even the wardec costs.

Besides our main serial wardeccer sits on top of the trade hub station most of the time (they sometimes take a tour and camp one of the gates of this system, quite an undertaking ;-).

So a single press on ‘D’ and they are safely docked and untouchable by mercenaries.

The option i did not mention (forgot) is to pay the wardeccers so they leave you alone. That raises a question on how reliable they are and wether they do not hand you over to the next serial gang.

Most of the corporations that do mass wardecs only sit in tradehubs or the popular routes to them. They are pretty easily avoided by staying out of the major hubs for a week.

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the problem is

  1. the gui for hiring corporations is totally hidden. Needs to be moved to its own button on nav.
  2. the system needs to be upgraded for it to work properly.
  3. the system needs to be reworked so that the isk paid is paid after victory is done, and the defended ceo must agree to it.
  4. a rating system where victory/loss is displayed based on how many they successfully won or lost would benefit the merc corp greatly.
  5. The isk value to be paid is set on players and their sp level (use the levels in injectors are a tier system to value against, the more sp, the more paid)
    until (all of these) things like this are done, merc corps really are not going to get much benefit.

bonus’s could be found in things like

  • the defending ceo can opt to pay a % of the ship value destroyed, or per ship kill isk value (which they can set).

It’s what we do, it gets us a week of non-wardec and it starts all over.

Interesting solution. Might even work if we get lazy mercs to work for money. Much of the stats are avail on zkillboard but not easy retrievable/

Btw in the past we also saw merc’s turning on the hiring corp after the wardec finished.

So you know you get a wardeck if you go into tradehubs and yet you keep doing it? I’m guessing you are moving items to and from there in haulers?

Try putting that hauler into NPC-corp to move the items.

I don’t buy the “can’t put up a defensive fleet” excuse. I did it when every single person in my corp was rookies. Nearly all of us were still in frigates or destroyers, and there weren’t that many of us. Thank god they had a (in retrospect obvious) spy in our corp and dropped the dec so we didn’t have to actually fight them. Further wars taught me one big lesson: Wardeccers seem to be the most loss averse players I’ve ever seen. 1 or 2 losses is usually all it takes to get them to drop the dec. I’ve even seen a single close call, almost-loss make a wardeccer abandon a dec, and in one case disband the corp. They aren’t scary people. Which shows the real problem with wardecs, that the defenders are taught to be even more chickenshit than the attackers.

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How many of those 63% you keep spewing are alts.Quite a few years back I used to have 1 guy for lowsec piracy before tags for sec status was a thing.Because there was no isk to be really made I had 2 highsec alts to feed him isk.Those alts were never used in PvP.