Tech II Research

Nothing “goes without saying”.
You’re the one proposing these changes, it’s on you to give details.
If you don’t state what other changes would go along with your idea, the rest of us will, quite fairly, assume that everything not specifically outlined by you would remain as is.

Come on you can do better than this.

-75% materials needed at ME1000 means 0.075% points less per level if you want it to be linear.

Reducing the reprocessing yield may cause buy order prices to crash, but sell orders will likely not crash they will slowly drop which is the intention.

At the end of the day a higher tier reearch job and ME1000 is also an expansion of the research profession.

So if you’re saying the ME is 0.075% less per level to make ME1000 -75%, that means an existing ME10 blueprint would have a material reduction of 0.75%.

If ME10 remains at a 10% reduction, 1 point is 1%, but at ME1000 1 point is 0.075%, the value of the points changes so the reduction in cost isn’t linear.

Or are you suggesting something like this:

Why would the sell orders slowly drop? Since the cost of ships on the market is pretty much driven by the cost of the inputs, the minute the ship can be built for 75% less industrialists will start selling them for the cheaper price and the old sell orders will just sit there.

Economics is not an exact science but reaching ME1000 (-75%) is ideally going to take time but demand will likely stay consistent therefore prices will slowly drop. But this is a challenging way of achieving lower prices on Exhumers and Freighters, compared to slashing material requirement overnight, but that doesn’t mean its a bad way.

The new research job could be done as a new attribute on the BP: For example “MES” and it doesent have to go all the way to 1000. 100 may suffice. But at max level it means -75% material required. As long as ME is below MES in terms of raw materials required the game will use the ME attribute to determine input requirements. Does that make sense?

One potential issue is that players will eventually demand MES research be possible on all BPOs.

I haven’t specifically said its a bad idea, but given the lack of detail initially it prompts quite a few questions about how it would work.

It would certainly be one way to do it, although as you say it wouldn’t be long before it was demanded on everything.

One other issue is how long would you suggest the research takes for the extra ME? currently it increases exponentially, for a Charon 0-1 is 3hr43m and costs 31,414isk, 9-10 is 218d20h17m 44,369,646isk.

The bigger issue is your posts mention that the reasoning for this is to reduce the impact of ganking for the victim, particularly new players. Are any stats available to show the number of ganks in relation to the number of hours mined, or any other measurement of the actual risk?

Yesterday there were 60 exhumer deaths on zkill in total, with 15 in hisec, of these only 3 were less than 3 months old, most were over 5 years, several over 10.

From the December MER, you can see that hisec makes up over 50% of the overall volume mined of ice and ore, so the hours spent mining hisec vs other are likely also higher, especially considering the weaker boosts available.

Given the fact that the volume mined in hisec is over 50%, and yet hisec only incurred 25% of the exhumer losses, the risk is clearly much higher out of hisec, so a reduction in price is going to be of much greater benefit to low/null players.

The exponential increase in time to reach the next ME level rubs me the wrong way since the material efficiency does not get exponentially better each level.

I’m leaning toward “MES” having 1000 levels in total and each level has a base research time of 24 hours and a 0.075% points in material reduction for each level. Players can research a few levels then do some manufacturing and then research a few levels again, so on so forth.

it would take months of uninterrupted “MES” research to reach -10% material efficiency using the above stats and over 2 years to reach the maximum -75% assuming “MES” research is not affected to a large degree by bonuses from skills, rigs, implants etc. But maybe it should

Alternatively the maximum “MES” level could be 100, its cleaner, and then each level may have a base time of 7 days to complete and in that case each level would increase material efficiency about 0.5% points in order for it to still take months to reach 10% and a couple years for the maximum -75% assuming no bonuses of any kind affect the “MES” research speed. Have a nice day.

Yes, because it is. It’s an activity that is explicitly designed into the game and for the gankers, it is fun and for the overall game, it is healthy. Ganking is the immune system of the game.

So, no, and not only no, but you don’t appear to understand any portion of the mechanics this ties into, nor does your solution make sense for the stated purpose, given the time aspects you just set up.

  1. You’re assuming the same raw improvement is the same level of value to begin with. This is flatly untrue based on relative competitive advantage being worth far far more than the raw cost of inputs, as you have the lowest floor to make a profit and thus can dive below others.
  2. -75% is so high that you can then re-proc it for a total gain of 30% of the base resources. 45% is the theoretical cap before building an immediately reprocessing turns into a gain on modules, ships and anything else which uses the scrapmetal processing formula.

Reproccesing issue is a good point but its already been covered. However i would like to scrap most of the idea anyway. Thank you to people who responded.

I heard there are tech 2 bpos. That would be an ME infinite fur the invention process right?

I support your idea until all tech 2 bpos are deleted.