The Abyss is training to do missions in t1 cruiser/Faction Cruiser/Hacs/Heavy interdictors

(Ka Vin) #1

{I patched this up in my head since rocketting Wide awake at 2am today so it’s not university grade)

Each different Abyssal Deadspace Environment specifically dictates the ship that it is intended to train you in.
Dark Matter Field:
Bonus to maximum velocity
Penalty to turret range Minmatar Rupture/Munin/Broadsword

Plasma Firestorm:
Bonus to armor HP
Penalty to thermal resistance Gallente Thorax/Deimos Phobos

Exotic Particle Storm:
Bonus to scan resolution
Penalty to kinetic resistance Vedmak (future t2 vedmak?)

Electrical Storm:
Bonus to capacitor recharge
Penalty to EM resistance Amarr Maller/Zealot/Devoter

Gamma-Ray Afterglow:
Bonus to shield HP
Penalty to explosive resistance Caldari Moa/Eagle/Onyx

The ships are the progression that should be used to do the racial missions.
Once we learn how to fit and FLY the ships properly for the Abyss/Missions.
We will be ready to fit and FLY the Vedmak in it’s environment.
And here’s my understanding of the reason why… Once we have leaned to use the Vedmak properly, a new area of space will be probably be opened up and we will encounter the precursors (Jovians?) in their natural environment,

For example, If I wanted to train you to fly Amarr ships in PVE I might:
Create an environment that
-gave a bonus to your capacitor recharge rate so that when you fit your ship you would have more lee way and could better utilize your modules.
-taketh away that extra strength you have on your armor tank to balance out your overall resists because I’m going to throw a variety of challenges at you.
(I did not notice any incoming em damage on my adaptive armor resistance module I think it was just thermal and explosive when i moused over during a lvl 2)
[The other Environments seem obviously tailored to the other races ships bonuses]
After I created the environment for Amarr I might give it a cool name like “electrical storm” and then make it from easy to hard 1 - 5
Then if I were to decide which ships I wanted you to use I might specifically design each lvl to best test the ship I intended to train you in, in a variety of different ways.
I might choose a Maller for lvl 1 Electrical then give you challenges that tested your ability to quickly change crystal types for long and short range targets.
Change crystal types on the fly for high damage stationary targets or squishy distance targets that moved fast.
Tests that made you move your ship for best transversal and range on different types of targets and stay aware of your environment to keep out of range of negative influences and perhaps incoming weaponry or effects.
(man I can almost picture white board top down design sketches lying on the office floor in my head)
Then if you passed the lvl 1 test consecutive times and got a hang of the kinds of challenges I was going to throw at you i might suggest you head to lvl 2 and try out a faction ship like the Omen Navy Issue and throw more tests at you that required an even firmer grasp of the above basics and throw in some armor rep management and positioning tactics , make you seriously consider Tracking of your weapons and webbing and the effects of the warp scrambler on those nasty mwding frigates.
In successive levels of the Amarr training program I might have you strongly consider the bonuses of your pirate ships neuts and nosses if you chose to use them on ships that might rely on their capacitors or extended webs on ships that have the need for speed. (I think the previous is actually irrelevant now, but i’m leaving it in to remember)
(This next bit is old but i’m leaving it in. just learn to fly)
At the high levels (I conjecture I haven’t passed my training course yet) I might design your training to have you be expert at all of the above and hopped up on drugs with tons of gear in your head and a Faction fit HAC that you knew like the back of your hand {lvl 5 mastery perhaps}. [On further reflection, buffing your mods with Mutaplasmids might be the thing too]
In the design process I might make the consequences Digital… win yes… win no.

Rewards - are save up all your bits you collect and build your own Vedmak to TRAIN in the exotic particle storm

(How many of you will be flying a Triglavian cruiser? probably those who have earned them will wish to hang on to them, and no one is going to profit from farming the parts.)
And If I looked at the vastly bigger picture I might say that if Triglavian pilots who wished to be succesful wanted to really get ahead, they might want to get together in a community and trade the filaments needed to get into the Environment they wanted to focus on according to the Racial ships they felt most suited their flying style, instead of trying to make huge isk selling off their unwanted filaments to be able to afford huge isk to buy the wanted filaments (you can sell it for say a plasma for 1 isk on contracts I believe, then require to receive an electrical as well)
In conclusion: IMO The Abyssal Deadspace is not New Eve.
Abyssal Deadspace is an advanced tutorial to solo lvl 5 missions and to train for additional releases that will open up new space inhabitted by Triglavians or Precursors or whatever the F***.
Pick a Race.
Fly it’s ships.
Fly them well.
Or die.
Welcome to EVE.
(The 5th race/environment is triglavian ship training?)
edited for stream-of-conciouness. and spelling read it Carefully
In my bio, in game I’m updating what I’ve learned as I go.

(CaseyLP) #2


Eagle - Most underrated ship for abyssal space?
(Zhilia Mann) #3

I mean, that’s all interesting theorycrafting, but none of it holds up if you actually run the sites.

Nope. This is a drone/missile region. Sac is great, I’m sure Gila can handle it.

More or less, yes. Deimos is probably best in class here, but Eagle does fine. You might be able to swing a Vedmak here.

WTF? Disintegrators do Exp/Therm. Why would you choose one for a kin filament? This is either Cerb or Deimos/Eagle or Sac again.

Zealot might be good, but I have a good sense that Sac does better.

Sac/Gila here. Honestly any ship that can deal exp is in a half-decent place to start with. If that ship happens to shield tank as well so much the better. This would be the other place a Vedmak might work.

I’m using a Sac for everything I can but the Gila is plenty tempting. I have one fit for event sites. It’s called “give in to the meta”. There’s a reason for that. Seriously.


(Ka Vin) #4

Changed my mind about some things:
I don’t think they will open up new space, I think the precursors will break out of their space and DED will get directly involved issuing missions to restrain them and further that DED will develop a T2 version of the Vedmak based on the Triglavian technologies.

Not only is each Environment tailored to each races class of ships, but you can successfully train to do the Abyss sites by practicing first with them in your races major navy missions/anomalies and sigs both rated and unrated.

There’s been a few people who have said no, that’s not true “because I lost a ship doing thus and such” or, “such and such a ship can do something just fine” . I’m not saying it’s impossible to do it with the wrong ship
It’s just doing it with the wrong ship.
If you pan out and look at the big picture it becomes obvious that the progression is T1 cruiser, Faction cruiser, HAC, Heavy Interdictor.
(Not sure about the heavy interdictor, might be for lvl 5 missions?)
Each different races ships need to be the appropriate intended PVE ship and it must be fit in such a way to make full use of its bonuses and make up for its shortcomings, and you can use the cheap ships to learn for the first couple of lvls.
(I suggest recording things like effects in certain colored clouds)
The lower levels are INTENDED for you to learn the different effects you will encounter later and learn to recognize and remember them when more expensive ships are on the line.
Practicing in missions and anoms etc allows you to make mistakes with more time usually to make up for them, and warp out and start again, they prepare you for the abyss. The abyss is more intensive training no time for mistakes at the higher levels (I conjecture)
So I only started flying amarr fairly recently. I’ll be headed to Amarr space to practice and get some cool faction Mods and Domination Crystals I’m sure I’ll need later and practice in anoms I can back out of and learn something from without costing my ship and my pod. And I’ll be Taking my knowledge with me into the Abyss and collecting skill books and materials and blueprints for the Precursor ships and I’ll practice in the Exotic environment to fight the coming Invasion.
Because Missions Never really interested me before but with the added depth it sure has changed things for me.
Thanks CCP
This is Brilliant, Genius,Fantastic.
(p.s. Sorry to have ruined the surprise)

(Ka Vin) #5

With the Vedmak being so geared towards armor-rep-chaining I theorize that all of the above is in aid of getting those who can fit in the mold of how the system is intended to work into combined Human/AI fleets in order to complete objectives (like the Amarr advanced combat tutorial) perhaps culminating in Human/AI fleets fighting other Human/AI fleets for storyline objectives etc.
Wouldn’t it be cool to have the PVE missions be training for PVP flying of the ships in their intended roles, like doing bomber missions as the human representative of the AI Caldari Navy fleet VS The AI Gallente Fleet which might have Humans filling the Logistics role
Whatever comes after the Precursors…
Maybe we only have a few years left before the invasion of the “buggers” vis a vis Enders game and we are the elite few who will save the Earth. I hope so.
I for one Welcome our new Triglavian Overlords
or maybe

(Dark Engraver) #6

You seriously need first to take your medication. Secondly read up on what’s happening around with the sites and what ships are used.

(Ka Vin) #7

Just looking at Minmatar I could be convinced that the Stabber/Stabber Fleet/Vagabond might be intended, I just don’t see how the the broadsword would fit into the picture, so maybe Heavy interdictors aren’t a thing.
I haven’t been focussing on the other races, been doing the electrical sites so I’ll leave correction up to others.

(Ka Vin) #8

Omen/Omen/ Navy Issue/Zealot
Maybe the sacrilege chain but the switchover to missiles this late in the game seems odd.
I was so sure about the maller, guess I better go fit out some Omens.

(Omnathious Deninard) #9

On SISI I used a blaster Deimos for all tier 3 sites, I had some dead space modules on it for a bit. I removed them and made the entire ship a T2 and meta build with no implants I finally lost the ship

(TzakaPaka) #10

Eveyrthing claimed by this dude in this thread is wrong. There`s only 3 ships that can the Abyss consistantly and only one good all rounder. Ships are Sacrilege, Deimos and Gila. With the Gila alone being capable of doing all tiers of all kinds in the Abyss. What you claim is ■■■■■■■■. You know nothing.

(Ildrara) #11

Vagabond works just fine in tier 4.

(Ka Vin) #12

So personally I’m not a fantastic Flier so I have had to go slow and start off on calm electrical Abyssal sites. Though it isn’t flashy or sexy I decided that I wanted to go about training somewhat like real life.
I’ve done 13 of the calm electricals with

[Maller, Maller]
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Capacitor Power Relay II
Reactive Armor Hardener
Heat Sink II

Medium Cap Battery II
10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
Tracking Computer II

Heavy Pulse Laser II
Heavy Pulse Laser II
Heavy Pulse Laser II
Heavy Pulse Laser II
Heavy Pulse Laser II

Medium Energy Metastasis Adjuster I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Energy Collision Accelerator I

Acolyte II x3

Optimal Range Script x1
Tracking Speed Script x1
Conflagration M x5
Imperial Navy Multifrequency M x5
Scorch M x5
Imperial Navy Gamma M x5
Imperial Navy Xray M x5
Imperial Navy Ultraviolet M x5
Imperial Navy Standard M x5
Imperial Navy Infrared M x5
Imperial Navy Microwave M x5
Imperial Navy Radio M x5

Which on the face of it isn’t special, but I haven’t flown Amarr much and I wanted something versatile to see what ammo did what and If my fit was going to work at all.
(I suspect the calm sites are forgiving of a variety of low level fits)
My first try at a calm electrical was in a Navy Issue ship and I ended up jettisoning early because I just couldn’t track the smaller ships so I’m hesitant throw good isk after bad.
No problems with this, It also allows me to apply more damage to the bigger ships by switching over to the optimal range script.
(A buddy uses a different style of fit with the Focused Medium Pulse Laser II and a webber and has no problem with tracking)
I’ve completed 13 of the calm sites with this one and lost it in one on the agitated sites (Can’t remember why, i was agitated myself at the time, so made some mistakes.)
I found that the -50% em debuff didn’t apply to any one thing but was spread unevenly through my ship roughly coinciding with the damage control stats i think i lost 12.5/12.5/25 shield/armor/hull em resistance…roughly.

I also found that If I fit my ship with excess capacitor recharge rate better than -50% than the bonus in the electrical site allowed me to remain cap stable.(so a little more leeway in the fit.)

If it seems like the triglavian you are trying to blow up has logi, he probably does. They seem to be slow on switching reps at lower levels anyway, so if you drop weapons and start shooting all the others you can catch them off guard and by-pass the whole repping situation.

So I’ve moved up to Agitated sites and though I feel with some tweeking the maller fit could be made to do it I moved into a Navy Augoror, which i like because of only 3 lasers sucking cap and all that extra armor. also the added low slot allows me to put in an ancillary armor repairer and Having recently heard of the wonders of the Thukker Large cap battery I could replace the medium cap battery for even more protection against possible neuts.
It’s a totally different fit and so far I’ve only completed 1 agitated electrical in it, I feel it has promise though .

[Augoror Navy Issue]
Damage Control II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Medium Ancillary Armor Repairer
Reactive Armor Hardener
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

Thukker Large Cap Battery
Tracking Computer II
10MN Afterburner II

Medium Energy Nosferatu II
Medium Energy Neutralizer II
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Energy Burst Aerator I
Medium Dynamic Fuel Valve I

Acolyte II x3

Optimal Range Script x1
Tracking Speed Script x1
Conflagration M x3
Imperial Navy Multifrequency M x3
Scorch M x6
Imperial Navy Gamma M x3
Imperial Navy Standard M x5
Nanite Repair Paste x328
Imperial Navy Microwave M x8
Agency ‘Hardshell’ TB3 Dose I x1
Standard Drop Booster x1
Standard Exile Booster x1

It’s still not a hugely expensive ship so I don’t mind the prospect of losing the isk it cost through mistakes I’ve made in the merciless Abyss.
I might go back to the maller after I’m more comfortable in the agitated sites just to see if I change the fit I can adapt my own responses to better use the ship.

I’ll re-iterate that I believe we are best served not by jumping in and Blasting away with the most powerful ships we can muster and then blaming the design of the sites for our failures but by slowly and methodically acclimating ourselves to the different challenges that will be presented to us at lower levels with lower risk and cost, formulating our responses to those challenges and then repeatedly practicing so that they become second nature. Then at the higher levels we can focus on the differences in the challenges and use our knowledge of the past to help guide us in overcoming the present.

Fly weird

(Ka Vin) #13

On the twitch stream CCP released that Through knowledge gained by adapting Triglavian technologies SOE would be releasing some sort of “better” Triglavian-like ship to be awarded to Alliance tournament (participants/winners?) or something of the sort.
What that means to me is my prediction of it being a Concord designed T2 Triglavian ship is out to lunch.
I was basing my prediction on Concords interest in the Triglavian Survey Databases which I guess Is just unrelated.
Maybe Concord will still be sending us out on missions though?

(Arthur Aihaken) #14

I’m just going to say that it sucks being limited to cruisers.

(TzakaPaka) #15

Try the ingame ‘Abyss channel’. You`ll get lots of answears in that channel

(system) #16

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