The real reasons player population is declining

–Gadget imagines something more like this


If someone takes my PvE site he is not toxic or a bully. He’s just stronger in this PvP game. That’s it.

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Austrian here. You know, the better germans.
Is this supposed to be a Schwarzwälder KirschTorte?

Spoken like a true Neo-Marx… huh, psychologist I mean,…

The day you discover that human nature is not a matter of ‘should be’ but of ‘is’, this will be the day you understand EVE.

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Can you elaborate on this?

Had a RL Philosophy lecturer who I thought had his shiite together ( from the breadth of his quotable reading ), until he said in class " the more I learn about human behaviour ( ref violence to fellow man ) the more confused I become."

I have low expectations about most, therefor seldom confused about peoples base behaviour

In ref to Eve and its declining population, I do believe toxic behaviour does play a significant part.

However its hard for the player base to provide meaningful conclusions, without access to CCP’s stats and data base. Exit interviews on recently departed players are key. I personally reached out and emailed victims of a particularly deceptive gank/scam, documented in the C&P forum ( thx Robocop & alias’ ). And there are a lot of victims, over 80% indicated ( if they were not already inactive ) they were planning to leave the game. Some may say ( trained in research psy ) this is too small a sample to be a significant indicator.

It was significant enough for me to get the sads from some of their comments, relating to basic human trust.


Ja, es ist eine ersatz Schwarzwälder KirschTorte.

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That cake is a lie. :confused:

lol yeah it’s a generic shop bought one, it doesn’t look right when you’ve had the real thing.

Swiss here. The better austrians.

It looks like someone inflated three oreo cookies and put a few cherries on top.


Somehow I have the feeling I may end up regretting keeping this thread alive a little more and giving Auto-da-fe another excuse to continue posting gibberish here, but hey, I have a thing or two to say too… :slight_smile:

Let me start by saying I have strong ethic principles, not only in RL but also in EVE. I never have and never will steal from, scam, or cause grief to anyone unless he’s a griever himself. Not with this char, not with any of my other chars.

I’m a known anti-ganker even. I love hunting and harassing criminals and figuring ways to kill or neutralise them before the victim dies.

And about 4 moths ago in January I stopped playing EVE too.

But man…

Do I disagree with everything you (the OP) said. Not a single sentence in your very long diatribe is correct. You have it all wrong.

You could have posted in the forums asking what you did wrong and how you could have avoided being ganked, but no, you had to choose waste your and everybody else’s time posting nonsense instead. Your post shows a complete ignorance of EVE design and mechanics, an unwillingness to learn, and a desire to have the game “fixed” and tailored to you so you don’t have to adapt and do things differently.

This is very rude to all the other players that have made the effort to learn what EVE is about and happen to like it. You’re basically telling them that, instead of you making the effort to learn how to pick, fit and fly your ships, every other player should be deprived of the game they like and play the game you want instead.

And on top of that you pretend that a game is not just a game, that EVE should follow and enforce the same ethics and morale that rule RL, and that everybody that plays “wrongful” in EVE has to be a bad person in RL too… Pardon?

EVE is not RL, it’s a game… A GAME… But it’s not just that. You’re completely missing what makes EVE great, namely that EVE is also a SANDBOX for social experimentation.

In order for the sandbox to be interesting and useful, it must have a much higher degree of freedom than would be tolerable in RL. You don’t want the definition of “right” and “wrong” to be established upfront out of the sandbox. You want to give the participants as much freedom as possible, let them decide what’s right and wrong within the sandbox, and see what happens. Precisely because it’s a game and not RL, you don’t have to worry about the harm that may be done within the sandbox as a result.

And what’s all that crap about EVE being a “simulation” that you keep talking about throughout your post? Where did you get the idea that EVE is or pretends to be a “simulation”? A simulation of what? EVE is a sandbox… A SANDBOX… not a “simulation”…

OK, so after having cleared all that up, back to the subject of your post… What are the real reasons the player population is declining? I have no idea. I don’t think there is a simple answer to that question, much less a simple solution, and certainly not the “solution” you’re suggesting. Actually, I don’t even know whether the player population is really declining atm.

I do know it cannot be because of what you say because EVE has always been harsh by design. It’s not like it was a nice place to chill out before and suddenly became hell, so the fact that you and others have quit because you were ganked may be relevant to you but doesn’t mean ■■■■ in that regard – and it amazes me that you pretend to know what has to be done without having a clue what EVE is about and how to play it.

I can tell you why I stopped playing EVE a few months ago, though. CCP sometimes makes stupid design decisions that make an already complex game unnecessarily harder and more cumbersome for everyone, like when they removed the very nice Agent Finder in January and replaced it with a half-assed version that lacks much of the functionality the old Agent Finder had. I cannot stand that kind of silly decisions, so I decided it was time to take a break and spend the time doing other things instead.

See? I also stopped playing EVE recently because there was something about it I strongly disliked. That kind of things makes me think there’s something fundamentally wrong with the game designers, but it’s all gameplay related, because it’s a game. It has nothing to do with ethics or RL projections.

BTW, there are a myriad of games out there. You don’t have to like them all and none of them has to be liked by everybody. Why would you play a game you don’t like and pretend it should be changed to something else (without even understanding it) when you could play a game that you do like instead?


When something declines in popularity so many people want to blow some steam by declaring it as dead.

Problem is that software is hard to die.

Take WOW , it lost like 80% of player base before Legion, after the Legion expansion it has exploded in numbers and its more popular than ever, with more than 12 million active account (meaning people who actually bother to log in) , numbers reported by Blizzard themselves.

It also deserves the come back, Legion was an awesome expansion.

I don’t think EVE is doing bad either, the company really cares about the game and I am amazed how much stuff they offer to free accounts. The new updates also looks very promising.

Its not the players that keep a game alive, its the developers. If the developers really care about the game they will deliver high quality content and even if they lose all their players base, those players will come back.

I started with WOW in 2010 , I played for a month until the insane grind bored me to death. The Legion story brought me back to discover, to my suprise, a WOW that was massively improved.

So losing players can be a very good motivation for developers to fix the problems and improve the game with new fresh ideas.

Personally I am very happy with EVE, I like the game as it is, apart from PVP that needs a ton of improvement to be viable for me. Fortunately PVE is the biggest part of EVE and for now keeps me very happy.





The game has become a joke. People put real money, real effort and real time into the game and to see that go up in a suicide gank is rather frustrating. No thanks I’ll go play other games.

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You should see Overwatch. People blowing away hundreds, if not thousands, of dollars into the loot box system that has become a complete joke while players harass each other for not playing according to their “meta” and will falsely accuse you of intentionally throwing a competitive match for even trying to use Symmetra or Hanzo.

As for people throwing real world money into Eve Online by the thousands of dollars, those are an extreme minority in a niche game. Read the articles. You’ll likely only find a few of them in a sea of players who feel that $15/month is too expensive for their taste.


People in EvE are always telling me I should be playing Hello Kitty Island Adventure, so it must be pretty good or something. Maybe check that out.


Most players are fine with investing the minimal effort it takes to make yourself not a target in this PvP sandbox. You don’t even have to be very clever, just ask around and people will tell you how. If that is to big of a challenge, then yes, EVE is probably not for you.


Why don’t you play more prudently then? Seriously, this is just silly. If you behave in a way that is risk-seeking why are you upset when that risk comes along and bites you in the ass?


Jesus f4cking Christ - Like I said, no thanks ill go play other games.

What the f4ck is it with you Eve-online dweebs?

Numbers are declining in the game and all you can say is “go play another game” err derrr I already am and thats the f4cking problem.

And here you are though, complaing about a game you don’t play. Can I have your stuff?