Because it’s too easy for someone to start up 10 accounts and have them krabbing in anomalies day in and day out as each account requires very little attention. Compound that with the entirety of nullsec, you end up in a situation where it’s too easy to farm ISK in the game, causing ripples through the ecosystem that CCP doesn’t want.
This just isn’t true and whilst I have no data as evidence to support this, I can guarantee null sec is not a cesspit of hordes of multiboxing farmers running sites 23.5/7. Why lye like this? a very small portion of players do this, not all of null sec.
Now imagine this in a 700DPS, and a specific damage-type tank Ishtar. It tanks 2000 Rat DPS with gist x-large shield boosters, and it can Also allign out and warp away at the speed mentioned above because it’s basically face tanking the rats, and melting any scram/web rats at an instant. This makes ratting havens even safer, now you Just have to sit in the site and face-tank everything, while allign out to your fortress at 10m/s. This makes losing a farm ship even harder.
You do realise these ships cost a fortune to setup and a roaming frigate can catch and kill one solo?
No attention play allows a player to run more than one operation/site simultaneously. this leads to a large influx of isk for a single player passively running a lot of sites putting them far ahead of a more attentive player who may only run one or two alts.
So? more ships in space = more potential targets to hunt and blap. This change impacts that gameplay too.
Give over with your nonsense. Nobody is saying they can’t rat anymore. Nobody.
To both 1 & 2:
Players against this change are pointing out the main argument you are posing for the change seems to be based on the impression that null sec is full of farmer fleets spending all their time ratting in 1 system. This just isn’t true and especially isn’t true with the new mechanics of ratting in null sec.
So why is this(Your comment about empty space) even relevent? You didnt bring it up to say that less people would rat with this change in place, then?
Actually players against this change are the only ones who consistently use null as an example.
The truer impression is that if theres a lower effort/attention method of generating isk anywhere in the game, then people will take advantage of it. This change is putting a brake on one of those, and I do not agree that this is a bad thing.
I was pointing out that most of null sec is empty with small pockets of space that allow for your dwarfed impression of null sec.
I use null sec as the example as that is where my game time is focussed. I rat and pvp and I pvp because I can rat and I pvp the ratters who are the ones not paying attention to their game.
Nowhere is anyone talking about how the new mechanics make pvping farmers even more interesting? I couldn’t care less if the human is at the computer glued to watching intel channels and local or if they aren’t, what matters to me is stuff in space to blow up and it just so happens a good portion of my hunting is focussed on area’s where I know afk ratters live.
edit: let’s be clear though, null sec is not a cesspit of afk ratters and this change also impacts missile boats too, just not as much as those that use drone boats to make their isk.
Why would an extremely minor change to Drone Control have any impact on that? Its not aimed at it. And infact, its not even effecting it at all. Unless you are back to “This change makes ratting too hard for some people, so they left”.
And what matters to us all is the rate of that stuff blowing up compared to the generation of isk. Thats the part thats simply being ignored by many commentators in favour of hyperbole and emotional reactions.
You keep saying that, a person may start to ask why.
There are three classifications I can lump players into. Active, afk, and bot.
It is nearly impossible to come up with an activity that can’t conceivably be done better by a bot, but added complexity generally skews the balance towards computers and away from humans. Our best games and the most challenging ones for computers to master over their human precursors are games like chess or go. I think I can safely rule out that this change targets bots, or that it will have much impact on them even if that was the intent.
That leaves me with two classes, those who are at attention, and those who are not. If I assume that an active player would be able to save their drones in at least some circumstances where a person doing nothing would not be able to, then players benefit from active play. Bot aspirant behavior would be more heavily penalized.
I do not have a lot of experience with null ratting. By which I guess I should say this is not a thing I ever did. I didn’t do incursions or any other kind of isk grinding, either, and I have a hard time understanding the appeal or mental state that motivates people to do it, thus I do not consider myself an authority on this subject. It is more than plausible my hasty suggestion has glaring flaws of one sort or another, but it was not meant to be presented as *the* solution, but as an example of something that could attempt to address the same problem without making eve more of a ‘i before e except after c or as in the a in neighbor or weigh’ kind of thing.
I have always been on the side of the ‘new player’, for whom these things are out of reach, anyway. People trying to wrap their heads around a complicated game made just a tiny bit more complicated with tweaks like this one. It’s not a lot on its own, but we’ve been slowly adding to the pile for quite a while.
I would rather avoid a lengthy debate, especially since I have no strong position I want to take or stake in the outcome. I just wanted to present a point of view for consideration without slandering one side or another. There are plenty of reasons why someone might reject it, and I’m OK with that. This would not be the first time you and I did not see eye to eye. It’s not super important to me to always be right on the internet or to convince people that I’m the ultimate authority on everything I speak of. We couldn’t have discussions if everyone left no room for doubt in their position.
Why would an extremely minor change to Drone Control have any impact on that? Its not aimed at it. And infact, its not even effecting it at all.
Go read about the new system and try to understand it and its impact on everyone who rats not just the drone boats.
UNless you are back to “This change makes ratting too hard for some people, so theyt left”.
There you go again putting words where these are not my words.
And what matters to us all is the rate of that stuff blowing up compared to the generation of isk. Thats the part thats simply being ignored by many commentators in favour of hyperbole and emotional reactions.
In 17 years of playing the game i’ve noticed that this little beauty comes up on a regular basis. The rate of stuff blowing up in relation to the generation of ISK and whilst you may deem drone boats as significant part of NPC ratting that is skewing the economy massively and is creating a terrible game play for everyone in Eve, it’s not. I’d like to point out loss aversion is the reason why players choose to take part in the game, if the decision to do something could result in needing to spend the next week doing something highly boring, most will choose to play it safe.
You keep saying that, a person may start to ask why.
Because that’s been many, and yours too, the hyperbolic state of the game.
So then what again is the relevence of empty space? You say Null is mostly empty as if thats some sort of supporting evidence to why lazy drone control is a good thing/attentive drone control is bad, but whats the connection there?
Given I have and clearly dont, from your perspective, maybe explaining it calmly would get your point across in an acceptable fashion? Im more likely to listen to it than a sneer, like what you done.
So your opposition to my point is based on an opinion you have assigned to me that I havent stated. However, it is my opinion that if CCP consider low attention ratting to be a problem, which they certainly seem to in their reasoning in the OP, this is a perfectly easy, quick, and simple siolution that is reverseable if all the crying krabs are somehow right.
The excuse thats become a mantra among opposition to this change is “the game is too boring, change that so people dont have to afk rat” simply ignores that changing a light bulb is a better litmus for an idea than rewiring the house.
Can you change this so its in english please?
edit: Nm, I get you. Eh, maybe but its not one Im bringing up as I dont think its relevent.
Rats with ECM are now partying. I play this game for free. I can’t really be salty on what CCP are doing. Why all the salt scattered here? because you don’t want to pay a little buck for CCP?
If this is the case why has large number of faction warfare alts not been looked at. I hear your points mike and a have to say im on your side of this. But to add to it if ccp really cared about
when why has the drones just been nerfed half blindly where is is more “no attention play” then ccp seams to know / want to try and fix
It’s alright. I really don’t think I am trying to say a whole lot. I think CCP could solve this problem without discriminating between PCs and NPCs, which is a practice that gives actual new players an inaccurate impression of their ship’s capabilities that they will then use as a basis for future decisions.
Perhaps it is because ‘new player’ is bandied about so casually it is applied to people who’ve got a year of tenure or more that I am not understood, or perhaps I am out of touch with the rest of the player base because I wasn’t interested in flying a ship that didn’t need me to be there. I was never very good at Eve, and I never reached any high level of play. I like things on a small scale and flying or fitting my ship the wrong way if it was interesting at the time.
I used to set aside my time to help new players who struggle to pick up the game. I do not like the approach of throwing them isk or ships and prefer to teach them how to solve their own problem, be it how to get isk to replace lost stuff or getting around a gate camp, so I am sensitive to some of their frustrations when picking up eve mechanics and I don’t think there are many people left who are, thus I feel compelled to act as their advocate. They can’t advocate for themselves without having enough experience they’re no longer new players in my eyes.
If this doesn’t make sense, no biggie. You’re not missing out on much.
im sorry but i think you have no clue what your talking about new players (meaning day 1 players) are not going to have the smallest clue what “Drones won’t auto-aggro against NPCs, but they will auto-aggro against Players.” means for them or there ship. Heck most the time new player have no clue what drones are.
I play this game for free. I can’t really be salty on what CCP are doing.