WH Recon, tips

PvE Gameplay Center PvE Ships & Modules
1

Greetings Pilots,

I am trying to re-enter Eden after a VERY long “break”, (actually a pretty sad rage-quit on my part, but we won’t talk about that right now) and so much has changed that I am feeling truly lost.

I have just learned some wonderful news though. I can fly both the Astero and the Stratios with Level 3 Mastery.

Having learned the 2 of the “Golden Rules of EvE”, to not fly what you can’t afford to lose, and to not fly just be cause you can, the hard way, I am grinding up some isk to head in a new direction.

I have watched lots of vids, read many posts, and learned an awful lot about Exploration. I am currently flying a Magnate, and am disappointed at the pitiful excuse for loot I am getting from relic/data sites in it. My next purchase will be one of the SOE ships. My question is, which one?

I would like to concentrate at first on scanning down and clearing relic/artifact sites in nullsec. I’ll probably also try to collect any loot/drones/whatever less cloaky and diligent pilots than myself left behind.

Ignoring Bling/Cost for the moment, is there another compelling reason to choose one or the other? I’m hoping to avoid conflict if possible, so I’m going for cloaky and nimble. I figure, I might as well run the frig for a while and see what happens, then step out in the cruiser when isk isn’t as tight for me.

I am including my current Maller fit below, as an example of what I can fit/afford atm.

Any thoughts?

o7

[Maller, Concil Burdingshire’s Maller]
Medium Armor Repairer II
Reactive Armor Hardener
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Damage Control II
Heat Sink II

10MN Monopropellant Enduring Afterburner
Data Analyzer I
Cap Recharger II

Heavy Beam Laser II
Heavy Beam Laser II
Heavy Beam Laser II
Heavy Beam Laser II
Heavy Beam Laser II

Medium Processor Overclocking Unit I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Multifrequency M x5
Radio M x5

2

I had an Astero in NullSec when I had less than 5mill SP. I found that Relic sites were the most profitable.

Also:
Due to my low SP at the time there were cosmic sigs I had difficulty scanning down in the 1st. place.
The Astero does not have much tank. If you fail a hack at a site like this Lesser Gurista Covert Research Facility or take too long (3 mins) to hack a can or two you will get blown up, wheras my Stratios just shrugs it off.

Finally:
I suggest you join a NullSec corp if you are going to go hacking in NullSec. In a lot of cases it is way safer than HiSec.

Edit: remove duplicate words

3

If you like to explore and want to move around a lot, stay with frigates.

The Astero is a fine ship and was made for that. If you can afford it, train cloaking to level 4 and take any of the covert ops frigates. Probing will be a breeze with those and you can warp and stay cloaked.

Those Covert Research Facilities are called ghost sites and you need a cruiser for those. For the moment just stay way from those and probe something more viable for you.

4

The issue with WHs and data/relic sites is the site availability is a bit hit and miss so while you can sometimes find a great WH with 10+ sites its pretty rare to do so. You end up spending most of your time looking for a good WH.

As a side note, what does that Maller do? Fit is a bit strange.

5

First thing to consider is that Relic/Data sites in K-space (high-sec, low-sec, 0.0-sec) are not the same as WH sites. In WH you can find so-called regular sites but often you find WH-specific Data/Relic sites. These sites have NPC which you need to kill first.

So what you looking for? Run undefended (regular) Data/Relic sites or WH-style sites? In Topic you are writing “WH…” while in post you state that you starting from null-sec.

Considering you start from null-sec sites you don’t need weapons. These sites are undefended and if you need weapons this usually means you are going to lose a ship (either hunter or gate camp you couldn’t evade). So stay with frigates. T2 electronic ships (eg. Helios from Gallente ships) are pretty nice if you careful and evade hunters. Astero is more combat oriented ship with weaker bonuses to scanning and hacking.

You really do not need bigger ships for that.

When you start looking for WH-specific sites you would need complete different approach with choosing ship and fitting. These sites are like combat sites from K-space. And (from my experience) it’s not even worth the time to hack in there. Just kill the NPC, collect their loot/salvage and move on.

Good luck

6

I mostly scan down a system or WH with a magnate, then come back with the maller fit with the scanner I need. Sometimes I can clear combat sites with it in sec 0.4 -1.0 space. I get nuked almost immediately by hunters if I go lower than that. For some reason lower sec is really hot where im living.

Also, I mixed my terminology up a bit in my post earlier. I referred to WH space as nullsec.

7

The covert ops frigs do have better scan bonuses than the Astero (once you get your covert ops skill up), but the hacking bonus is a flat +10 on both.

OP,

My two cents: go with the Astero. Not only do I run WH relic sites, but I also hunt the people that run them. I use a faction warp scram and a tech 2 warp scram. That gives me a total of -5 which prevents any ship with less than 5 stabs from wrapping away from me (none of the covert ops frigate, including the Astero, can fit 5 stabs). I swap out one of my scrams for a relic analyzer when I want to run some sites. I like being able to fight back, instead of being helpless.

8

If you want to Run combat sites there are better fits than the one you linked. Generally speaking buffer tank is only good for PVE if you have logi or are running very low level sites (in HS the lower levels sites do not fit cruisers) .

maybe something like this. (there are better ships/fits but this should be OK for someone with little experience with DED/HS Combat sites). Change the hardeners base on the race.

[Maller, HS DED]

Medium Armor Repairer II
Armor EM Hardener II
Armor Thermal Hardener II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

10MN Afterburner II
Large Compact Pb-Acid Cap Battery
Cap Recharger II

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Acolyte II x3

For C1 WH combat sites, maybe this.

[Maller, C1 WH]

Medium Armor Repairer II
IFFA Compact Damage Control
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

10MN Y-S8 Compact Afterburner
Large Cap Battery II
Fleeting Compact Stasis Webifier

Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M
Focused Medium Pulse Laser II, Imperial Navy Multifrequency M

Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I

Acolyte II x3

If you want to hack the sites then the magnet would be better for that anyway as it get bonuses for hacking and is really cheap so if you get caught then its a cheaper lose . (also harder to lose since its faster) . Once you have more skill go for a Covert ops or Astero but I would stay with the magnet until you get a bit of experience with how/when/where to run safely.

9

Thank you for your feedback.

Ill try your fits. I already have all of the fittngs, as well as 2 fit magnates (just in case).

I bought an astero and have been ratting in it in 0.5 space. Just to get a feel for it. I cant afford to lose it yet, so ill play it safe for now.

Just over 2 days and ill have cloak to 4. I won’t stray far from home until I have specops cloak. For now, ill try to hone the mechanics. I have a mentor now that is willing to cover my back. Nullsec, here I come.

o7

10

Quick question. Why pulse? I see better dps with beams, but there are threads here that seem to indicate a better hit % is more important.

Thanks again.

o7

11

For C1s the range is less of an issue and there are so many frigs you want the extra tracking. For the DED fit, Focused beams would be good if not better but you need to try and keep range in 3/10 specifically so you can track frigs.

12

wormhole explorers dont use a cruiser, the either use a cheap fitted exploration frigate like your magnate or use the Astero if they know the drill in order to not get removed easily.

basically. you dont use a cruiser for anything like that unless you want to do the Sleeper exploration sites which contain NPCs and usually earn more from the loot and salvage rather than what is found in the hackable containers.

before leaving the thread im gonna put this suggestion:

dont rush on the astero or a cruiser yet, you can do a good a mount of C1 sites with a Meta4-T2 fitted T1 frigate (non faction or anything). the only requirements is that you have enough skills to have an stable tank with prop mod and repair module running permanently during the combat session while sigtanking the rats (no MWD, using Afterburner).

that and carrying everything you need for the adventure like Mobile depot, hull repairer, salvager, relic analyzer, data analyzer, probe launcher and two sets of probes and all the ammunition you need (since you’re Amarr you will only have to carry whatever amount of T1 crystals you need).

you dont have to carry everything fitted on, just swap for the job once you finish killing the rats. it doesnt take too much. the total cost of that is less than what you would spend on that Maller.

13

I run nothing but astero but never combat fit. It is fit purely for maximum relic site efficiency. Ez 200+ mil a night most nights.

14

Thank you for your replies.

I am currently practicing low-null sec runs in my Magnate, fit to split, not to fight. When I feel like I have the hang of it, I’ll start running the Astero out there.

I’m going to have to get going too. My mining barge just got CODEed. Jerk popped me before I saw his message in local. I guess that is supposed to be my fault now, judging by the snippy little email I got shortly thereafter. I know this last rant snippet is probably off topic. Please forgive me. I’m pissed.

I’ll get over it.

o7
Concil

15

Thank you Villiam. I will heed your advice.

Can you define the term sigtanking for me please.

o7

16

I’ve made around 1 billion a month hacking pirate sites in wormhole as an alpha clone.

I didn’t use any fancy ships, just an Heron fitted for maximum Scanning strength (so basically Small Gravity capacitor upgrades I for rigs and 2 Scan Rangefinding arrays).

If you can fight off the burnout for potentially scanning tens of sites and find nothing, it’s very low risk and very high reward.

While my virus is extremely weak, I’ve found that with a bit of experience and a staunch faith in Bob I was capable of hacking almost everything anyway. Sure, I’ve lost some Ruins once in a while, but I should have got a good 80%-90% of them. And I’ve barely met anyone else in wormholes.

In other words, what decided my earnings wasn’t really my virus or my ship’s firepower to kill off the competition, but good ol’ RNGesus.

Which brings me to my doubt: is it really worth it to fly an Astero? It doesn’t seem to me like it would net you much more money, and it ruins the best defense you have with a t1 frigate: that it’s so incredibly cheap!

Maybe in Nullsec the cloak would be more useful with more people around wanting you dead, but at the same time I’m not sure nullsec is better: everyone is already looking for relic sites in Sansha and Guristas space. You will have a TON of competition. So much you might have a better chance of finding Sansha relics in wormholes.

I tried to go sniff around in Stain once (where you can find the coveted Sansha relics and the even more coveted intact armor plates), and I found a lot of data sites, but no relics. D-Scan told me there were two other explorers looking for the same thing I was. Which means that a lot of explorers in New Eden had the same idea at the same time.

17

of course.

Sig Tank is an abreviation of “Signature Tanking”. it basically means that your ship dodges enemy damage based on its Signature Radius.

Signature Radius is a value which is used in damage calculations inside the game (among other things like Combat Scanning and so on). it represents the ship as a sphere, the bigger the ship, the bigger the sphere. some weapons are better at hitting targets on certain Sig Radii.

the combination of low Signature Radius and High Speed orbiting makes frigates very adept at tanking Sleeper Drones because not only they can outspeed the tracking of the weapons but also have such a small radius that they only get hit everynow and then.

this doesnt means the ship wont get hit, just means that you can dodge most of the damage that a cruiser would be absorbing in the same situation. and this can be compensated to manageable levels by just having permanent local reps.

in some cases there’s sites where you get neuted but a Cap Battery mod can mitigate them to a level where you can just pulsate the repper everynow and then to save on capacitor.

that’s more or less the gimmick of C1 farming in Frigates. you can only do that with those, Destroyers are slower and have bigger sig apart of having low tanking potential so i dont recommend them. a Cruiser can frontline the rats but only a frigate can play the dodging.

if you have someone that can deal with the Battleship Spawns you could even do C2 sites too. the Battleships are the hard counter of this strat because they can 1 shot you with a single missile volley. they have to get distracted by another ship.

18

Thank you all. This has been extremely helpful. Big thanks for the explanation of sigtanking too. I see that term all over and had no idea what it meant. I guess i figured it out though by trial and error. I just looted over 60 mil in 0.4 space zapping a BS that way. I found an orbit where he couldn’t hit me, but I eventually got through his tank. This was in amarr space though, ratting in a punisher. I think Ill stick to that for a while.

Thank you again all.

o7

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