What is the BD about?

Not trying to open a can of worms, restart old arguments, etc.

I just want a description/explanation of what the “Blue Doughnut” thing is all about?

I hear it mentioned all over the game.

when large groups control adjacent space whether by alliance or coalition it is commonly referred to as a blue donut.
btw. pandemic legion provided blue donuts on a table at on of the las vegas fan events. pretty amusing

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Okay, so good and excellent standings are color coded blue. So, when groups set good standings towards each other, people will often say things like, “x is set to blue” or “x is blue to us”.

Anyway, the blue donut started as a critique of null groups propensity to blue their neighbors. Now, blue neighbors does reduce threats to sov and make krabbing a lot safer, but it also reduces the ability to find fights without having to travel long distances.

Now, the blue donut initially started as a criticism leveled at the null blocs by members who were unhappy with the practice, as well as by other groups who made it point to blue as few people as possible (and for as short a time as possible).

More recently, however, the MIttani co-opted the blue donut in order to crticize PAPI. The crux of the argument was that PAPI was bad because of how many groups had blued each other.

However, his argument failed to account for things such as:

  • The imperium was the largest bloc in the game up until that point, and therefore was creating it’s own ■■■■■■■■■■■ of blues. In other words, it’s a pot calling the kettle black argument.
  • The imperium had a non-invasion pact with test before hand. Thus, test deciding to go to war was creating content, not reducing it.
  • This was the largest war in Eve’s history. So saying that it was bad because it reduced content/fighting is a bad faith argument at best, and downright stupidity at worst. Of course, I’m putting my money on the former.
  • It was also at odds when the Mitanni’s insistence that PAPI would tear itself apart. I mean, which is it -is PAPI going to create a blue donut of peace, or are they going to tear themselves apart due to infighting?

So, in a nutshell, his argument was that TEST and the rest of PAPI forces were bad for the game because they reduced content by creating the biggest war in Eve’s history, and that if they win it would reduce content because everyone would be blue, but also PAPI would tear itself apart due to internal divisions and leadership incompetence…

Yeah, turns out propaganda doesn’t need to make much sense in order for people to believe it. Honestly, I wouldn’t have thought to make such logically inconsistent arguments. I would have figured that people would have seen right through it, and that my enemies’ propaganda departments would have ripped it apart. Fortunately for the imperium, PAPI really dropped the ball in the propaganda department. Don’t get me wrong, they had some wins (i.e. brave little toaster, test is next…door, and the doomclock), but on the whole, I think they lost on the propaganda front. And, while it is debatable over how much influence this had on the course of the war, it most certainly played a major role.

I mean, there’s a reason why the MItanni spends so much of his time personally producing a propaganda podcast. Well… he also probably enjoys it, but I have no doubt that he believes it to be a powerful tool that is of great benefit to his organization and goals. And, call me crazy, but I think he might be on to something here.

Anyway, a lot of of the blue donut talk as of late has been framed by goon propaganda. So, you might want to take it with a grain of salt.


@Shipwreck_Jones Thank you. That’s the best explanation I’ve yet heard.

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@Shipwreck_Jones One more question:

Why did PAPI/TEST and the Imperium/Goons go to war? Just to make content?

I don’t remember who said what, and it doesn’t really matter any way, because stated reasons may or may not accurately reflect their actual motivations. Regardless, creating content for members was likely one contributing factor. Other factors may have included things like grudges, a desire to weaken a significant threat, belief that one’s group might benefit from the conflict in some way (i.e. new space, buying structures for cheap), being apart of Eve History, and backroom dealings.

Oh, and do note that PAPI was not a monolith. So, motivations can vary between groups, and even between leadership within groups.

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