Abyssal PVP

I happy to lose… I really am. I’ve had good fights and lost them and been happy. I just hate stalemates. I’ve had good fights and won and let people keep pods like i said. Stalemates just don’t feel right when CCP themselves said ‘‘two enter but only one leaves’’. It’s a lie.

[edit] and who is the onyx thing aimed at?..

Bigger ships, bigger loot, bigger “Risk Free” impact on the economy.

No Way!

I would like to point out that Abyss, starting a little bit at T3, then going up significantly into T4, and then rising even more in T5s, is not a risk free activity. There is a steady ship loss according to CCP @ last Vegas at around 10% and they did say they want to keep it around this figure, and according to zkill it is ongoing. Plenty of ships are lost every day.

This ship loss is far bigger then otehr sources of safe ISK in the game. Take for example Cap and Super ratting in NS which has a combined ship loss (PvP and PvE) of just 2-3%, then add cap/super insurance on top of that, then take into account that fully functional ratting carrier is 1.3 Bil vs the costs of Abyss ships and pods.

So having “open” ratting areas does not equal risk and ship loss at all. Risk does not have to come from PvP, it can come from other sources. Although that does encroach on the “spirit” of the game. But the game does have to evolve for better or worse. Stagnation = death.

That’s not risk, that is people who didn’t watch the video, or I suppose in a few cases not as smart as the AI.

Otherwise it is just AI, and we’re not talking Watson here :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

Nope. Its being human. Even when you watch videos, know all your spawns, all your methods, approaches etc. and have executed them to perfection many times, sooner or later you will slip up. And that slip up will freak you out guaranteed, sometimes resulting in a kill either directly or by mising the timer. Another words ■■■■ happens.

FYI, the ships I lost in Abyss, are exactly and precisely due to overconfidence, because I know what to do and do it so many times that I get sloppy.

That’s not PvP or PvE that is You v You :smile:

Yes. But am just sayin, there are a lot of "You vs You"s and they factor into the ship loss in total.

I was recently in a fight at a small FW plex, I shot the hell out of that one NPC before I realized I was on the wrong target. Mistakes don’t tell us anything design wise unless many people make the same mistake over and over.

Stalemates serve quite important purpose: they keep owners of blingy ships in check. Chance of dying due to some kind of dice roll prevents people from spending 3x…10x on their ship to win more reliably. The chance is provided by facing hard counter (such as talisman’d curse for a vedmak) or dying in a stalemate.

Increasing resist debuff will allow those who have blingier ships win more often (and thus encourages people to bling even more, raising the bar even higher). So, when deciding on resist penalties (when they should kick in and how strong they should be), you should ask yourself a question: how expensive do you want abyss pvp to be.

I disagree w/ your conclusion

there are quite a few cheap-ish fits/ideas right now which would strongly benefit from being able to actually kill the opponent.

Most prominent example: Orthrus w/ tracking disruption

Also imagine for example a cheap guidance disruptor Curse being a niche counter to rlml setups

blinging damage mods just to maybe hit the required dps threshold not being a requirement to compete would greatly benefit the meta in my opinion.

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These are not mutually exclusive. Yes, reducing tank allows ships with lower dps to win, up to an extent of a quad-damp rail lachesis to be major part of the meta (when ships end up polarized). I admit, some of them might be hard-counters to expensive brawling ships, so you might be right :stuck_out_tongue:

To be fair weather rotation every few weeks would be more interesting. Which would include combinations of various buffs/debuffs, including resist debuff.

Totally agree. More debuffs wouldn’t make it more expensive. It would actually make it cheaper as people could fly counter fits, kiting would actually be viable which would force the brawlers to fit a MWD and a scram.

Its expensive right now because to break the tanky fits you need max DPS fits. Cerbs can tank a max damage vedmak even after debuff. Which is retarded.

also taking a look at hac cap recharge rates would make sense, then you could counter them with talisman curse(or even talisman gilas)

There should be no “Abyssal PVP” at all…not on the exit and not in a “special chamber”

Holy f’ing ■■■■ this was sold as PVE content… but due to the whining of PVP first the entrance was made scannable and then this chamber crap…

THIS is the rreason why it sucks…the level of PVE betrayal in this…

PVP should have NO BUISNESS with it but csm(aka goons) wanted it otherwise and so they got it

THIS is the problem of this game…

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Yet for some reason people asking for more debuffs are the ones using expensive (2-3b+) fits.

The PVP part is optional. You can just leave in 3rd room. And btw most other online games have similar pvp content.

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At the moment pretty much all popular setups are about tank/gank and little else.

When theorycrafting a fit you first make sure you at least dont fall over until much later in the match (instantly making your fit/pod 1.5b+ if you want to be somewhat competitive, which is really bad) then you try to squeeze out as much dps as you can while pretty much neglecting mobility/tackle.

I claim to have pioneered the no-prop rlml cancer-Cerb which happens to be best for this. Its also not very engaging.

Now, imagine a debuff system where no fit could tank 500 dps in (for example) the last 5 minutes.

Setups with comparatively weak tank/gank but some other gimmick requiring actual active play (strong range control, ewar, sigtank, mix of dps and neuts) would suddenly be more viable.

IMO it’d be a much more interesting meta.

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Totally agree. With a proper debuff many other play styles become viable and brawler fits are forced to bring a scram and/or web and a prop. The cerb (which you did invent) is just a siege engine, it sits there and hopes to kill the opponent first. This is where having to real way to win some matches has brought us, to the max tank and gank meta. Debuffs would improve the meta.

And get forced into pvp at the exit…how is this better?

No pvp intervention into pve content…

Hmmm…

Can I have your stuff when you leave? :rofl:

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