It implicitly is, because that’s the obvious (and superior) alternative to the OP’s proposal for solving the problem.
Even if it was, where else would you see pirate class frigates being used to the bleeding edge of their potential?
Anywhere that isn’t a class-restricted PvP site?
But by your reason, not even navy class could be considered t1, and the FACTIONS not being able to use their own line of ships is a pretty ridiculous conclusion.
IT ISN’T FAIR THAT I CAN’T TAKE MY FACTION CRUISER INTO A T1 FRIGATE PLEX.
There’s nothing ridiculous about it if you accept the concept of class restrictions on FW sites. Navy frigates are obviously a superior class and should not be in a “T1 frigates only” site just like T2 frigates shouldn’t be there.
Lmao. Did I call it or not? This is Faction Warfare. If you want a beginner complex site, have CCP make one in the newb area for corvettes and let people slap fight there, where it won’t interfere with FW and people can enjoy practicing trash meta pvp with even civilian modules until their little hearts burst from squealing.
T1 cruisers in frigate plexes?! Have you lost your mind, friend? You’re grasping at straws. Because navy frigates pimped out to the same level are just as superior to t1 than what is currently being seen. Now, why would I ever use a pirate or navy frig instead of a Assault frigate in FW if you get your wish?
You can’t phase out an entire line of ships because you refuse to adapt your interactions with them. They are far from invincible.
Heck. Gate camps kill more newbs than pirate frigs ever will and once they take that gate, there’s zero chance for them to fight back, and little chance for them to escape.
Make friends. Fly smarter. Dscan. Lay traps. Use t1 ewar. All strong and cheap options.
Which may be why its just more straightforward to disallow the hulls.
That’s exactly what they were for…That’s why T2 frigs aren’t allowed access to novice sites.
The whole point of the faction warfare sites is to create a tier like system where players encounter eachother in ships of similar power. And novice is the lowest tier/entry level site.
Facepalm*
They did. And called them novice.
Novice:
A person new to and inexperienced in a job or situation.
CCP has confirmed that the name change from minor and majors to the current novice, small, etc. was never meant to imply that it was only for new or inexperienced pilots. Unfortunately, it continues to mislead many people.
Take a moment to read that over again, slowly. Then ask yourself what exactly you are arguing for.
This is irrelevant to the discussion and an attempt on your part to strawman. Am I an idiot to fight a pirate frig solo while in a t1 hull? In many cases, in fact, I HAVE done so and have chased the pirate frig away. The same can be said for seeing 5 ships on short scan and taking the decision for fight or flight, also being by myself.
In all pvp interactions, you weigh your chances. You use your brains. You don’t just, ‘Rock, Paper, Scissors’ everything. Or you do, and end up making a terrible argument and awful defense of your weak point of view.
That novice sites be for t1 frigates. So that novice sites aren’t dominated by faction frigs.
Are you saying only noobs fly t1 frigates?
Think about it…slowly.
It’s not. The validity of your position depends on you actually having experience of being on the receiving end.
But you don’t. You don’t fight faction frigs in novices. You blob or you ARE the faction frig.
Which is why you are trying so hard to keep your ability to stomp tech 1 frigs in novices. Too hard for you to take on targets in smalls it seems.
You’ve kinda gone off the rails here.
Rock paper scissors suggests an equal chance of winning, this was the whole purpose of tiering fw sites. To get ships of similar power facing off eachother…and yet:
So the situation we have now is expressly not rock, paper, scissors…i.e. not well balanced
You are under the false presumption that every ship by itself should be able to put up a fighting chance against a different ship, also by itself. If plexes were designed to be 1v1 arenas, then CCP screwed the pooch, because it should have been introduced as instanced content, and not a publicly accessible arena where anything of a certain kind can show up.
I’m on the side of Motorbit when it comes down to the pirate hulls being great, but not oppressively so without buff of multiple attribute enhancing items. …But that’s a slippery slope, because how do you screen for that? How do you prep for warfare fights outside, but also inside plexes? You would really be sticking a wedge in the flow of battle in the warzone with any change like that. As for your own excuses: “You either don’t solo and don’t know the problem, or you blob.” LOL You’re a doll and I really can’t take you seriously with that dribble. What’s blobbing? What’s small gang? If the guy has a fighting chance, is it still blobbing?
You are never going to see just how many times a pirate frig has run away from me while in T1 hulls. How many times one refused to take a fight or slide in.
Like I said. It could be done. Paper rock scissors is not the funnest way to balance anything. As things are, there are a bunch of things someone can ask for in place of bans to reduce the effect of secondary items and consumables.
No, I’m just mocking your terrible argument that it’s a problem for navy frigates to be banned from T1 frigate sites because it’s “the faction’s own line of ships”. Navy cruisers belong to the FW factions and yet they still aren’t considered T1 frigates and granted access to T1 frigate sites.
Because navy frigates pimped out to the same level are just as superior to t1 than what is currently being seen.
Which is why navy frigates should also be banned.
Now, why would I ever use a pirate or navy frig instead of a Assault frigate in FW if you get your wish?
And now we see the heart of the problem: you’re fine with T1 frigates being useless because pirate frigates are vastly superior, but you’re not ok with pirate frigates being useless because AFs are superior. It’s not about game balance and the health of the game as a whole, it’s about protecting your personal favorite ship and your ability to win fights with it.
You can’t phase out an entire line of ships because you refuse to adapt your interactions with them. They are far from invincible.
Hyperbolic much? Keeping a class of ships that is vastly superior to T1 frigates out of “T1 frigates only” PvP sites is not phasing out an entire line of ships. You’re still free to use your pirate frigates anywhere else in EVE.
And, again, it’s not that people can’t adapt to pirate frigates. It’s that the best adaptation is to fly a pirate frigate yourself, and the only reason to fly anything else in a “T1 frigates only” site is if you’re too poor to afford a real ship. The existence of pirate frigates in those sites skews the meta to an unhealthy level and the simplest solution is to acknowledge that they are not T1 frigates and do not belong in class-restricted sites that only permit T1 frigates.
You don’t see how this creates a problem for an entire line of ships? Really? How you remove pirate class from novices and suddenly an entire line of ships is phased out, just like i said.
I thought you were a skilled player? Is the truth that you can only win when you’re able to bring your pirate frigate into a PvP site where only the weakest ships are allowed past the gate? Shouldn’t you be able to win outside of “T1 frigate only” sites if you’re that good?
Actually, I’d preserve them because I enjoy my fights with them. I fly t1 a lot when I’m not in a scheduled fleet. I prove that you can take them on in cheap ships, and you still naysay? Their ships are worth easily 5x more than all the ships combined brought to take them on. Have I done it with less people. Yes. Have I chased them out solo? Yes.
You really don’t understand that if you remove them from novices, you change the face of the ecosystem and PHASE out an entire line of ships that are GREAT to see in the warzone. Just because you can’t make friends or figure out how to counter them, … what can i say to that? “superior” numbers is meaningless. Make a valid argument. Isk wise I come out on top when fighting pirate ships. Always.
Stop lying. Pirate frigates are not removed from the game just because we acknowledge that they are vastly more powerful than T1 frigates and do not belong in “T1 frigate only” PvP sites. You can still use them everywhere else in EVE, including in other FW sites.
Just because you can’t make friends or figure out how to counter them, … what can i say to that?
So apparently you didn’t bother to read anything I said. “Figure out a counter” is not an answer when the best and obvious counter is to fly a pirate frigate yourself unless you are too poor to afford one. That’s a texbook example of an unhealthy metagame, and both the problem and solution are obvious.
“superior” numbers is meaningless.
JFC you’re clueless about EVE PvP. Looks like you’re yet another person with very limited skill but a lot of ISK to throw at high-end ships to fly.
Maybe you are the one that doesn’t quite understand metagame. You. ARE. NOT. GOING. to see pirate frigs in the warzone with this change. They will be rare by comparison and will get wiped by AF’s, in the same way AF’s got wiped off the scene by t3d’s before they got rebalanced.
Maybe you are too blind to see that I was NOT flying pirate frigates in the killmails I posted. Take a look in the mirror buddy.
This is the whole idea of creating the tiers in faction warfare.
Again. No one said that. Is this the only way you can argue? By pretending other people are saying things they aren’t and that way you don’t seem as wrong?
No i was saying ‘you’ literally you @Oreb_Wing. Don’t play in tech 1 frigs unless you have an overwhelming gang. You also don’t seem to fight off faction frigs with a tech 1 frig or even seek to fight other tech 1 frigs in another tech 1 frig.
Yet here you are saying ‘git gud’.
You don’t seem to realise the kills you’ve linked demonstrate my point. Every kill you link of a faction ship could be done if the faction ship was in the small, med or large. No one is stopping multiple tech 1 frigs from killing solo pirate frigs.
What we’re doing is stopping pirate frigs from stomping tech 1 frigs. Or at least providing space for tech 1 frigates to have a niche.
But you don’t want that, because you know you won’t be able to pad your kill board as easily.
I could care less and nothing for killboards. I would never have run a training corp for a while if I did.
As for the rest. You really think these fights are going to occur in the medium or Small? You’re delusional. The t1 frig is not going to get guys together and attempt the fight with the pirate ship. They are just going to stay put and finish their plex and then leave for another novice.