An Easy Choice

Communications Center General Discussion
45

No.

You’re another customer cloaking up for a break.
This is healthy for your long-term EvE career.

Eventually, though, while checking out some other game or watching a movie or show, something will trigger an itch that will only be scratched once you’ve come back to New Eden. Maybe it’ll be a crafting system that just isn’t as dynamic as EvE’s. Maybe it’ll be a sci-fi show that makes you go, ‘I remember when’. Maybe it’ll be a team-mate or ally in some other game that just really needs to be SHOT IN THE FACE, but the game mechanics won’t let you.

Whatever the trigger, you’ll be back - otherwise you WOULD be dumping your stuff.

–Gadget says hold on to it - you’ll need it again

3 Likes
46

While I’m personally fine with the PvP everywhere thing, I do want to point out that the game is not marketed as being an exclusively PvP game (unless you want to use the looser definition of “everything you do in EvE is PvP,” which is fair, I suppose). The average new player isn’t watching videos of CCP talks before they decide to play. Here’s the synopsis from eveonline.com:

"EVE Online is a community-driven spaceship MMO where players can play free, choosing their own path from countless options.

Experience space exploration, immense PvP and PvE battles and a thriving player economy in an ever-expanding sandbox.

Participate in many in-game professions and activities, including war, politics, piracy, trading, and exploration, across 7,000 star systems with hundreds of thousands of other players."

Let’s ignore the “hundreds of thousands of other players” (lol). Now, if I were a new player, that would indicate to me that if I didn’t want to actively engage in PvP combat, I wouldn’t have to. I do believe this disconnect causes some players to leave, whether or not that means they’re leaving specifically because of a PvP combat encounter (or PvE combat, for that matter).

As a total aside, I do find it consistently interesting that people take the time to get on the forums to announce that they’re leaving for some reason or another. Never truly sure what the endgame is.

2 Likes
47

Technically a pilot can try to live the hermit life in New Eden.

I mean someone recently just daytripped to every known-space system without a single combat loss.

So going completely solo and entirely self-sufficient is possible - but it’s not going to be easy.
That pilot will likely spend more time and energy avoiding people than if they just dealt with them.

–Gadget might have just crafted a new Alpha experiment…

48

whine

2 Likes
49

It’s not his job to prove it, those who oppose his statement bear the burden of proof to refute his statement.

You know brother, everybody keeps saying that yet CCP keeps adding more and more PvE content. In fact this game has gotten so full of PvE content that it’s now being played without real players
:smirk:

@Harabec_Ojutai You’re completely right and I agree 100%

https://www.eveonline.com/ The main thing I noticed about that page (other than not saying Eve is strictly PvP) is that there’s no mention whatsoever about the Official Eve Online Forums.

Course I can see why considering the amount of toxicity here.

:wink:

1 Like
50

It seems like a lot of people want a solo eve experience, the whole point of EVE is that someone can come ruin your day if they want. That’s what makes it so interesting, without it EVE is a very boring game.

51

EVE has lots of problems, high sec being too unsafe isn’t one of them. Thank God CCP knows this, as they have repeatedly stated that at more than one Fan Fest, ganks are not a large factor as to why people quit the game.

There used to be intelligent conversations happening on these forums, now it’s a wasteland and for the most part the only players left are those that have uninformed, daft opinions.

2 Likes
52

If he says it’s a fact that pvp is killing the game, it is his burden to support that. Not the burden of others to refute it.

They aren’t mutually exclusive. On the contrary pve feeds pvp which feeds pve and so on and so on.

But yourself and @Harabec_Ojutai seem to have forgotten the EVE FAQ:

The essential core concept of EVE Online is that it is full time PvP in a sandbox
environment.

1 Like
53

On a cloudy day when the sky looks grey, I can still say that the sky is blue. If you disagree and refute what I say, then it’s on you to prove it.

re·fute

/rəˈfyo͞ot/

verb

verb: refute ; 3rd person present: refutes ; past tense: refuted ; past participle: refuted ; gerund or present participle: refuting

  1. prove (a statement or theory) to be wrong or false; disprove.

“these claims have not been convincingly refuted”

synonyms: disprove, prove wrong/false, show/prove to be wrong/false, rebut, confute, give the lie to, demolish, explode, debunk, drive a coach and horses through, discredit, invalidate; More

informal shoot full of holes, shoot down (in flames), blow sky-high;

rare controvert, negative

“attempts to refute Einstein’s theory of relativity”

  • prove that (someone) is wrong.

  • deny or contradict (a statement or accusation).

“a spokesman totally refuted the allegation of bias”
synonyms: deny, reject, repudiate, rebut, declare to be untrue;

Sure, PvE feeds PvP but that’s as far as it goes, PvP doesn’t feed PvE. Also you left out the last part of my statement in that quote:

Please link where I said the core concept of Eve is not PvP. Also can you link that statement to an Official CCP site?

Course the funny thing about concepts is that the finished product can be completely different from it’s initial core concept. You do know what concept means, right?

con·cept

/ˈkänˌsept/

noun

noun: concept ; plural noun: concepts

  1. an abstract idea; a general notion.

“structuralism is a difficult concept”

synonyms: idea, notion, conception, abstraction, conceptualization; More

theory, hypothesis, postulation;

belief, conviction, opinion, view, image, impression, picture

“the concept of society as an organic entity”

  • a plan or intention; a conception.

“the center has kept firmly to its original concept”

  • an idea or invention to help sell or publicize a commodity.

"a new concept in corporate hospitality"emphasized text

1 Like
54

In this case you’re right, the sky is generally perceived and accepted to be blue because of Rayleigh scattering, challenging such a statement would be going against the status quo

However, if one makes claims like Duro, that are controversial or challenge the commonly accepted status quo, the burden of proof is indeed on the person making the claims.

4 Likes
55

Yes it does.

Claiming a little bit of space for yourself, putting down an athanor or capturing systems in fw, so you can rat, mine or otherwise gain wealth is pvp to feed pve.

You can do a Google search right?

It’s initial core concept?

Does the FAQ say ‘was’ or ‘is’? Have ccp said the FAQ is out of date? Have they said they’ve changed the concept of eve? Do we have any reason, other than because you want it to, to believe the essential core concept has changed?

56

your doing it wrong only 100m a day in high sec, i can make up to 1b in about 8 hours in high sec if i choose

1 Like
57

Nope, all that does is secure a way to continue funding PvP.

Yeah, I can do a google search.

Ahhh, my mistake. I should have wrote ‘essential’ instead of ‘initial’.

Anyway, you’re just going off again implying something totally different than what I actually said.

58

Being deliberately obtuse?

Did i not just say pve feeds pvp feeds pve feeds pvp and so on and so on.

When null blocks claim and defend space for their rorqual pilots what do you think is happening?

They are expanding into territory so miners have rocks. So they can make more titans which will be used to expand further so they can mine even more, make even more and expand even more…and so on and so on.

59

PvE content is created automatically in-game by the server, it’s not created from PvP content.

This game will always have PvE content available whereas PvP content may not always be available.

Anyway, done with this convo, fly safe.

60

I agree, the person making an assertion bears the burden of proof. The problem is, when it comes to EvE, we only have access to so much data. Some things are thus difficult to prove with hard data, and can only be supported anecdotally. It doesn’t mean an assertion can’t be made, it just means that each person has to judge for themselves whether or not the believe the assertion to be true.

And you’re right, that FAQ totally says that. But I didn’t forget the EVE FAQ. I had no way to even know it existed. If you’re new and you go to the EvE site to download the game, there is NO indication that such an FAQ exists (as far as I saw, please feel free to correct me if I’m wrong). The FAQ is from 2014 and doesn’t appear to be directly linked anywhere. You have to either do a Google search for it, or search through the Articles section on the EvE site. So you have to already be looking for it to find it.

Furthermore, the line you quoted is five sections deep into the FAQ. You’d think if CCP REALLY wanted to push that notion that it would be in the beginning, like in the “What is EvE” section.

Which is my point. I never said that EvE isn’t a PvP game, but that it’s not explicitly marketed as such. What new players see appears to indicate that they’re going to have tons of options. Then they get into the game and see that a big chunk of gameplay is “slightly different combat.” And I wonder if that’s a bigger cause of player loss than anything else, or at least a significant one. Players are enticed to try the game, but don’t feel like they get what they expected.

In any case, this is simply a theory. I appreciate the dialogue.

61

like watching paint dry.

i’m not anti PVE, i think ya know this, PVE and PVP both have a place in EVE, i’ve no time for the PVE only attitude, or calls for making high sec non PVP. i couldn’t care less what the NPC’s are doing to eachother, it looks pretty yes, does it matter? nope.

1 Like
62

The ‘wink’ icon meant I wasn’t being overly serious.

However my statement still holds some truth. This game is getting to the point that it will still be active even without any real life players in it.

64

i got that

what would the point of that be? nothing but a pretty simulation, and who would want to watch or care about that.

it does hold truth, CCP have been running simulations of players for years, but only as a tool. nobody cares about that simulation but the devs.
it’s the real people and the stories they create within the EVE universe that makes it all worth while.
EVE will never be or was intended to be a single player experience.

as for the op and these i’m leaving threads, funny how they always complain, never a hey everyone, been here for a few years, had an absolute blast playing EVE, met lots of people, had some crazy times, saw so much funny stuff, had so much heart ache when a corp mate passed away, this has been a trip and a half, but my time is up and i’m gonna move on to another game, cya around, goodbye. type of thread, nope, always the whine whine whine CCP took me stuff, i’m out and i hate you all type of thread.

the first time " This is the first time Ember Arbosa has posted — let’s welcome them to our community! "
this guy even speaks on the forums and it’s a feck you i’m out thread. nice :crazy_face:

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65

That’s not how burden of proof works.

1 Like