These tears are sweet sweet nectar.
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Maybe i’m looking at the game wrong when it comes to carebears and ganking then. So let’s look at it from another angle using WoW and runescape as an example. Both those games have developed beyond the core game and their launch, so much so that it requires significant effort to bring back a “classic” version of the same game. EvE can’t really do the same because it is the same exact game since it was launched, just with extra ships and skins. At the end of the day, people are playing a 14 year old game that looks and feels and plays the exact same way as 14 years ago and the old, experienced players keep begging CCP to keep it all the same.
Forget about any theory which states reasons people would be angry about this or that. People don’t leave the game over anger, not on a large scale anyway. People leave the game because the game is not fun anymore. If people who were in it for the fun are leaving the game, more people will follow, as the aforementioned usually provide content or form friendships in the game.
So why could people find it not fun anymore?
I admit that I can only guess, but my suspicion is that EVE feels far too stale for them and they lost the hope for CCP to steer the game back into exciting waters, rather than continue into shallow ones. EVE used to have a name as a form of violent space chess, but can it really live up to that currently?
If a game feels less risky and equally or more stale than the average middle-class real life of people, it just doesn’t have anything to offer.
The underlying issue in my opinion is the continous character of the game itself vs. the challenge to keep things from becoming stale through order. EVE - in my observation - has become too orderly. Most recent changes to game mechanics are putting “challenges” that are solely min-maxable, blobable or grindable. Where EVE needs to constantly reinvent itself to create chaos, the opposite has been done.
OP, you state that so many changes have been made recently and that’s true. Which of them are challenging and exciting enough to provide the environment for players wanting to compete? The weird moon mining changes for instance: something that created massive wealth for a relatively small number of players for years and years was changed into something that will create - at best (and I doubt that) - far less than massive wealth for more players, but only as long as they are aligned with some powerhorse to protect them. Is that a change that fosters emerging gameplay and more chaos or doesn’t it really just exchange something that was maybe a bit broken with something that is much more boring?
EVE needs war, EVE needs conflict, EVE needs chaos. CCP has the really difficult task to come up with solutions of how to make the game difficult for everyone again, new and old players alike, powerful and not so powerful. If EVE stops being an interesting challenge, either because you or your opponent are too safe within the balanced imbalance, you stop to find content, it starts to feel stale, people start to leave and the downward cycle begins.
So basically your question should be: why didn’t many more people leave the game and the answer is: the community.
If not for the community EVE would have died a long time ago. The community really is the reliable part of this relationship, but just like in every weird relationship, the reliable part will at some point give up, realizing that their counterpart isn’t willing to put as much heart into it. I want to believe that this actually isn’t true though - that many gals and guys at CCP actually put their lifeblood into the game. To them I can only say: check your sources of information. EVE needs to reinvent itself and using leaders of accomplished alliances for “player input” is everything else, but surely not a way to create new chaos, because they are only experts at their game, not the game.
o7
p.s. if CCP stopped treating new players like little children who need to be taken by the hand and instead equip them with realistic and powerful options to shake things up, to break the powerful, to make meaningful decisions other than which large Alliances underling they want to become, that would do some good too.
p.p.s. CCP would probably be better off trying to restart the game completely as EVE 2, maybe with some minor form of asset compensation, than trying to fix the current
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imo its a combination of factors.
First, eve’s old players are getting old, having kids, university, mortgages, etc
Second, eve simply isnt what it used to be, and probably never can be.
Which leads to the third issue… CCP has been trying to ‘modernize’ the game and market it to newer audiences
Theres nothing you can do about aging player base. Those people will leave no matter how good the game is. The problem is how to you continue to grow a niche hardcore pvp game in today’s hand-holding gaming environment? Eve’s original audience played MUDs, Roguelikes, and other games like Another World… But today? even the videogame journalists cant beat the tutorial of Cuphead…
The alienated ‘bitter vets’ might be grumpy but they still like the game. They just make it harder for CCP to modernize when they moan at EVERYTHING (ei: the agency, WIS, skins, etc)
WIS would have been awesome. Sorry but it just would have. the pitchfork mob who shot the statue that day ruined a good thing.
the problem is how do you change the game to modernize it, without disrupting people’s asset/isk values too much? Its a fine line to walk and tbh ccp is doing better than anything i could come up with… mostly… *shakes fist at fozziesov*
but it seems they’ve done a lot of good, like this new moon mining change, to disrupt the free passive-isk mining of a handful of alliance leaders, and handed it over to the common pod pilot to profit from instead
theres complaints about The Agency but i really dont see the problem. it effects nobody unless you choose to use it… its a good example of the only way CCP can really modernize the game without disrupting older players. I think people just hate it because, as with every game, eve isnt perfect, and they want ccp working other problems instead.
i really think its a mistake to get rid of POS entirely though… *shakes fist again*
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Well that’s retarded. 
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A lot of people in this and other MMO games leave simply because of boredom. It’s easy to quit a single player game once you’ve played a while - you just quit and that’s it. But in these kinds of games it’s different. People who have played a while have usually made friends and quitting would feel almost like betrayal. That’s why you find in Eve and every other MMO game the “bitter vets” - players who have played for many years, who are bored to tears with the game, but because of the friendships they have made are looking for an excuse and even absolution to just quit.
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As older players quit to go play grownup, these are the players who’re supposed to replace them. How can eve exist in a world where blowing people up is considered a real life violent hatecrime?
The newer generations cant stand hardcore pvp games and eve is suffering because hardcore pvp is considered literal rape these days. And calling it rape jokingly is supposed to be even more offensive…
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Wow you are really, really upset. Maybe you should consider another game…one without so much of it based on knowledge and building up a group that you can play with to help you achieve your goals and where you help them achieve theirs…and yes, that is so nuts in an MMO game. 
Why are you still here then? Simply close the client and uninstall the game and move on…that is what an adult would do.
You mean games where you don’t have building up a group and acquire knowledge to help you achieve your in game goals? A game that is…simple and easy? Okay.
Nobody in EVE is a protected class, if there is a group kicking over your sand castle maybe it is just that you suck.
Oh…I see…
You fell for a scam. You let your greed, laziness and foolishness over-ride what minuscule common sense you have and you got ripped off. Did they get it all? And now you are projecting your own shortfalls on to the rest of us.
You do realize you are assuming that the rest of us have not made mistakes as well. I lost a jump freighter a couple of years ago. Very expensive loss. I was foolish and imprudent and paid for it. I didn’t come to the forums and cry like a wimp though. I sucked it up, and went and bought a new jump freighter and then set about devising a strategy to minimize the risks I had been unwittingly and foolishly taking.
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I guess I’m officially old enough now to complain about the next generation (And to a degree even my own generation.) being bunch of limp wristed “safe spacers” (Pun intended) that will doom us all. And I’m not sure if I’m talking about the game or real life… possibly both.
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A player once told me in a private chat that “I shuld be aloud to kill u”. Been feeling very anxious and vulnerable ever since.
Stupidity knows no age. Neither in the form of terrorizing people through racism and the likes nor when reacting to that with whining, instead of a more appropriate, impacting reply. Both doom us. The ones that make a habit of turning humans against each other irl instead of facing common challenges and the ones discussing with them as if the appropriate reply to antihuman slurs is anything in the realm of words.
For EVE and every video game in that matter: if the company allows for personalized or group-based slurs, they’d also have to allow any other form of real life threat and that quickly becomes an issue with lawsuits and so on.
Even though I don’t like the whining sound of how he put it, the guy Dep_Sun is right about EVE being toxic in that sense. Not the most extreme case I suppose, but not your average online level either. I don’t think it’s a reason for many people leaving the game, but could be one of the reasons for the lack of a large new generation to take over the flame and carry it on. EVE indeed sometimes seems like a game where bitter old men can feel like hard bois again and that’s okay. It’s also kind of ugly and cringy and surely doesn’t make it very attractive… not even for fellow bitter old wimps who wish the girls would look at them without disgust or dismay.
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Believe me, it’s both.
Just don’t play it then, but before you go
look back at 15 years of posts like yours and realise
this game survives because it appeals to the intelligent who can see beyond your limited worldview
and use their imaginations
no one is forcing you to spend time with these pathetic people
who is most pathetic, those who enjoy themselves playing a game as it was intended
or those who waste time slinging insults on a forum for a game they declare not only worthless
but a morally bankrupt playground run by the incompetent.
Let this thread be your mirror- I can see you clearly and your insecurities and I wish I could reach out and make you feel better about yourself but I am worried
that some are just a lost cause.
Can I have your stuff?
That’s real life though, just the same.
In eve when people do that, I can challenge them, or destroy them.
In rl they are usual in positons of real power and the consequences for making a stand are more severe.
How do you deal with these people in real life, quit the game eg. leave the room or the company or whatever, or stand up and be counted.
I’ve been asking this same question forever. So far I’ve been in EVE for 10 years and 5 months. If I hated EVE or CCP or the community one tenth as much as many of these posters do, I would have quit EVE 10 years and 4 months ago…
From my point of view, it makes no sense. You waste your time on something that enrages you, made by people who piss you off, people you don’t trust. And yet you never leave? WTF?
I can’t bend my mind around it, then I remember that there are lots of things in life that people do that I can’t bend my mind around. Like the guy who pays a leather clad woman to tie him up and beat him senseless for ‘pleasure’, or people who kill puppies or whatever.
Fact is, demented people exist. Ironically, the demented people think they are sane and think everyone else is messed up. But they can never fully explain why they enjoy hating EVE and CCP so much.
You been whining about changes for years.
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No I haven’t and you know I haven’t. Feel free to name one.
Is this a joke?
CCPs forays into NPC dynamics being just the most recent.
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I wish I could hug them and send them flowers irl, to show them tht it is all ok and that we are all just adults
playing a game
maybe it is because I spent so long around gamblers and people who dealt with loss as a part of doing business and playing a game,
I don’t know
But I do know this whole thread is a fallacy of sorts- before we can theorise that so many people have quit over the last few years
we need to know that so many people have quit over the last few years
and we don’t have that data so whatever
Before posting in these threads discobot should make us read the last 15 years of the same threads, and then maybe we can make an educated guess as to the reality behind this business of eve is dying
edit- every morning I log on about 9am eve time and theres 25k online, how is that a dying game its the weakest timezone, seems like a game that’s growing again to me, but maybe slow growth is better in the long term than a huge spike of steam players who don’t really work in eve? I don’t know.
I know from reading your posts that you don’t understand some things (notice how I rarely reply to you, as you are generally hopeless), but this once I’ll try to help you understand.
Defending a thing that exists is not the same as what’s being discussed here. I like what EVE is, I like what EVE was concieved as, and how it embodies freedom and encourages creativity. Things that threaten the things that made EVE great (the things I think of as the core of EVE, like freedom and non-consensal pvp and sandboxy/do it yourself ‘non-dynamic’ PVE) are things I comment on.
This is not the same as people who have hated EVE from the day they started playing and yet keep playing. The people who hate CCP but keep giving them money. The people who say they hate the community for being ‘toxic’ but who remain members of that community (usually while being ‘toxic’ themselves).
If any of this is hard to understand I’m sorry, but, but it can’t be put any plainer than this.
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