Balance was yesterday - today we have the NERGAL muahahahaha

(elitatwo) #1

OMG what hath you donneth??

I was having my maiden voyage in a Nergal on Singularity today and OMG that ship beyond broken.
So I had 2x 1v1 with a Hawk and vaporized the poor thing twice, no biggy but I glimpsed a 400dps output on that disintegrator gun and was curious.

Following Suitonias prior introduction to the Damavik on youtube, I warped to a customs office and started to ramp up.
And boy did it ramp up … and did ramp up … and didn’t stop until that tech 2 gun reached 638dps (with the specialization skill at level 1 !!!1111eleven) + 99.9dps from 5x t2 hobgoblins.
So at 739.4dps the output stopped ramping up - oh gawwhd!!!

Now let’s add the missing 8% damage from the skill to that damage and we end up at:
798.552dps with heat.
But since we do not stop here, let’s take an agency pill with +9% damage (lol) and end up at: 870.42dps for a nice assault frigate which can in a small pack of, say 15 Nergals sink a carrier no biggy.
Now you might say, hey them fighters will kill them frigates no problemo, or do they?

Well when 15 Nergals with more than 10.000dps vaporize all those ebil fighters in 10 seconds, that carrier will have a problem and was hopefully insured - lol.

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(Daoden) #2

You forgot to overheat at max ramp up.

(elitatwo) #3

No, I didn’t. But who uses heat at 800dps anyways…

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(dewk) #4

The assault ships have the damage boost and resistance boost, but its short term.

If an assault ship can get the jump on a target itll win. But if someone knows how to counter assault ships, assault ships just bing items.

Remember all anyone needs to do is get you to trigger assault damage control then kit you till it finishes then has better damage as you resist is low.

And damage wise it a case of knowing the limits of the weapons the assault ships have bonuses with.
Trig weapons are no different, just learn its limitation and learn how to take advantage of its limitations.

Though also remember if you play against someone that know his/her limitations and ships, and knows how to use that to their advantage you’re in trouble.

The trig assault ships are no difference, the damage is a big bell curve, and only really kicks in 1/2 way to full output, but if they miss just once or out of range for one shot, they reset and have to start their cycles again.

As you can see each weapon has it limits, as does each ship. They also have advantages.

(Kei Hazard) #5

Triglavian ship are good when 1 on 1, that is by design.
This AF is especially good when it has higher max damage cap, and probably can tank enough time to ramp.
However with 2* weapon upgrade this ship still need more than 2 minutes to ramp the damage to max, that is the cost. Any interruption will reset this value.
In 1 on 1 fight the advantages are maximized, and the disadvantages are minimized.

On the other hand, this new AF can never apply the damage as good as a retribution @ 20-30km. In terms of brawling the 25m3 drone base is a big advantage, but it still need around 20 seconds to match an enyo. Keep in mind every time there is a target switch, the ramped dps is lost. Not really sure whether it still feels that imbalanced.

It is for sure the best AF for Level 4 burner missions lol.

(Daoden) #6

Best way to beat it 1v1 is ECM drones

(Stitch Kaneland) #7

Just one minor correction. If they miss, ramp up still occurs. Its only when you go outside optimal range and they turn off that causes them to reset.

Its common in abyssal pvp for them to do close orbit (vedmak) and miss on purpose to do full ramp and prevent opponents reactive hardener to switch. Then once theyre at full ramp, they pull range and alpha through their reps/tank.

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(dewk) #8

Yip saw that last night while doing some tests will new Trig fits for Leshak, and the new Trig heavy Assault cruiser.

The ramp up on the cruiser is impressive, with my skills it got to within 800dps of the Leshak when running t2 modules and turret/ammo, though that gap would increase if using t2 versions on Leshak .

But you’re correct on the missing.

(Dragos Highwind) #9
  1. It’s going to be 20x the cost of other assault frigs for the forseeable future.
  2. Unless you’re doing a 1v1 against something that you can keep in range, it will likely be doing the same damage as a Damavik.
  3. You’re going to get primaried every single fight.
(dewk) #10

Prices over the last week have dropped to 1/2 and in one ship 1/4 what they were for the first two days.

(Scipio Artelius) #11

It’s a really good ship, but so sensitive to fitting and cap.

Spooling isn’t instant either and in the fights I’ve had in the ship, nothing has been long enough to fully spool up - but the base damage is good anyway.

Absolute beast of a ship and I see a rebalance coming, but like with the T3D when they were introduced, hopefully not too soon.

(dewk) #12

There will be those buying both assault ships no matter the cost. But the insurance for both matches that of the faction ones.

But if you build them that’s a different story. The prices drop massively to make one vs buy one out right.

(Dragos Highwind) #13

The cost to build just the hull is currently around 500m. Given that a Damavik hull in Abyss prime season was able to be built for about 40m means the Nergal will prob settle around 120m. The ending price rests solely on how Invasions end up which is anyone’s guess, Abyss runners are decreasing in numbers due to the drone aggro and frigate run loot nerf changes.

Factor in the turret + other fitting and the Nergal may end up around 200m. Compare that now to the retribution which is I believe like 60-70m kitted.

Many of us in the test forum were pleading for +50% ramp speed and max ramp instead of the silly +100% max ramp. As she stand it’s an overpriced damavik with more tank in95% of fights. It’s OP in most 1v1 and structure bashing, but subpar for everything else.

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(dewk) #14

True the assault DC is good, but only for 16secs, then it drops for 150secs.

Its a gamble with the Trig ship with ADS and the way disintergators ramp up. Other ships can alpha strike and maintain a steady dps.

(Kei Hazard) #15

I guess the problem somewhat lies in the 25m3 drone, which is around 90 dps.
Jaguar dps is ■■■■ while has only 15 bandwith.

I’m not saying the ship is strong, but it does produce ok dps right from the start, in close range though.

(Dragos Highwind) #16

Keep in mind that is 25 bandwith with 25 storage, as they pop they won’t get replaced and with no bonuses to HP they are paper thin. In a 1v1 situation they are good, in a fleet of any sort don’t count on that DPS.

(dewk) #17

Yip, but its a frigate, and they’ve never been high in hp.

The Trig frigates just happen to have the lowest shield hp of all frigates.

But, and this is a BIG but, if you know Trig ships and the lore, they counter this with amazing remote armour repair.
100% to remote armour repair range
+50% reduction to cap usage of remote armour repair module.

Many might have noticed the Trigs RAR each other, this is part of the lore, they normally operate in groups of three ships, and the focus fire targets and focus repair each other.
So yes solo trig ships have paper thin hp, but fleeted its a different story as some have found out. Think of a basic trig frigate, its dps starts around 150dps(depending on ammo used and drones), even in a basic 2 player fleet thats 300 starting dps on a target, and one ramped up that going to be a major hurt.

The standard trig frigate has 3 highslots, so its no issue mounting a turret and 2 remote armour repairs, that alone gives @112hp/3sec armour repair equal to a deadspace lowslot repair unit. And not having a lowslot repair might be looked as not a good idea, if fleet reping you can mount a tanking module.

I have a trig frigate t1 that has an average tank resist in armour of 82%, runs every module and is 47.9% cap stable. Yes thats with twin remote reps, MWD, and a few medslot modules. Has a MWD speed of just under 3km/s and as at that speed an align time of 3.75sec.
And i have a similar Trig assault Frigate, but slightly lower resists due to ADC, but has a higher dps.

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(Dragos Highwind) #18

The paper thin is in reference to the drones.

A Nergal’s capacitor will have a very rough time running a RAR without having cap issues in combination with tackle. Meanwhile a cap stable 54m retribution can put out 300+ dps with similar armor. the nergal is good, don’t get me wrong, but in it’s class it’s not great unless doing 1v1. Even structure bashes there no real need to bring one when you can just roll up with a Leshak or Iki.

(elitatwo) #19

Two more days until I can fly the HAC. I hear mixed opinions about that one. I will see this weekend I guess.

(dewk) #20

The HAC is heaps of fun. But like what was posted above the ADC is a mixed bag.

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