I don’t think this will pan out that way. The changes benefit those with big bank balances and lots of trading experience. Small fry will struggle to compete. Certain sections of the market will be exclusive to the rich who can afford to lay down the cost of items when they make buy orders etc.
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You are correct but seriously we are talking about a level of skill that can be learned in 1-2 weeks.
More significant understandings of the economy and market manipulation stuff takes a lot more know how and time to develop. But looking through the marketplace to see volume, max/min and margin then deciding if you want to get involved just takes time and effort.
Any game should reward those who put a lot of effort into it but … CCP are killing that off in order to make everything white bread. And it was apparently only 1.8% of all marketplace orders that were changed more than 8 times? So now everything has to fall in line with that due to imaginary bots which CCP can’t even be sure exist and doesn’t even sound like they acted on one time? lmao
It feels more to me that they want to crush the income generation possibilities trading in its present form (with Margin Trading etc) has. Bots are certainly not the reason and I wish people in this thread would question that narrative established in CCP’s announcement.
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If you are purely talking about station trading then maybe…all other trading types ramp the complexity-up pretty fast.
But ya, CCP just hit the easy button on trading and now it’s just going to be one communal market…
Bots are certainly not the reason
You are 100% bang-on here too…this is a total red-herring.
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Yeah you are right if you mean seeding markets or other more complex trading based on understandings of wider game meta e,g, alliance doctrines etc etc.
Heck even just being a hustler that is willing and able to fly to any HS/LS system to grab good deals a moments notice…and then bring it to the best hub to flip…
Lot’s of python scripts I tells ya… 
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If bots were the issue here, maybe something like a market fatigue timer (similar to jump fatigue) would have worked a little better? i.e. The more rapid buy order changes done the larger wait time or larger buy order fee gets until the timer cools down? It wouldn’t necessarily stop them but at least slow them down.
How long will it take a brand new player interested in the market to go from zero to being able to trade officer mods? Meaning having an ability to lock up 1-4b ISK on a single trade?
What I find kind of classic is how the part of CCP that want this change argued in a team meeting for a system that would exclude new-bros (or poors) for years when they must be overall concerned with player retention and numbers of accounts.
Even just a good CAPTCHA would have done wonders…
@Runa_Yamaguchi Sure, that doesn’t seem unreasonable.
Welcome to the forums BTW…just a tip, no need to use the @ if you directly reply to a post…those are used to just add other people into a post if you want to alert them too.
o7
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Good work on removing Margin Trading and introducing the 4 digit limiter to stop the penny/dime trading.
I believe the relisting percentage is way too high. I have about 500 active orders and I supply low velocity items/ships to the markets. This relisting cost will just limit what I list and limit what players can buy from me. As I will only list items/ships that I know will sell inside the 90 days.
As for adding the percentage to the player owned stations I think it is too low. I think a minimum of 1.5% should be the lowest with half of that going to the sink but hey CCP does not listen to the players any way.
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I trade things in Amarr. I once sold a Mackinaw via sell order there. It took like 3 days and at least 20 price cuts to finally sell. Now you’re telling me that would have cost 20-30% of the selling price in relisting fees??
I don’t quite understand how this relisting fee is supposed to help the markets at all. This will just dissuade people from trading at all because the profits will be significantly neutered.
I do like the change to the minimum tick size. However the change to margin trading will hurt new traders and give a further advantage to those with deeper pockets. I use the skill so that I can place a whole bunch of buy orders at once (combined more ISK I have) so that I can have a higher chance at acquiring something. But I guess with the new relisting fees I shouldn’t be placing buy orders at all as my profits will be butchered if I have to modify them at all. Which I will have to.
I trade in region hubs, hundreds of orders. It is easy to keep track of bought items (sell order price + broker fee for listing + transaction tax) profit margin. Now, with this system, i won’t be able to keep track as the lower bound (acquisition price + fees) will always move as you add relisting fee.
If i need to build an ESI based system to keep track of my sell orders, that won’t be easy. But bots will quickly adapt. You just need to find the right algorithm and fire.
We reach the point were it is too much efforts for playing by the rules and it is easier to build some mem reader program to interact with the game (hello pyrasite).
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The minimum broker fee is a good idea.
The digit precision is also a good idea, but I think 4 is a bit too much. Might want to start with 5 and see what happens.
I think the re-list charges, while a good idea, are way too high. A smaller change to to see the effect it has should be tried first.
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You’re absolutely right, they want to kill income generation in all forms.
And any excuse about combating bots is just a ■■■■■■■■ cover story since they don’t want to admit they want everyone across the board to have a harder time earning isk.
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Great changes, the salt and the tears taste delicious, I’m sick of the endless market manipulation.
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…except these changes don’t address that. In fact, it’s going to get worse…
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yes I think they do, stop denying it
How…?