I wonder if CCP consulted their economist before coming up with these idiotic changes. Oh wait, they fired that guy.
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Was gonna say⌠or #4: find another way to get those commodities/components. Farming themselves, getting them from friends/corpmates, by trading/contracts/etc.
Should be an interesting time coming⌠tomorrow morning.
:::thread reminds me to put a couple 90 day buy orders up for ammo I use a lot before downtime hits:::
I agree with much of what you have said when reading your conversations and some of your logic make sense to me (just as the logic of the people you talk with also make sense ), but could you explain why you believe bot creators would stop their activities and not just change behavior just as the behavior of the rest of us will change? This in the context of trading.
I have in my previous comments i have tried to explain the logic that, the operators still donât use RL time to play the market, and just because the profit is lower that is not a reason for a bot operator to stop.
I have also asked the question, how would CCP be able to differentiate and assign the cause of the less orders creation and order updates to bot or real traders?
Also, for the argument sake assume bots would remain, as a trader, do you believe they will have an advantage or disadvantage when competing with you after the change compared to today?
Im asking because i want to learn and not to attempt to prove CCP is wrong in making this decision or because i believe you are âCCP fanboyâ (whatever that means).
I donât think any trader that have earned and own assets valued over a trillion from trading, do see this change as a opportunity and can see the many possessive things the change will bring with it.
The problem, imo, is that this change will not solve the problem it intend to solve, that is the removal7 significant reduction of bots. Not only will this not remove bots but now the complexities of keeping track of hundreds of orders will force people to crate or download bots.
As a trader i have to make certain decisions before entering a market, these decisions are made before any order is created. After the orders are created and when the price is changed significantly one revisit the calculations that allowed for those decisions to be made and then decide if one wants to keep playing that market or exit.
After the change this revisiting has to be done every time a change is to be made, or accept that a portion of one asset, ISK, will be stuck under or/and above other orders. now imagine this scenario for billions/trillions of ISK spread over hundreds of orders.
I have read other people solution to this problem but with my game style and im assuming many other traders game style these solutions are not practical and will result in massive profit drop. While competing with remaining bots.
Sorry I did not claim so.
However, I claimed that if making bots is not rewarding enough, less people will do them. So starving the bots is a way to reduce the bot creators activity, also the bot users.
Itâs actually costly to maintain a bot.
I think itâs not related. If it was that easy to detect bots, I believe CCP would have banned them all already.
You are jumping from âa part of the orders have suspicious activityâ to âa part of the activity is made by botsâ. âLikely non humanâ is not the same thing as âbots confirmedâ.
Your question makes no sense. Bots will always have an overwhelming advantage. Itâs just a nonsense to compare that advantage ; what you can compare is, how those advantage benefit their user. And those advantage (automation, error prone, high uptime) will benefit less to their user. Itâs not even a question.
Of course on the long term it might change. If the market evolves, and bot user find a place with the same benefit, yes it will be bad again for the game. So far nobody proposed an explanation on how such a situation could arise, there was half-assed bot algorithms, as well as threat to crush the market, but thatâs just temporary or incomplete situation.
I am not CCP fanboy. I just happened to be one of the several people that proposed this change over the last 10 years.
And I try to not jump to conclusion just because the conclusion pleases me.
Again, itâs not supposed to remove bots. Itâs supposed to starve their user.
Many people already use programs to manage their orders. I do, and if you did youâd know there is a difference between a bot and such a program.
Yeah, thatâs called trading.
(I have other things to train that that remaining trading slots. Also thatâs on one alt only)
Then both you and the bots will have massive drops. Unless you adapt.
You do realise that bots will be able to burn money quickly? I think those using them will care about this
for all industrialist that buying materials or traders, dont forget to put ur buy order up, it is ur last chance to use margin trading, and ur chance to get cheap broker fee.
flysafe
3 Likes
Almost never used it . I only use it for items I donât need, but I want to provision and are cheap on BO - but then everytime it was some people cutting me 0.01 after that so ⌠not really worth it.
If I want items, I buy them on SO. I also make my benefit formula with the orders I bough, plus the SO value, plus a 3% tax fee so whether I bought items in BO or SO does not really matter.
yepyep.
Thought about putting up about 3.3 bil in ammo buy orders in Jita and Amarr⌠decided to cut that down a bit to about half a bil.
mostly missiles and trig ammo. man, trig ammo is still very spensive. ;_;
Lol I can see in Jita some traders who shrink their orders to the minimal margin 
advice : keep some isks, good bargain to be made ( probably long term return > 2months )
( the desperate traders trying to get rid off their last orders before the change )
Posting trillions of buy orders 5 minutes in front of the patch is exciting.
I love the game for not releasing patch notes before a patch,
its Casino StyleâŚAnd EvE is all about Casino for me 
2 Likes
And here is where your mask finally falls down. Not a trader, but spends hundreds of posts lecturing people as if he was the biggest expert.
As I mentioned a gazillion posts above, you are the typical whiner who puts up a buy order, gets undercut by .01isk, and instead of making intelligent decisions and playing the market, decides to hate on .01 isk undercutters and hope and support the removal of the entire profession.
Very recently CCP has decided to introduce a new flavour of the day term to try to explain why they are carrying out these market changes which will destroy a big part of the market, and BANG, you jump onto the bandwagon, because, quite obviously, you cannot come to the forums and state you hate on .01iskers because âthey undercut youâ - everyone would laugh at you and told you to git gud.
It really explains why so much hate and why you seem to have no argument other than repeating ad infinitum what CCP stated. It also explains why you cannot understand even the most simple and obvious arguments made by fulltime traders about these changes: you donât understand them because you have no real experience trading - if you get undercut once or twice you just QUIT.
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Lol.
So now you are not trader when you are producer ? Funny.
A mask ? What mask ? What makes you think I cared about your opinion on myself enough to âmaskâ ti ?
Blah. Cry more, noob.
I was talking about you:
âAnd here is where your mask finally falls down. Not a trader, but spends hundreds of posts lecturing people as if he was the biggest expert.â
1 Like
Yeah, you were talking BS again.
cry more, noob.
That was funny .
Now how much do your broker relation changes suck CCP?
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I really like this change. My competition seems to be giving up without a fight
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Will have to see how other traderâs respond to the market⌠
