I’m not saying you are one. I’m saying, irony is best kept for people who know you are not, otherwise it can lead people to understand you are one, and as such ignore the message that you are actually bringing to the discussion.
Here it’s difficult because you point at a detail, that is actually correct, but assumes people don’t know of thing being abusable. People may have overlooked the abusable part, but making half assed comments does not help the discussion.
True, but it wouldn’t be hard to program collusion checks to see if propulsion was being used, bumping without speed isn’t really “bumping…”
So every time a mission runner uses a prop mod, or someone gating places used a MWD to get into warp faster then they get killed for bumping?
See, this is why bumping is how it is. Because the ‘solutions’ just don’t work. By the time you make them work, they also don’t really stop the bumper either.
The orca carnage on mission/refine hubs…you need tons of popcorn for that show.
Mission/mining systems you will see these undock with the other pve ships. And hit the MWD to not be there forever. Orca with no MWD? I cannot even imagine that.
Same for noctis, I pulse mwd to warp this beast out to.
Who suggested Orcas shouldn’t have MWD’s, I’m not going thru that wall of text. How do you expect my Orca to get safe when Code/ Safety/ whatever they call themselves now come into system now without dieing. No thank you. I will keep my 12 sec align time, thank you.
I don’t remember anyone doing it actually.
If bumping got a criminal tag of sorts tied to mwd use, using mwd spank in tight areas would get the orca a criminal tag. Someone presented the idea of no MWD, no tag. So yeah…this is why this is a bad idea.
I was pointing why this idea always dies horrible deaths. The game cannot know the difference between an actual mass loaded BS level MWD stabber (used to be stabber anyway that I recall) made for bumping from an orca that also uses an oversized MWD to go to warp faster.
Nobody proposed that either.
Propulsion, not propulsion module. The argument made was if a ship is stationary, it cannot be responsible for the bump, so if someone collides with a stationary target they are clearly the aggressor and should be flagged accordingly.
That ignores people parked on undocks, and who knows how many other methods of circumventing the ‘restriction’.
Bumping causing flags is simply too easily abused. There are no mechanics whereby the game can read player intent - it can assume intent when someone has a target set or has selected an object, but bumping can be executed without having to select the object in question (just look at uncloaking by gate campers for an example of how this is done). The only ‘fix’ for bumping would be to remove it entirely from player-piloted-ship-to-player-piloted-ship interaction (while preserving it for all interactions with non-players objects, ships included, and unpiloted objects) - which removes counter-AFK activities like orca bumping in high-sec belts to steal their drones (or just stop them mining) and bumping people off tethers. Given CCP’s support for reduction in low-attention activities, I don’t see them removing the counter to AFK mining.
Please explain why a trigger tied to both a velocity AND momentum threshold would not work. Doing over 3500 in your WMD frigate and hit a ship? No sweat. You don’t have sufficient momentum for bumping. Doing 400 in your WMD fit Orca and hit a ship? No sweat. You don’t have sufficient velocity for bumping. Going over 2000 (IDK) in your Machariel? You are either bumping or completely careless…enjoy your suspect flag.
Because it is now gameable to stay just under the threshold, and any MWD Battleship would also trigger it.
Sometimes non-consensual bumping can’t be avoided, yo.
More precisely, if a hard limit is set below which a ship can avoid that issue, then people can make ships specifically to avoid that one limit, and other people would also NEED to handle that limit to not become suspect.
When you bump, you transfer max your energy (E = m×v²) so the other person also can become “above speed” if it has a MWD (say, an orca aligning out ?) , so a second ship hitting it would make it become suspect target. While not making the actual perpetrator a suspect target.
IMO the real problem, is the requirement to be aligned to warp off. you should warp off after the time estimated to warp, or when trajectory vector is good enough, whichever comes first. And whenever you align towards something, after the alignment time, even if you re bumped you should have acquired that things and warp towards it. That is, in HS the only thing that should prevent you from warping is a suicide point.
LOL
Sounds to me like your next claim will be that some water is dry just to occupy camp “NO”. FFS
No, because the speed of the target ship would occur AFTER the bump. It would take a third ship bumping, AT LEAST, to accomplish this. Not only would it be near impossible to set up this perfect chain reaction, it would also be easily avoidable with a little programming that makes it so that the trigger momentum and velocity must be within a 30 degree cone of the nose of the ship.
that’s what I am talking about a “second ship”.
near impossible != impossible.
bumping an aligning orca towards another ship is not really difficult. Just add more ships if you need.
ships don’t have nose.
In Eve, ships are spheres.
So I grab a fleet of Catalysts, bump into an Orca until the Orca goes fast enough to get a flag if it bumps a ship, and then put another ship in front of it, to kill it without CONCORD interference?
Or would you like to add more rules?
That won’t work unless the orca has a propmod active.
He literally wrote that there would need to be a prop on.
still, just need to bump the ship with a BS that has more mass, to make it suspect - assuming you placed smaller ships behind.
I would fit a propmod on my Orca to get it into warp faster.
Maybe once I get flagged for it I’ll stop doing that though…
Obviously ships do have a tail given that ships are propelled away from it. The opposite of that is the nose of the ship.
So obviously there is a way for the software to understand near enough who is and who is not intentionally bumping.
I don’t believe it is possible to set this chain reaction up to the point that it would have even a one in 10, 000 percent chance of succeeding. Every bumping ship added increases the chance of collision among the bumpers, ruining the chain reaction.
I bet there is a programmable software solution to even the oddball chance it does succeed in making a victim go FY but you know, a person can actually pilot their ship and easily prevent the perfect bumps this would require. And if they are AFK? It was well deserved.