Unknowledgeable idiots who don’t understand that no matter how many players a system can reasonably handle, both sides will always bring more. Those really are dumb AF.
Don’t blame CCP, blame yourself for being part of the problem.
Disagree on that part. 3rd Party tools are absolutely useful way to get data. There are other ways to help smaller entities
Guess what. It is called space superiority. Similar to a real war, whoever controls the skies wins. And again, if you are not willing to commit to this type of warfare, dont start a war.
I don’t want players to police 0.0, it just shouldn’t be so easy to travel around 0.0 space. Its actually harder to travel around low sec than it is 0.0 that shouldn’t be right. I just think they made certain parts of the game too easy and neglected other parts.
I feel bad for everyone involved, on both sides (never thought I would say this). Everyone wanted the fight and have a significant turn in the war. Some came on time, some did not. It doesn’t matter if one side had 4000+ in one system, and the other side had even more next door hours before the rep timer. Merging those two groups on to a single grid was never going to happen, technically, if history of massive fights taught us anything.
It is not even CCP’s fault. They, or anyone else, cannot acquire hardware that would allow to theoretically have all logged in pilots be on the same grid - because that is the eventuality one would have to address in order to make the current possible scale of fights feasible. If it ever becomes technically feasible it won’t be for years.
So where does that leave us with questions about “fairness” ? Is it really true that a battle can be avoided simply by putting enough pilots on grid fully prepared and block entry for the other side ? Maybe, it does look that way. But it’s not important. It just shows that this is not how a war should be fought with the current hardware - however much we all would like to see this level of fighting. The defending forces will clearly have a level of advantage, especially if they are as motivated and diligent as we have seen today.
Maybe CCP should ask itself if the game mechanics involving Upwell structures, allowing for this massive level of preparation in advance by the players, is still compatible with the level of hardware performance. Perhaps those mechanics should be revisited instead. Hardware will always have hard limits. And a mandatory cap on number of people or a certain type of ships in system would be the worst solution possible. I don’t see an easy solution, and am happy I’m not a ccp game designer… I just hope CCP will have an open discussion with us on what happened and how they will try to find a solution to this type of problem.
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To you and to OP:
Okay, so it is cost prohibitive/impossible to design structures/machines/systems/whatever so that they never fail under any circumstances. For example, you can’t design a car so safe that it could guarantee the complete safety of it’s occupants in any type of car crash. And even if you could, it would be so expensive that it would be unprofitable to manufacture. So instead, you have to find a balance between cost and safety.
Of course, this is not to say that you shouldn’t make all reasonable attempts to improve vehicle safety, or that you should stop trying to innovate new safety solutions. But, to expect a vehicle to have the functional equivalent of an immortality field from Rick and Morty is completely unreasonable.
Yes, CCP should keep looking for ways to improve server performance and stability. But keep in mind that we are talking about the largest fights to happen in all of video games -which means this is probably one of the biggest challenges in all of game development. So, idk… maybe try to be a little more understanding, and stop acting like some of the biggest Karens in all of video games.
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Why do you play a game that is unplayable? Why do you waste tons of your time and money on such a failed enterprise? Losing 100b worth titans because servers are not able to cope with such battles without any official information from the developer that there is a hard population cap on players present in a system is really crazy…
CCP has pushed massive fleet fights for decades - fully knowing that they can never scale and that there will always be a hard limit. They never dared to really hurt the big blobs but instead they decided to hurt everybody over and over again - driving even more players into the big blobs.
They should receive the flogging for this - no matter how stupid PAPI’s decisions were in that fight.
There was no hard cap. It was a practical limit on what the server could calculate at any given moment at full capacity. Ask any machine to perform more calculations at once than it can ever do at once and you get this situation. That is the reason for the implementation of TiDi, but even that was not enough for the massive number of outstanding calls from the players. It just buckled because there was no hard cap,… Had there been one, we wouldn’t have seen unfitted titans, or titans in the sun, or titans back in station, etc.
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So CCP should officially state in its terms of service agreement or similar document that game is unplayable if there is say over 6k players in a system or CCP cannot guarantee proper game behavior etc. Now it seems PAPI wanted to fight Goons and no known game mechanic should prevent it yet it turned out they lost to CCP servers, not Goons…
You are correct in most of what you say, however, the game acted up like I didn’t see it the years I played:
Of course everybody knew it to be a tidi beast. And also everyone knew saying 10% tidi actually meant ‘a smaller number we don’t want to disclose to players’. Thats fine, we all were expecting it.
What we didn’t expect was that fact that outstanding calls to the server just got deleted instead of delayed. And I blame this to CCP. It was never this way and maybe CCP tried to fix problems they found in previous fights and those fixes went wrong.
I know those dialog boxes in heavy tidi like this:
but I also know by just being patient, eventually it got through and you could continue. This time, however, the calls got deleted, there was no notification popup, it just didn’t work.
And this needs to be fixed.
It sucks, that is certainly the case. Both sides wanted the fight. I’m also pretty sure the “win” feels pretty hollow to the Goonswarm/Init side.
And it’s not so clear if 6k players in a system is the practical limit if those players would all be miners, simply shooting asteroids instead 
To put it simple the sad reality is if someone can put say 4-5k blue players in a contested system he is invincible. Goons actually can do that so it is high time for PAPI to stop this pointless war till CCP improves servers (doubtious) or changes mass battles mechanic somehow.
My 0.02$.
The system was stalled at about 5300 players for about one hour, later I saw a spike to 6666 players, but at that time most of the attackers already gave up trying to enter the system
This is not the first time goons used the tactic of blobbing to avoid a loss. It was cheese then and its cheese now.
Listening to everyone in Talking in Stations voices deflate once they realized what goons were up to was the sad.
This is why eve pvp is all hype. A game of cheaters…oh ya…immergent gameplay is what you all paint it over with.
Pathetic.
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You are aware the PAPI side had even more pilots ready to jump from T5 system to M2, right ? It’s not only Goons/Init who are able to field those numbers.
Well, any other major PVP mmorpg is doing it with success since years.
CCP is “encouraging” and promoting EVE as a mass PVP w huge battles in 0.0 … I mean, the very first line in their ADV is “Huge battles” and “immense PvP battles” 
I guess it is time for CCP marketers and devs to face reality.
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CCP has to governate these events. Mechanics have to mitigate or skip the systems crowding, if server can’t manage it. Remove the bridge mechanic.
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Goons, knowing they would lose…purposely flooded the system early. They knew what would happen because they did it before. It was the only way they could have won and they took it. They abused the limitations of the hardware to win.
A CHEESE move in a game that touts its grand pvp.
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Sure! That is why current situation can bring ETHERNAL PEACE to null-sec. Simply Goons can log in 5k in any Delve system so they are untouchable. Similarly PAPI is inconquerable because if Goons tried to invade TEST Vily would bathophne Horde to log in 5k in Esoteria and Goons would lose. Also Gobbins could batphone TEST to log in 5k in TKE if Goons showed up.
What a magic…“Peace trough servers!”