You do get the average development time of an MMO is around 7 years right?
Putting EVE on a new engine is starting from the start of that 7 years, even assuming they launched right into it on day 1.
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Instead, you would walk into somebodyâs house, as a privileged guest, hammer on the table, raise your voice and demand things ? Are you quite sure thatâs how it works ? Or that this is the way to instruct people on social interaction ?
CCP gave you the best toy they could currently make. You broke it. Donât like the toy anymore ? Get one from another vendor.
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when was the last time you payed your monthly subscription to your local supermarket and they delivered the items they decided you need?
An analogy isnât a literal comparison. Clearly the business models are different.
Even a moron such as myself can understand that.
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you were only willing to that because you could position and AFK ⌠not that much of effort or competence there.
thatâs why not all analogies are valid
Sure. If you got nothing out of the post (ie. we are customers like we are customers of other businesses we purchase from. We donât have any entitlement to expect CCP to give us information), then thatâs ok.
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For a long term, changing product⌠what an extraordinary suggestion for customers not to receive information.
Except that isnât what I wrote, so we are all good I guess.
Thereâs a difference between CCP giving us information (which they do) and being an entitled customer that believes CCP owe us information. That shouldnât even be a controversial statement, but here we are. Go figure.
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nothing wrong with demanding customers.
Donât bother, he doesnât WANT to understand because it doesnât suit him. No different from carebears not WANTING to accept that EVE is a PVP sandbox, because it doesnât suit their narrative.
Canât have a worthwhile discussion with people who donât WANT to listen.
edited the quote for accuracy.
Thereâs a huge difference between what you âwantâ and what you âneedâ.
But keep shaking the tree, as the wanting, demanding customer. You never know what may fall off, eh ?
CCP didnât fail this time. You can check my posts, Iâm certainly not their biggest fan, and Iâm definitely in that category of âPeople who have 99% won Eve but just canât quite get over that last 1%â. But CCP didnât make the dumb this time.
Did the server end up crapping its pants?
Yes, but not because CCP just phoned it in. CCP have done a TON of upgrading to the servers over the last several years. I remember when a fight with a few hundred people out in null would make the ENTIRE server lag, even in high sec.
But what did the dumb this time was the absolute hubris of Vily and PGL just assuming they could up the ante from the previous largest fight(around 6500 people) to, depending on the exact numbers you want to quote, 9-10k people and there wouldnât be consequences. NOBODY with two functioning brain cells and even 1/100th of their brain power able to look at it objectively would have said jumping thousands of mans more or less all at once into a system already with 4500 or so fat, sweaty goons already deployed, fighters out, ready to lock everything as soon as it appeared⌠nobody would have said that was going to work. But Vilyâs sheer arrogance not only did it, but convinced his members that they were going to do it, it was going to be great, AND they were going to shoot the keepstar out from under the gonz and wipe out their super fleet.
Hubris. Thatâs what caused this. Not CCP, Not CCPâs servers, Not CCPâs code, Not Gonz somehow cheating by accepting the serverâs WELL DOCUMENTED behavior for what it was and deploying early, Not even the average TEST or horde line member who listened to what Vily said(though they probably shouldnât have). This was 150% all on Vily.
Now, that aside, would it have been great if it would have worked and everyone could have had the massive titan brawl we all wanted to see? Heckinâ yeah. But you canât KNOW this is the way Eve is, KNOW that itâs improved exponentially over the years, and KNOW the previous âhigh barâ was about 6500, try to break it by several thousand, and then complain âbut Iâm angry and I pay for this and I expectâŚâ
No, fam. You should be penning an angry email to Vily right now, asking him what in the actual F he was thinking jumping into that.
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Yeah at no point did those 4500 gewns add to the problem nor did so many gewnz already being in that system force their hand to either one up or abandon.
Youâre right about it being the playerâs fault, youâre just doing BS propaganda by faulting one side of the conflict. Donât insult us by doing so, keep that for your larping forums and Reddit.
Yes, trying to insta-jump into a 5000 player system with another 5000 players is not so smart.
But the âCCP You faild againâ is this: As long as the server runs without errors everything is fine with me, even horrendous tidi. But in this case, the server did not run without errors, it just f*cked up. Thats what I see as the problem. CCP should have just pulled the plug on this node when it started to process â â â â â â â â .
Literally read your post and tell me youâre not butt hurt resorting to accusing me of larping, while at the same time saying âyep it is the players faultâ and then accusing me of insulting you.
Of course itâs the players fault, specifically the leadership who decided it wasnât worth their time to move fleets in early, KNOWING that server stability has always been a factor. Saying that isnât insulting you, itâs stating the fact of the matter as it is. Itâs not propaganda, either. The fact is, and you need to accept and get over this, is the server is always a factor in large fights. Itâs come a LONG way from where it used to be. There are things you can complain about about it, absolutely. But you CANNOT know what it is, choose to ignore it, YEET your fleet into it anyway, and then complain that it did exactly what you would expect it to do under those circumstances.
You also CANNOT complain that it didnât just die and save you when you chose to screw it over harder than anyone ever has, WHILE at the same time complaining it didnât run well enough. Losing ships to server issues sucks. But this is not some random unknown that came out of nowhere that nobody could have possibly predicted. EVERYONE knew this was going to happen if Vily tried to do what he did.
Stop whining, stop complaining that someone made a very stupid decision that cost theoretical âyouâ a ship and learn.
A) donât fly what you canât afford to lose
B) YOU are responsible for the ship youâre flying and if your FC is an idiot, donât join their fleet
C) Yeeting 5000 people into 5000 people is not a plan for success. You DO NOT get to assume it is, then complain on the forum when the server does exactly what literally anyone would say it was going to do, except for, ofc, when youâre the one trying it then get angry when it doesnât work.
And yes, that means you either have to put fleets into the system a couple hours ahead of time, or else give up an objective if your leadership decides to just YOLO it at the last minute.
Only then can you come onto the forum, say âwe did as much as we could to try and mitigate server issues and it STILL died.â Not when you just jump thousands of mans into thousands of mans and expect it to go swimmingly.
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goons knew this would happen, that is why they showed up early with so many bot accounts. They did it before to avoid a loss.
this was intentionally done by players to avoid pvp
There is few metres of mud under it and when CCP will start to code, they will have to break the floor and start coding in that mud. That will all muck-up the clear water above, I am sure. Like with the chat. It will be repeat of that situation, but maybe even more severe issues will surface, than the not visible people in local. 
Maybe peeps will be thrown into some kind of void, where their data will be shreded like cheese on grater. I dont know, but I think recovery of account may be more popular topic on forums in future.
So be careful what you wish for, peeps.
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Well if nothing else, most of sov 0.0 entities now learned that the best defense tactic is to simply log everything at your disposal (including alphas on virtual machines) into a single system to lag it out of existence.
Unless your enemy either takes several days of vacation or has no real life, you are pretty much invulnerable.
Honestly thereâs a strong part of me that isnât convinced thatâs not the best thing for Eve, a complete recode/large scale wipe.
At the end of the day, we can sit here and point fingers all day about M2. The fact is Vily screwed up on that specific incident. But just because he did, doesnât mean thereâs not also a TON of room for improvement if the coding issues from decades of code built on code and single core threading and old POS code and bounty systems and, and andâŚ
Unfortunately, the only way to fix all that really is a complete recode, more or less. Which might not be a bad thing.