The indy changes encompassed tank changes, it needs to be discussed properly and is all about real game balance. I saw some good points made including the one that having it so that one catalyst being able to blow up 4 of the mining ships easily makes reacting to them by movement in local impossible. A valid point well made by several posters.
Still that bait thread about paying subs by Orca is getting into full ganker troll mode. Someone even claimed that the Proc was buffed in terms of tank, roflā¦, what a troll!
Well that depends on where you are mining. If players insist on mining in busy systems 3 or 4 jumps out from trade hubs then addtional risk comes with that.
If however the spread their wings a bit its perfectly possible to mine in systems where locla can be monitored
Its almost like thereās a system to add peeps to negative standings so when they jump in you know and can nope out. And its almost like you shouldnāt mine right at the warp in point so that when they warp in you got plenty of time to nope out cause youāre already aligned.
yes thats what i thought you meant. Doesnt change my comment at all.
If you chose to mine in a busy system with 24 people in local then yes its difficult to notice one person arriving in local. Thats a risk you take for mining in a busy system.
If you mine in a system where there are 3 or 4 people in local its fairly easy to see someone getting added to that list.
Every miner has the agency to make this decision and therefore accept the risks asscoaited with. While i dont disgagree with raising EHP of barges etc saying this a reason for doing it is pretty lame
Anyone mining in a relatively busy system that isnāt hitting Ctrl+A on local chat to select all, deserves to miss someone new arriving.
Having everyone in local selected makes it easy to see when someone enters, even without standings set.
Itās a bit of an older approach and Iām not sure that many highsec corps or alliances teach it now, but it helps to easily pick out when someone new jumps in, because they wonāt be highlighted.
Also totally agree with you that is it trivially easy to find systems that have very low numbers in local; and that never have any loss at all (NPC or player caused) for days on end. Much easier to mine away in those systems than busier ones close to trade hubs.
Does not change my comment either, as I said one person entering local requires the miner if he wants to get out to warp out of the belt. If it was four then there would be more meaning to it. But I was not expecting you to even acknowledge that. And that is lame, ultra lame.
Most systems have passing traffic, so I repeat my comment, also most systems are along some pipe. It would mean something if it meant more than one characterā¦, and you have not said anything to counter that simple fact.
Nothing to do with busy systems or deflections like that, one character coming into local, that is all it takesā¦
Highlighting local is a well known trick that everyone I know uses. Seriously?
Mining in any system and having to notice just one catalyst entering the system is enough justification to increase EHP of mining ships. I think four is a good number to have to react too.
I feel like we just had a breakthrough that makes your motivations clear.
Essentially you want EHP added so the burden of watching local becomes less signifcant? That players shouldnt have to make a judgement on warping out if someone unknown appears in local?
Yes, in terms of making watching local actually meaningful and usefulā¦
Because having to make that judgement call on a single Catalyst is just too much.
As I keep saying:
It is just too much and pretty awfulā¦
We are never going to agree, perhaps you should go find something else to discuss, perhapsā¦
Let me add something, there is a maximum of 1,000 characters that you can keep tabs on, a lot of gankers are in NPC corps. Everyone I know who is proactive about gankers has reached that hard cap. Seriously mateā¦
and there is no possibility it has the oppossite effect? that the increased EHP just makes watching local something people dont do because they think they are safe? one or two ships cant get me ā¦ā¦im fine. Then how meaningful is local.
I dont think its a good thing that 1 person entering system can effectively be ignored. Potential threats are content & gameplay. Its just another way to encourage multiple accounts and take away choice and decision from high sec players.
That is your assumption, not mine. I had my Skiff set to 13 gankers but I would still react when a couple of gankers entered local, but mainly because I wanted to get my drones out or slip into something more able to huntā¦
its a valid counter position to the view that you are takingā¦ā¦that more EHP on ships makes local more meaningfulā¦ā¦ā¦which is also an assumption.
I do feel however my assumption is based more in reality. Do you think we wont be seeing posts about barges getting ganked because someone failed to notice 7 players appear in system if the have 4 catalysts worth of EHP? and that then sparking calls for more EHP because players still dont pay attention but its not their fault coz they just want to not pay attention 4 jumps out from Jita.
It just moves the threshold of the problem. The tools are already there for this to be a non issue. Mine somewhere less populated. The holy grail being a system with lots of rocks at the end of a pipe. No through traffic. its not difficult.
But more EHP is just easier right? Heaven forbid players accept any level of risk
Etch, I can confidently predict that, even after the current round of rumoured buffs to EHP, the very same people will still be moaning in the forums that it isnāt enough.
Some of them pretend to be even-handed about ganking, but if their repeated calls for buffs and other changes were to be heeded by CCP, and ganking were to disappear as a consequence, can you imagine the sighs of relief, the roars of triumph?
Conflict is the cornerstone of all drama; take it away, and whatās left is so bland as to be attractive to no-one, for long.
There are several existing issues, why do you think that changes to EHP will just magically solve other issues that have nothing to do with mining barge and Exhumer EHP.