Daredevil or something else?

(Alistair Atreides) #1

I have gotten over the honeymoon of pulling in OK newb isk from scanning…I want to try ratting.

Is daredevil recommended? Max DPS and some kind of tank to it? What would be the highest level missions it could handle?

What’s the return on such missions?

Is there cheaper/better alternatives?

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(Archer en Tilavine) #2

Thanks to CCP’s tiericide initiative, every ship has its place, and no ship is better or worse than any other, just different. There are very few exceptions to this rule of thumb in which one ship could be described as strictly inferior to another.

A better question would be along the lines of “is this ship/configuration appropriate for this context?”. Context, of course, includes what you’re oding, solo vs fleet, fleet composition, PVP considerations (fight back? flee? inapplicable?), what your current skill levels/budget/level of experience is (in the short term you might be better off using a less-than-ideal ship than you would down the road), etc.

(Archer en Tilavine) #3

As for the Daredevil specifically… poor choice for solo ratting. It’s more of a PVP ship (though it can be used well for high-end PVE), but more importantly it’s a ship that only shines as part of a well-composed fleet. If your fleet is too small and/or not well complemented, a Daredevil is a bit of a waste.

Even a Tristan (T1 frig) would probably be far superior to a Daredevil for solo ratting in most circumstances.

(Anderson Geten) #4

ewar in general sucks in pve, because you are against several rats and you can’t spread your ewar.

Now lets look at DD traits :

  • +50% hybrid falloff
  • +50% web str
  • +200% hybrid damage so 6 Eturrets

Let’s look at another hybrid ship, the cormorant :

  • +50 hybrid tracking
  • +50% hybrid opti
  • +50% hybrid opti

total, cormorant is 7Eturrets, +50% tracking, +125% opti
The tracking bonus is way better than opti bonus(for hybrid the +125% optimal is as good as a +350% falloff bonus ± )

Since the web str of the DD is useless in most PVE, the cormorant is superior in terms of DPS, both application, and value. Its very good range increase allows it to remove lots of tank for more DPS, while the DD need to choose between tank and DPS (especially in the lows).

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(Archer en Tilavine) #5

Theoretical damage + Precision = Actual Damage

Precision is EXTREMELY important and often overlooked by most players. Most players focus on raw DPS, overlooking the fact that without precision your actual damage will be less than half in most cases than your theoretical DPS. Target painting and webbing can help increase your precision, and weapon disruption decreases the enemy’s precision to the point of near uselessness (I do not remember if some/most/all rats are immune to weapon disruption). This is a practical example demonstrating the extent to which having some degree of (specific forms of EWAR) can, in fact, increase your throughput, solo or fleet, in PVE.

This is especially true regarding missiles and target painters: whereas precision in turrets can be enhanced with either webbing or painting, missiles have a hard limit that can only be overcome by painting (the soft limit can be overcome with either).

(Anderson Geten) #6

This does not change a thing to what I wrote.

In most cases you are faced with rats that can’t evade your damage, especially since you use long range turrets for more projection.
The DD does not need a bonus to webs to hit, because in most cases the loss in tracking is due to its own movement. A painter would be better in most cases (or actually a tracking computer)

That’s why long range weapons and missiles are better : you don’t need to orbit a target to sig tank, or if you do it does not incur a malus to hit chance (missiles).

so ewar in general is crap. Neuting, tracking disruptor, jamming, damping are almost never used(neuts and damp have almost ZERO effect), the only interesting use are on missiles BS (painter) because large missiles have crap application even vs BC, and webs+grappler on BS to allow drones to kill frigates easier.

And finally, some rats are just “invulnerable to EWar” so good luck with that …

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(Archer en Tilavine) #7

I wasn’t disagreeing with you, just pointing out that EWAR can boost DPS in PVE, even when solo. With regards to short range turrets: you can always try to match the enemy’s velocity vector to reduce the magnitude of the traversal velocity and make it easier for short range weapons to hit. This is easier once the enemy has been webbed. Target painters won’t help here because if the enemy is out of range then you won’t hit either because your weapons are short ranged. In this instance, webbers are the solution if you want to use short-range turrets.

(Anderson Geten) #8

if you are out of range of painters, you also are out of range of webs.

As I edited above,

(Archer en Tilavine) #9

In most circumstances, it’s usually the fast ships (relative to their intended targets) that use webbers. When it comes to frigs and ABs, or most subcapital ships and MWDs, this is unlikely to be an issue. Once the target is ensnared, you shred them to bits.

(Anderson Geten) #10

Or you can just kill it without waiting for it to be ensnared.

even a dedicated recon matar will give less DPS increase that a sentry dominix.

but please tell me last time you used neutralizer on the rats. Or damp. Or tracking disruptor.

(Retribution atSubZero) #11

I like the worm for low lvl stuff, the drones rip things apart. Bonus is you can rip through missions or up lvl3 plexes. I also forget you’re an alpha and put this limitation on yourself.

(Eternal Montage) #12

Daredevil in general is a pvp ship, but it can do a few of the burner missions. You could run those and then train into a garmur to hit several of the other burner missions and then round out a full burner setup.

If you’re an alpha then burners aren’t an option so maybe go for the worm so you can go abyssing.

Go battlecruiser for lvl 3s. Battlecruiser or battleship for combat sites and sleepers.

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