I totally get what you’re talking about. It is silly.
The ships you train through to get to larger ships give you an idea of how the game works, and how the ship you’re training for will behave. An Incursus is not all that different to a Thorax which is not all that different to a Megathron. Flying smaller ships first gives players valuable knowledge with low-cost losses.
But like someone mentioned before, if you go straight into a BS/dred people are going to think ‘its big, its expensive. It must kick butt’ then die to someone in a frig. They will rage and quit. They already do.
The reason i don’t care if players that pay their way into a moros and die today is; they’ve already given ccp plenty money, the instant gratification types don’t stick around anyway and it’s funny to see the stupid lose.
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I want skills to stay because my 5% bonus to ______ might give me the edge in an engagement with someone that hasn’t been training skills for as long.
Nobody talk about skill removal…
Not agree. They pretty different. And you cant get any experience in piloting mega while you piloting thorax…
No I get that, my point being I like the skill system over a traditional level-up system for those reasons. Either choice is preferable to removing skilled progression entirely
While each ship has their own signatures things and the class of ship also affects them, there are several things you can learn in frigates that still apply to battleships. Especially if you are keeping with the same racial ships.
Semper, you’re wanting to turn Eve into a game of instant gratification. Don’t even try to deny it. Eve never has been, nor ever will be that kind of game. It’s not a good idea. Instant gratification very quickly turns to boredom as once they get that ‘high’ and lose it, it will never come again. Eve is a game of long-term goals and the benefits of being patient. If the hundreds of posts in this thread haven’t made it clear by now, this is a BAD IDEA.
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I think one problem is … Semper hasn’t realized yet that “sitting in and using a particular ship” is not a well working long term goal in EvE. From my own expierience, the novelty of flying a particular ship wears off fast unless it is OP. I can fly almost all sub caps, but you rarely find me flying anything bigger than a cruiser just because I like the game fast paced, and battleships are a pain to move around and of very limited use.
It’s IMO more important to train towards professions you want to live in EvE, and pick the tools like ships from there.
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With the smaller less expensive ship you can learn things and if you lose it, it is less of a burden to replace…meaning you can go out and lose more of them and learn more.
Suppose an incursus costs 100,000 ISK, and a thorax 1,000,000 (note I am not checking prices, the prices are illustrative, don’t go stupid over incorrect prices). Now a player with 2 million ISK can afford to buy and lose 20 incursuses…incursii…whatever, he can lose 20 of them. But if he goes straight to the thorax he can lose 2. Now, after 20 incursus losses vs. 2 thorax losses in which case would the player learn more? My guess is the 20 losses. Each loss, and the successes between losses, will allow the player to learn more about the game…so when he does get decent skills to fly a thorax he’ll be a better pilot/player.
The progression is for people to learn to crawl, then walk, then run, then get on say a bicycle, then a car, etc. This suggestion is for some people to get right into the car and run it into brick wall without having even learned the rudiments of the game.
Agreed. There are not many sub-caps I cannot fly. I can also fly the archon, the thanatos, the chimera, the moros and the nagalfar…but I love being in cruisers on down.
I read this far and had a feeling there was no need to read further and was right. TBH, I knew from the title, but I felt like soaking up the salt.
If you are asking that question, then yes, your feelings and preferences are stupid as you do not even know what the ship you desire so strongly to get into right away is used for. You want to sit in a dread right away? Go right ahead, because that’s exactly what you’re going to be doing in it 95% of the time. Not to mention there’s a high likelihood that when you finally get to use it in combat you’re going to be wiped off the field by super caps. I hope it was worth your investment when you’re so new that it literally took you months at a newbro income just to get the isk just to buy it.
I can picture the salt now. The exact same tears we get when someone breaks out their CC and injects into insert capital right away then complains that they’re never used. Then lose it the first time they go into then complains about the imbalance of supers because reality didn’t match up to the image they had in their head of how that ship should be.
We have seen these people before. They quit soon after they make that exact mistake. They’ll rack up a few hundred or thousand dollars on their CC and realize they don’t have the slightly clue what to do, get discouraged and quit. My own corp has seen a player inject into a carrier because he heard it was a good mid-term goal if he wanted to rat but didn’t ask or research anything, he didn’t even tell us he injected for it or we’d have stopped him there. Proceeded to gate it 12 jumps from staging because he didn’t know how to jump and “couldn’t fit a jump portal generator” and proceeded to die almost twice, we caught him the second time when he said “not again” as he was being tackled.
If you have more money than brains, eve is not for you. If you’re too impatient to realize why you need to have patience, it’s not for you. We welcome their money, but we don’t shed a tear when they leave.
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But in a sense you are…
Moros,
You cant even sit in it without…
Capital Ship lv1, requires Adv Space cmd, an space cmd lv5
Jump Drive Operation lv1, requires: Nav 5, Science5, Warp drive operation 5
Gallente Drednought 1
Tactical Wpns Config 1
so uhm please explain without removing some of those skills or the prereqs for them, How in the hell do you get to sit/fly a Moros on day 1 with your idea?
You cant sit into a Moros because there is REQUIREMENT to the ship.
You can REMOVE requirenents but keep that skills ingame.
Im talking about requirement tab, not skills.
So if they was before they will after. Do you think that this players everywhere?
If 1/1000 want to buy titan at day 1 and lose - LET HIM, it game isnt for him.
As usual, the conversation went wrong.
You all think that by allowing a newbie to fly to something larger than a frigate from the first day, he will definitely go to buy titan.
Now there are such people and they already can do it now. And they do.
A lot of them? Do they constitute a problem?
For each departed such a beginner who will be killed in the belt and quite, there will be a dozen newbies who will remain in the game without timewall. This is a main point.
You cant learn about “how to fly Mega” while you flying thorax. Its different dynamics, its different feeling and capabilites.
And you tellimg me that i dont know about Eve? Guys that talking about how damn same to fly BS and Cruis? For real? Do you ever undock?
Whole topic you are only talking about how people will leave because of they invest $ and get killed.
Why not to talk about people that will stay because they dont need to wait 30 days before they can fly Mega if they want?
Once damn thing again: requirement tab and that mechanic do not allow you to get experience of a ship BEFORE you can drive it.
You will never learn how to drive a car while riding bicycle. Just NEVER.
You god damn right. And can you imagine what stats will have ship if you could drive it without this skills?
Moros literally cant jump. Its a flying brick.
Requirements and “wish of effectivness” do THE SAME THING but in different way:
- Requirements just block your access.
- Effectivness work through your choice. If you want fly uneffective ship, you can. But want you?
Incidentally, you also are running into a major code issue here. Utterly ignoring the myriad of good reasons why your suggestion is bad and misunderstands EVE ship progression.
Requirements to fly a ship are needed in order to give skill bonuses to the ship the way EVE is coded.
Removing requirements would therefore require them to utterly recode that part of the DOGMA engine to look up the skills without them being listed in requirements, and would also break the links in all the skills which tell you what ship/module you get access to.
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But you will learn a lot about how to move in the road traffic, about the rules, and maybe by doing so, you figure out riding a bicycle is so much fun, you don’t need a car…
… btw, in most countries of the world you need to pass a test to get your car drivers license.
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false, I know people that’s have played this game for a long while and they still can not accomplish some of the most simple task or fail horribly on simple things.
There was a typo. I fixed it for you.
How about you tell them to go on Singularity and go nuts with them shippies?
And then still wait on TQ. Brilliant!
Rather arrogant statement