Faction Warfare is dead, long live our robot overlords

So does anybody have an estimate of just how many Atron-bots are running in FW at any given time?

I made 60 mil in loot last night just from winning a couple of fights, in about 40min.

Not my fault some people refuse to get good and prefer to rely on the game’s crutches.

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My understanding is that the OP/thread is directed towards the manner in which cheap Alpha Atron bots are basically making FW unviable for ‘real’ players to have any significant effect.

This is actually the first of the ‘Alpha bot’ issues that I’ve seen that looks like an actual problem. (The ‘L4 missioning Alpha bots’ and the ‘Null VNI alpha bots’ being mostly a smokescreen/excuse for other things.)

Haven’t read everything, but the answers seem to range from “make FW unprofitable” (which is pointless, since then nobody would run it - see Resouce Wars) to “fix FW completely” (which is unlikely, since CCP doesn’t have much of a handle on fixing anything fundamentally wrong with EVE).

However, if the actual issue is Alpha Atron hordes, it seems it would certainly be practical to simply award Alpha accounts with 1/2 or even 1/4 of the LP rewards of an Omega account. Alphas could still try out FW, it would still be profitable, it just wouldn’t be so profitable for free Alpha bots.

If FW Atron-botting is profitable enough that bots will pay/plex for Omega accounts to keep running it, then the problem goes a little deeper.

What if, instead of earning LP by d-plex/o-plexing, players earned ‘System X Defense Points’ and ‘System X Offense Points’? Then make it so you can only cash in System X Defense Points when the system is owned by the enemy (you defend to keep it, but when it flips to the enemy, you get paid for your defense efforts). You cash in System X Offense Points when the system becomes yours.

You cash the Defense/Offense points in for the same LP you get now, can even toss in the ‘Alphas get less in exchange’ wrinkle again. Now, you can’t oscillate the systems between 0% and 100%, you have to actually attack and flip the system. Which means somebody’s fighting. It also means all the people who have points to cash in have incentive to actually take a system.

So the only ‘new thing’ needed is tracking Offense/Defense points by system, and a cash-in menu that checks to see what state the system is in (ours or theirs) before offering an exchange.

Even CCP might be able to code that without breaking things too much.

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Sounds reasonable.

@CCP_Rise, @CCP_Falcon ?

Banning ventures will have little effect, cheaply fitted frigates will just replace them.

Better tiny drop in ocean of needs than nothing. Issue with ventures was it traits.

Ventures are used because they have +2 core strength, and WCS fitted ships can’t capture plexes. Surely the triple cancer patient will agree that removing an ingrown nail is an improvement, won’t him?

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It changes, there are solo bots that have been going for years but the large batches of them usually get caught within a few months.

They aren’t actually that bad because at least you know what a venture is like but a combat frigate that might be stabbed potentially might not be when you land with 3 scrams fitted and find it has decided to be fully armed this time and oh look it didn’t warp off.

TERRIBLE idea.

FW is a gateway into PvP for many new pilots. If you make it completely unprofitable it is not even worth it and FW will be even more dead.

One word for you: Clueless.

You can go PvP without joining FW for “fun”. If FW is not profitable, you don’t have to join it for “loot” or “fun”.

Before you comment on something, you should probably have at least a minimum of an idea of how the thing you are commenting on works.

All the Alpha FW bots are not earning LP by PvPing. They are earning it by plexing and other bottable tasks, and they specifically avoid PvP. So if you want to limit alpha FW bots, you decrease by a large amount the LP paid out to Alpha accounts (or even all accounts) for plexing, and you increase the LP paid out for PvPing. You also tie the value of the PvP LP rewards to ‘destroyed value’, so they can’t game it. Thus, you specifically cripple bots, and you specifically reward meaningful PvP.

There is also a difference between making something less profitable, and making it “completely unprofitable”. Well, unless you are running a bunch of Alpha FW bots I guess; then sure, it would be pretty annoying to have your cash cow crippled.

r/wooosh

You didn’t understand a single word I wrote. And it was not that many words. I suggest you read it again.

It does not seem to me that you play any FW.

If you only get meaningful LP from actual PvP the isk per hour would be so low it would not be worth it. Because people will still not go into fights they have no chance of winning and roaming for 1 hour without a fight means = 0 ISK per hour in income.

You sincerely believe there will be a massive increase in fights because you get more LP from it? l.o.l

The people who PvP in FW already do it, with the bad payout. It will not change anything.

And I again, let me repeat myself since you didn’t understand the first paragraph. You will cripple alpha pilots (non-bots). Because they are already nerfed and can barely kill anything. Decimating their income that they get from plexing when they can’t win fights.

PvP in Eve has never been profitable. You make money by other activities to lose money in PvP.

Nah I understood your post just fine.

I understand that saying “we must preserve FW as is because it is the gateway into PvP for many new pilots” and mixing that with “but Alpha pilots can’t and don’t PvP because they can’t win, so we must preserve plexing payouts” is the mark of someone who is either seriously confused, or has a “pay me LP for plexing” agenda. You know, like somebody who runs a bunch of plex-bots would.

I understand that having FW be the home of hundreds of Alpha Atron bots that ruin the entire mechanic for everyone else and also can’t be PvPed (in general), to the extent that almost nobody plays it anymore, means it is pointless to even offer FW to new players because they will either hate it, mindlessly farm it, or learn to do what everyone else is doing and bot it.

There’s no value to the game in keeping FW as is. That being the whole point of the thread, which I guess just /whooshed right past you.

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r/whooosh again.

When did I say keep it as is?

I said your idea was garbage. and it still is.

Read before you post.

robot

and where now is that idiot CSM Swetonia who not long ago written how EPIC and fun militia is?

Am just about to start having a go at Amarr faction warfare, will have to see what I find there.

Though the fact that it was once fun may mean it will be again.

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