Fix the multiboxing gank problems!

[Zaera_Keena]

You can bypass that by using multiple VPN tunnels

[Ramona_McCandless]

Probably missed this in the blah blah but

I assume the OP is ok with banning multibox miners too?

@Vokan_Narkar

Everyone is multiboxing these days

Oh yeah so I see

Ban complaining about multiboxing

Then no one sad

[Glenduil]

Yep. Which is why it isn’t enforceable.

[Syzygium]

not this stupid discussion again… Can IT newbies please stop throwing around buzzwords about VPNs and VMs? That crap can protect you from what a website might track and collect about you, because that website has absolutely limited access to your data (and you can even easily control what it sees).

A client software (which can easily come with a kernel-implementation like the latest CoD variants), has magnitudes deeper access to your machine. It can hardware-fingerprint the computer, even make software snapshots and its components and no matter how many VPNs or VMs you use, unless you randomly spoof each and all hardware components and software installations down to the serial numbers of a chipset fan, you WILL be a 100% safe identifyable for the server.

To enforce a 1-machine-1-account policy is one of the easiest things to do if the provider would really want to do it. Mainly because the goal isn’t really to prevent 100% of the abuse, but make it so hard and risky (lose your chars to a ban) that like 99.9% of the users won’t even try it. And the remaining 5 cracknerds simply have no impact any more or get caught via meta-information because they brag about it in chats or social media.

[Meridan_Night]

@Syzygium

I am importing and exporting Citadels + Fits in DSTs and Orcas into WH space from and to Jita on a regular basis.

I’d like to see you take your citadel + fit in a DST through Uedama right now. You’ll probably get through carrying an Astrahus, but with a Fortizar it’s doubtful:

[Glenduil]

Not true not true not true.

If any of that was true about the EVE client, every bot would be detected and banned instantly.

The software client doesn’t get to scan my computer, gather data on each and every program I have running, take snapshots of all my hardware including serial numbers of my CPU cooler (seriously ROFL)

You’re going to have to stop taking those crazy pills.

[Gloria_Exercitus]

@Syzygium

But no one can prove that. I personally would like an EVE online where you can’t (and don’t need to) multibox, with 50.000 or 100.000 real players online instead of 20k with tons of alts. But from the current position, as much as I would like it, I see no way to revert all those past decision. If they would cut down multiboxing now, in the hope to gain more single-account players from a better gaming expierience, at first they would probably lose 50% of their paying customers. At least. And then it’s an open bet if they can survive if the player rates go up again, this time by truly single-account players who are attracted to a then “better” game. Risky risky. I don’t think I could convince my CEO to do that. -_-

Bah ! Multiboxing is an invented ‘problem’….manufactured by bored people who just have to have something to whine about.

It’s reached the truly absurd level where people conjure up ‘100 man multibox fleets’ and try to maintain a straight face. Or they invent fictitious stats claiming that 3/4 of the ‘current players’ are multiboxed….despite never offering the slightest evidence for this.

The whole thing spirals as everyone just repeats everyone else’s BS and adds to it.

[Gloria_Exercitus]

@Glenduil

The software client doesn’t get to scan my computer, gather data on each and every program I have running, take snapshots of all my hardware including serial numbers of my CPU cooler (seriously ROFL)

Er….actually you can be identified by the unique ID number of your processor, and a whole bunch of other stuff. It can know your hardware configuration, operating system, network information, and so on.

Haven’t you ever done one of those Steam surveys where it pretty much lists everything including what you had for breakfast ? It’s all information that ‘can’ be gathered….I think with Steam you have to give permission, but I suspect with many MMORPGs and other games its there in the small print.

[Zaera_Keena]

@Syzygium

Can IT newbies please stop throwing around buzzwords about VPNs and VMs

Well as Zaera designed and managed the IT system for her company, you have just set the bar pretty high for IT Newbies.

[Syzygium]

Then you should know better. Download any “Hardware Check” Program, and see how deep the rabbit hole goes. They can detect goddamn serial numbers of your RAM bars. And they are not using magic, if they can, the EVE client can. And unless you actually know for sure which part(s) of your hardware configuration the client actually uses to identify your machine, you cannot know where to spoof random numbers into a pretty complicated VM-setup to cheat those detection methods.

You’d basically need decompile the client software tho check exactly which data is used for the identity check and then exactly spoof that on your VM. And CCP could just change that each day with the patch if they want.

As said: VMs and VPNs can make you unidentifyable for remote-trackers like websites who collect data and try to build a profile. Because that data is very restricted, it is known and can be intentionally falsified. If you have the knowledge you claim to have, you should know all that.

There is no single way you can hide your computer from identification if you allow an .exe file from a smart programmer running on it.

And, main point: Even if YOU could, or someone could, 99.9% of the casual players couldn’t. Or wouldn’t risk it. And that alone solves the identification problem.

[Glenduil]

@Gloria_Exercitus

Er….actually you can be identified by the unique ID number of your processor, and a whole bunch of other stuff. It can know your hardware configuration, operating system, network information, and so on.

Not without running in administrator mode. EVE client doesn’t get those permissions.

[Glenduil]

@Syzygium

Then you should know better. Download any “Hardware Check” Program, and see how deep the rabbit hole goes. T

They run as administrator. I use a program that does do a deep dive into my system and I personally gave it the required permissions to do so. EVE client does not have those rights. If it ever tried to get those rights, I’d uninstall the game.

[Zaera_Keena]

@Syzygium

They can detect goddamn serial numbers of your RAM bars. And they are not using magic, if they can, the EVE client can

So you saying that if ran EVE on a virtual windows instance in a windows server cloud, the serial numbers of the virtual server’s RAM could be detected even though the hardware is a black box?

[Glenduil]

That’s what he’s saying. Apparently, CCP is the spyware capital of the world capable of stripping your computer’s entire identity without Administrator rights or even without tripping ANY of our extensive defensive detection software.

[Vokan_Narkar]

That is ultra easy. All you need to do is to avoid systems they are scanning or use cloak trick.

Hell I autopilotted a Bager with 1b cargo via Sivala and Uedama not so long ago. I simply set the route to avoid Kassigainen via Unel > Iivinen and then continue via Ikao → Sarekuwa and parked it at the second 4-4 station, not tradehub and it survived. (Not that I would do it with 10b )

[Meridan_Night]

@Vokan_Narkar

I simply set the route to avoid Kassigainen via Unel > Iivinen

I think I have had Kassigainen/Hatakani on avoidance list since 2010. Or something in the environs.

Cloak trick will work unless you have the terrible luck of coming out of jump cloak within 2k of something. Doesn’t happen often, but it does rarely take place.

[Gerard_Amatin]

@Syzygium

To enforce a 1-machine-1-account policy is one of the easiest things to do if the provider would really want to do it.

Such checks would be rather invasive though, which could put off a lot of (potential) players.

Also this doesn’t stop people from logging in their alt on a separate laptop.

But I agree that CCP could do a lot more against multiboxing if they wanted.

[Meona_Sherie]

@Glenduil

The main market is the only dangerous place in high sec

It is not. I haven’t had any problem so far.

[Gerard_Amatin]

@Vuhdo_Rin

if you think your “list of ships” should be a flex then i have to say to you : NO ITS NOT ! this is only a tiny hangar … still my hangar is very tiny and i have about 380b worth of ships

Funny, I tend to flex how small and efficient my hangar is.

I like being able to pack up and move all my stuff in the least amount of time whenever my alliance does their unannounced annual moveop to another region in null sec.

If I have a ship without an immediate purpose in my gameplay I sell it.

I make it a challenge to fit all my PvE tools within one ship.

[Spacetramp_Drago]

@Vokan_Narkar

Everyone is multiboxing these days,

Nope, not everyone.