For new players getting negative faction standings with half the Empire AND losing SS are not minor consequences. And while the former is logical and understandable, the latter one is not so much.
Boo hoo. It’s a minor consequence in a game where alts exist and it’s easily fixed for ISK. If someone can’t even cope with such a minor obstacle then they aren’t going to succeed in EVE.
And yes, it is logical and understandable. You shoot first against a non-criminal target, you get a sec status penalty. The rule is applied consistently everywhere in EVE. You’re the one who wants to make it less logical and understandable, making a special snowflake exception to the standard rules to cover the one situation where you don’t like having consequences.
in a military installation as a member of that military. If you dont want suspect status and are against more PvP including newer players… lests just forbid warping in FW plexes for any capsuleer not involved in FW. Easy.
Doesn’t matter. Nowhere else in the game does the flag mechanic account for being in “your own” space. No special snowflake exceptions.
If you dont want suspect status and are against more PvP including newer players… lests just forbid warping in FW plexes for any capsuleer not involved in FW. Easy.
No. No private instances in EVE.
CCP did exactly that for Abyss filaments. The did remove it after a while, but precedent has been set: you jump the special gate - you get suspect timer.
Abyss. 
It’s a stupid precedent and everything related to the abyss idiocy needs to be removed from the game.
Opinions are like assholes: everyone has one, but everybody thinks that every one else’s stinks.
The idiocy of the abyss mechanic is not an opinion, it’s fact. Adding instanced PvP in a game where “one universe” is a fundamental design concept is a profoundly stupid thing to do.
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Food for thought: Faction Warfare is modelled less after real world militaries and more after 18th and 19th century Privateering.
In a nutshell: Privateers were “civilians” fighting for a side of their choosing against specified targets (see: other countries militaries and privateers that sided with said country) with their own crews and equipment.
All privateers were still beholden to the same rules of engagement that non-military ships of the time were held to (see: you can’t attack “neutrals” unless they attacked first).
As a person in Faction Warfare you are not a soldier. You are simply a “legal” pirate fighting a proxy war for an empire.
.
Anyways… I’m going to say no to this propal. Creating mechanics based on “intent” alone is a dangerous thing. People game such rules and those in favor of them often want to expand them into every aspect of game… which causes more issues down the line.
I don’t know how this idea will be gamed… but I guarantee you it will.
A casual stroll through EVE’s history pretty much proves this.
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That was pretty interesting overall post, but I can’t think of any cases where privateers earned individual military ranks as they do in FW. I think the analogy is much better for standard non-FW players running missions.
And look, big surprise, you make no logical argument at all since we’re discussing rules about what happens in that sandbox. (one by the way which has all sorts of ccp imposed rules–“sandbox” is a good marketing slogan–but far from reality.)
Whatever that ■■■■■■■■ response means, lol.
Bottom line the gate takes you to normal space, not some made up ■■■■■■■■ WoW Clone Arena.
If you can’t hang in low sec then you don’t belong in FW.
Next these bears will want to limit the number of ships that can gate in as well so it is “fair”.
Wrong game, go play WoW.
Actually it doesn’t. Or one could cyno (in LS or NS) there, warp between objects > 150km etc. Again you’re deflecting.
"Next these bears " more personal attacks (because you can’t come up with real arguments?) and wrongly directed because the target audiance in this case does PVP by design and for their eve living. (never played WOW)
Deflecting.
It is a stupid idea that ruins some of the best PvP in low sec.
Is that clear enough for you?
-1
2 wrongs don’t make a right.
Raised in a test tube?
The “military ranking” that players can achieve in FW carries about the same weight as a “gold sticker.” 
I don’t know about you, but I consider them to be more akin to “honorary ranks” than actual ranks (see: the NPC Factions give you a title to make you feel special, but you are no more valuable than any of the other bloodthirsty “Eggers” that are contracted out to kill the enemy).
In fact, when I was in FW, a lot of people with “high ranks” became the butt end of jokes. Because to earn those ranks one had to spend most of their time doing complexes and missions rather than killing other players.
Loss of security status was almost a badge of honor and a symbol that you were in FW to blow stuff up.
But all this is neither here nor there.
At the end of the day…
- Designing rules based on intent WILL cause issues down the line.
- Losing Security Status is not that big a deal. Simply avoid destroying pods and hunt the odd Mordus Legion NPCs for tags.
- Pirates were in low-sec LONG there before Faction Warfare existed. From their perspective, YOU are the neutral and the complexes are in THEIR space (NPC Faction claims notwithstanding). You don’t get special rules of engagement to make your life easier against them… because they don’t have any special rules aiding them.
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I think a lot of the disagreement comes down to that. Even for this old player who’s running out of stuff to train I’d like to try who can kill rats BSs in seconds for max security increases–it’s a huge PITA. For a newer player who joined FW who takes many minutes to do the same, it’s a huge deterrent from joining the PVP side of FW (IMO the missions should probably go away–but that’s another thread).
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CONCORD and Gate Guns, and Station Guns, do not attack people for scooping loot or jetcans that do not belong to them right now. CONCORD, Gate Guns, and Station Guns, will fire upon you if you attack someone who is not suspect or criminal.
CONCORD, Gate Guns, and Station Guns, should not attack someone for entering a FW site.
CONCORD, Gate Guns, and Station Guns, should attack someone for attacking someone they’re not at war with, nor isn’t criminal, nor suspect.
I’m suggesting that entering a FW site should be the same as scooping loot or a jetcan that doesn’t belong to you, with the gate being like a can owned by people who are signed up for FW. That’s it.
You wouldn’t be flagged suspect to everyone, only those who are in FW.
Because, entering a FW Base or beacon, is signing up for a fight.
Because, if you’re not in FW, you literally have no other reason to be there, then to fight.
So let me get this straight:
I, a neutral player, enter a Caldari FW plex and get flagged for accessing a gate owned by the Caldari.
A Gallente FW player, sworn enemy of the Caldari that must be killed on site, enters that same FW plex and gets no flag.
You honestly think that a neutral should be given more of a punishment than a member of the enemy faction?
You wouldn’t be flagged suspect to everyone, only those who are in FW.
Flags don’t work that way. Although it’s nice to see that you finally understand that your original idea was fatally flawed and acknowledge that getting flagged to non-FW players for “trespassing” in a FW plex was really stupid.
Because, if you’re not in FW, you literally have no other reason to be there, then to fight.
If you enter my mission you have literally no other reason to be there, then to fight or steal. And yet you are not flagged for entering my mission and I can not shoot you. A flag only happens once you actually attack me or steal my loot. So why should FW get special snowflake rules?
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